Demo amp price

jmierzur
jmierzur Posts: 489
edited January 2005 in Electronics
I have considered updating my two channel amp for some time. A local retailer has a demo Sim Audio W-3 amp he is willing to sell at this point. What would be a fair price for the 'demo' amp if its retail was about $4k CDN?
Post edited by jmierzur on
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    Any guesses bases on previous purchases?
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited January 2005
    Orion

    SIMAUDIO
    PWR, MOON W- 3

    Description: BALANCED INPUTS, 8 BIPOLAR DEVICES PER CHANNEL

    Manufacture Years: 1998 - Current

    Additional Information:
    Power: 120

    Retail
    MSRP: $3,300.00
    USED: $1,400.00
    Wholesale
    Mint: $950.00
    Average: $650.00
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
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  • Emlyn
    Emlyn Posts: 4,536
    edited January 2005
    I think it would depend on a number of things:

    Whether one has bought something of high value from a salesman at the store before, or is just a walk-in customer.

    What cosmetic condition the demo item is in.

    What prices comparable items have sold for on Audiogon recently.

    What the local competitive market is like.

    Generally, I'd think a demo would be listed at 10 percent off full retail. Depending on a number of factors, haggling included, I'd guess the dealer may sell for as much as 30 percent off if the item has a factory warranty. If the demo is beat up a little and doesn't convey with a warranty it should sell for less.
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited January 2005
    Audiogon

    $2090.00 High


    $1640.00 Last


    $1210.00 Low


    $1470.00 Average
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    Thank you gentlemen.

    The unit looks in mint condition without any marks. I can get it for 25% off retail. Think I might wait and keep looking on Agon.
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  • LuSh
    LuSh Posts: 887
    edited January 2005
    I own a SimAudio i-5080 intergrated amp. If I were to upgrade to separates it would be to a SimAudio W5 amp and a copland preamp.

    I plan on keeping my SimAudio for a while, or untill I can find a deal on an i-5. SimAudio stuff is great, doesn't get in the way of the music and imho is alot better then the jagged Bryston stuff. Many consider the W5 (the W3's big brother) one of the best power amps ever made regardless of price. I've seen a W3 sell for as low as $1300 on canuckaudiomart.ca
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    Originally posted by LuSh
    I own a SimAudio i-5080 intergrated amp. If I were to upgrade to separates it would be to a SimAudio W5 amp and a copland preamp.

    I plan on keeping my SimAudio for a while, or untill I can find a deal on an i-5. SimAudio stuff is great, doesn't get in the way of the music and imho is alot better then the jagged Bryston stuff. Many consider the W5 (the W3's big brother) one of the best power amps ever made regardless of price. I've seen a W3 sell for as low as $1300 on canuckaudiomart.ca

    Thank you very much for the link. I will be checking there often.

    Don't need a W-5 for the room; would be nice though. I perferred the Sim over the ML, Bryston and Krell amps he had in the room.

    The retailer had a P-5 LE and W-5 LE combo for a long time. I can not describe how good that drived any speakers (esp. some Wilson Maxx) he had in that room. Amazing components.

    Edit;

    I checked the link and found a W-5 for almost the same price as the W-3 from the retailer. Will definately be checking the site more often. Once again, thanks.
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  • LuSh
    LuSh Posts: 887
    edited January 2005
    np. The W5 is a reference amp. UHF has used it as their reference for years now. I've bought most of my stuff used. And I will continue, I try not to waste dealers time too much if I don't have too. I've been fortunate with buying used. I've had time to experiement even with used equipment. You live in Alberta Canada, if you're in Calgary check out the Audio Room for Moray James Cables. He's got a very tight and devoted following right now. He's just sent some stuff off to england for review, he's probably going to be the topic of Audiogon conversations for years to come. His digital coax cable is insanely good, I'm seriously considering buying his power cable for both my Amp and transport. Check it out if you're local.

    I'd suggest buying you're speakers etc from a dealer, the tonal characteristics are so much different from speaker to speaker, everything else I'd buy used. Cables are a joke.
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    I know the W-5 is a reference amp. I will also be upgrading to a new pre/pro (Anthem D-1) in the near future as well and will have to allocate funds accordingly.

    Yes, I have seen those cables at his establishment. When the future purchases have been completed, I will visit the local shops once again