quality sub setup

bMwman112 · January 2005

Hello all,
I have a BMW M-Series convertible, and I am looking to outfit it with sub woofer(s). It is already equipped with most excellent component speakers in the front; my father purchased them for me - I believe that they are the CDT EuroSport Z-Series, the competition kind (http://www.cdtaudio.com/eurosport_zseries.htm). In any case, I am searching for appropriate sub woofers to match. I am not knowledgeable enough to choose a company, nor do I know what is available, and so I am completely at a loss. Does anyone know where I can begin my search? Do you need any other information for an appropriate reccomendation? Thank you for any help you can provide.

-Timothy

MacLeod · January 2005

Yeah, those are pretty good components so youre set with those.

As for a sub, I would say check out one of these. Stick it in a sealed box with .88 internal volume and mount it in your trunk.

Then how about one of these to power it.

This will be a good bit of bass at over 800 watts so if youre not running an amp to your components you will probably want to.

bMwman112 · January 2005

MacLeod,
I appreciate the speedy response. The MM2124DVC model that you suggested seems rather less expensive than I had intended. The boot is very robustly constructed, and the volume level at speed when the roof is stored away is quite impressive. Is there a sub woofer or sub woofer pair in the 180 to 320 pound total (approximately 350 to 600 dollars total, I believe) range that can overcome this substantial noise and match the sonic performance of the speakers I currently own? I am not interested in announcing my presence to all, but I would like a pleasant balance in the sound.

Mr Leod,
I looked at my amplifier, and it is a Zapco Reference 750.2 (http://www.zapco.com/prod/ref_prods/7502Frame.htm). I failed to mention my amplification requirement in my initial writing. For the same requirements as above, what sort of amplifier should I choose? I appreciate your patience as I search for the perfect combination. As above, the amplification need not be excessive, merely enough to be appropriately balanced, even at speed.

-Timothy

Joelsbass · January 2005

well since it seems that you're definately putting quality above cost let me make a couple recomendations.

1. to run what i'm about to suggest you WILL need a better alternator. track down an Ohio Generator representative and see what they have to offer for your vehicle. you'll need to upgrade the factory wiring from the alt to the battery and install a second battery in the trunk (or you can check out alumapro url]www.alumapro.com[/url they offer a 15farad capacitor that's supposed to be the equivalent of an optima yellow top, i need to check out the specs more before i'll stand by them personally but they're worth looking into)

2. You will have verry little to no trunk space left...

3. Here's the gear
-Subs
2 10" adire brahma's... look at www.adireaudio.com for specs and you can order them from sound-foundations.us
These arn't the most expensive but they are very loud and have great sound quality.

-amp
I'd reccomend the US Amps USA-2000 check it out at www.usamps.com and it can be ordered from www.speedsound.com
it's a high quality amp from a respected manufacturer (made in the good old USA to boot) and it exherts good controll over the sub.

put the subs in a .5ft^3 box (that's .5ft^3 per sub.) which will put them where they want 1000w per sub which is what that amp will be putting out. The subs have dual 2ohm voice coils so you'd bridge each sub in series taking it up to 4 ohms (per sub) and then bridge the two subs in parallel to the amp taking it down to 2ohms where the amp will be running 2000w total.

If you can fit it and get an alternator that can generate the power it'll be plenty loud enough to hear over the road noise.

bMwman112 · January 2005

Thank you, Joelsbass. I have seen these brahmas reccommended many times elsewhere on this forum. Has anyone had personal experience with them? The same question could be asked for the amplifier; does anyone here have personal experience using this product? Are there any equivalent sub woofers? If it is possible, I would like to have some trunk space remaining, if possible under the above requirements (a note on this is included below). Is there perhaps one high-performance sub woofer that can perform all of these duties? I have doubts about the reliability of the US-made amplifier, are they proven?

The boot is a 260 litre compartment; this converts to approximately 9.1 cubic feet. Would a 1 cubic foot box take up most of this space?

exalted512 · January 2005

I have 2 brahmas in my truck. How much bass do you want? A single brahma with 1500 watts is LOUD. Even in a sealed box. They are among the best subs in the world. Comparable would be the JL W7(way overpriced), the RE ****(better in ported), the Treo SX???(i think its the SX...).
For sealed, I'd get a brahma. you can get them at www.sound-foundations.us
For ported I'd go with the ****.
USAmps are among the best amps out there. Not super high end like Genesis, tru tech, etc. but along the lines of Zapco. the build quality is excellent without a doubt. in fact, my next amps might be USAmps.
-Cody

Joelsbass · January 2005

The amp that i reccomended is the one that i am planning on buying (the whole setup actually) It has a higher Dampening factor and slew rate than most other amps in the price/power range (both specs demonstrate the controll exherted over the sub to put it in general terms) and it has a very low THD (total harmonic distortion) at i believe .006% (this is incredibly low, and i doubt you'd find lower) at the price (1000-1300 depending on where you buy it) i doubt you could find a better 2000watt amp, heck i doubt you could find better under 2 grand. These amps are hand assembled and exhibit excelent craftsmanship.

I currently own their TU-600 (150x2 tube amplifier) and use it to run my front speakers (Polk audio MM6 component set) and have been nothing but happy with this amp.

If you want to use less space i'd say go with a single 12"brahma. the main reason i was saying you'd be out of trunk space is that unless you want to do a lot of custom work... amp rack etc... you're going to have 2 amps (the usamps one is large too) a pair of subs and either a battery or a high farad capacitor. Get it installed properly and you should still have some trunk space though...

AustinKP · January 2005

I'll back up the previous recommendations. USAmps is a very high-end company that you'll definitely be happy with. They are on-par with Zapco's reference series of amps. I'm not sure you could find better than a brahma, and definitely not in the price range you set. If I had the money, I'd get something along these lines. Heck, if money was no object, I'd still probably get a Brahma or ****.

Based on what you've said, I don't think you'll need or want more than a single 10 or 12. Also, you wouldn't need to get such a large amp so you could save some space. If it is installed well, you should still have some usable trunk space. Like MacLeod said, if you're going to get an amp over 1000 watts, you'll probably want an upgraded alternator.

-Austin

MacLeod · January 2005

OK. Well since we're talking the big leagues I have a couple suggestions.

First, for big power and great SQ I will recommend this ID MAX which will pound really hard and still sound very good.

To power it, youll need at least 1000 watts so in the "money dont mean ****" category, Ill say this Xtant X1001. I personally think Xtant are the best amps on the market and this one will easily make 1000 watts RMS all day long, but it does cost 1000 bones!

Actually since youve already got a Zapco running your front stage, why not stick with one for the subs. This one makes plenty of power to push the ID MAX and your amps will match. Personally I dont like to mix amps so this may be the way you want to go.

Other subs I really like for lots of power and sound are the JL Audio 12W7 which dispite all the naysayers, is one HELL of a badass sub.

For sheer db level you cant beat the Orion H2.

Now the suggestions the other guys are giving are just as good. Im just merely offering some other options.

bMwman112 · January 2005

I thank everyone for the replies and will check into all of the mentioned products. I will continue to look at this 'thread' to ascertain the prescence of any new thoughts, but my query has been sufficiently answered. Again, thank you.

-Timothy

MacLeod · January 2005

Let us know what you finally decide on.

Joelsbass · January 2005

Timothy, you sound very well educated by your responses, i'm curious what you do? that and i'd be willing to make an educated guess judging by your vehicle and the fact that your father bought you an $800 component set, that you might be among this countries blue-blooded families??

feel free not to answer if you don't feel comfortable, i'm just a creature ruled by my curiosity

probably why i'm going into psychology, people will pay me to learn about them lol

bMwman112 · January 2005

Joelsbass,
I am actually still a student; I currently attend the University of Cambridge to read physics and maths, but am on a holiday of sorts at the moment. My father works for the SIS, what you may know as MI6; beyond that, I have no idea why we are here for the time being. We did bring three of our vehicles along, so I am assuming that we will be staying for some time, and under that assumption I've decided to purchase some American auto modifications. I don't mind at all answering questions - I suppose this doesn't make me the best subject upon which to test your skills as a psychologist. And I end with a question - what is the meaning of "blue-blooded"? I've become accustomed to many new slang terms, but this remains unfamiliar to me.

Mr Leod,
I will let you know what I decide on, it should not be too long; all that remains for me to do is listen to the mentioned products and choose one.

Joelsbass · January 2005

a blue-blood is often also called 'old money' or a WASP (white anglo-saxon protestant). They are typically among the rich of the rich in American and can often trace their families back to this countries origional settlers. The Kenedy's for instance are blue-bloods, as are the Trumps. More often than not (you being one of the exceptions) someone driving a car like yours who's father buys them a set of speakers like that will fit into this group, which is why i asked.

So is your dad a field agent or does he work in the offices?

Dude!!! his dad's Bond!!!!

MacLeod · January 2005

Cambridge?!

Cool! You ever meet Prof Hawking?

bMwman112 · January 2005

Joelsbass,
I suppose that we could be considered 'old money' in that we have a rather old estate near Bath, but not to the extent of the Kennedy or the Trump family. I have to assume that my father is a field agent, as we do a significant amount of travelling, but we are discouraged from asking questions about his work, and so I know only a little beyond this.

Mr Leod,
I have in fact met the great professor. In addition to attending several of his lectures, a group of students at my level was once granted an audience over tea with Dr Hawking. Fascinating talk, that.

-Timothy

MacLeod · January 2005

Originally posted by bMwman112

Mr Leod,
I have in fact met the great professor. In addition to attending several of his lectures, a group of students at my level was once granted an audience over tea with Dr Hawking. Fascinating talk, that.

-Timothy

Thats MACLEOD.

Man that is just awesome! I am a great admirer of his work, although it is way beyond my comprehension. And I mean waaaay beyond. Although Ive been interested in cosmology for a long time I only have a basic understanding of it.

Ive read all his books and 'A Brief History of Time' is about my favorite alltime book. I personally think he's the greatest scientific mind of our time and possibily ever!

Man, that is just so cool that youve got to sit with him! Im jealous as hell!

neomagus00 · February 2005

whoa, this dude met hawkings?!?! where'd he go, he'd probably like the physics thread we had a bit back?

MacLeod · February 2005

LOL! Yeah but I got a feeling he would have ripped us a new one!

exalted512 · February 2005

Originally posted by bMwman112
Fascinating talk, that.

-Timothy

honestly, who says that?
-Cody

Looped · February 2005

lol Cody.
I say rip all that $$$ gear out, sell it on Ebay. Go to Walmart and indulge in some orange faced Audiovox equipment. Take the leftover dough and hire a private investigator to find out what your dad really does........

mbdyer12 · February 2005

None other than James Bond's son, of course.

spwuinmk67 · February 2005

Did I miss something here?

mbdyer12 · March 2005

Yeah. Hell froze over and we're all Satan's offspring here to bring about the apocalypse...and bump da phat tunes on Pyle coaxials and Funkypup woofers!

Everyone dance!

neomagus00 · March 2005

rotfl... i just had to read that in the middle of a calc lecture, and the teacher is staring at me kinda funny cause i'm trying to hold my laughter in, and it probably looks like i'm choking!

that, my friend, made my day...

oh, and spunky - this bmw guy seems to be the son of a secret agent, but he's up and disappeared, so who knows...

MacLeod · March 2005

Originally posted by exalted512
honestly, who says that?
-Cody

English people old chum!

England is cool.

bMwman112 · March 2005

Mr Exalted:
I am indeed British, as MacLeod has said.

To update those that assisted me with my subwoofer selection: I listened to all of the subwoofers mentioned, as well as a significant number of other products, and my final decision was the Diamond Audio D912D2 (two units), together amplified by a TruTechnology C-7.2. This model of subwoofer has just been released, and is as such unproven, but the reputation of the company and the scarcity of the newest model convinced me it was a worthwhile purchase (I purchased these on my own; the component speakers were a birthday gift). I chose the TruTechnology amplifier for the same reasons.

A few miscellaneous comments remain.

MacLeod:
Your interest lies in cosmology? While it is an intriguing subject itself, I find that discovering the link between it and quantum physics - namely through the various theories of quantum gravity - to be much more engrossing. Conveniently, this is my primary subject of study.

Mr Dyer:
I do not believe that my father is James Bond, but the likelihood of his being an agent of that sort is high. Of this, I am not certain, but there are several subtle facts that lead me to conclude that this is indeed the case.

Mr Looped:
If my father is such an agent, the personal danger to a private investigator would be quite high, and I would not want to put anyone in such a position for something as trivial as this. My father serves his country as he sees fit, and that is sufficient for me. As a note, I have thought of hiring such an investigator, but the above chain of reasoning has thus far prevented me form doing so; in addition, the person that hires such an investigator would be in significant danger as well, should my hypothesis prove correct.

In any case, the installation went smoothly, with the drivers being mounted in fiberglass containers in the corners of the boot, with the amplifiers on an aluminium rack between the containers. Three farads of capacitance were installed, as was a custom-made alternator.

Looped · March 2005

Awesome. My subs sit in particle board, but it's really nice particle board. I like my subs shaken, not stirred. Good luck to you

MacLeod · March 2005

Glad to hear you got it squared away.

Yes, Im primarily interested in cosmology but I think its mainly because its easier to look at a black hole and go "that so cool" than trying to figure out Schroedinger's Cat or the Uncertainty Principle!

quality sub setup

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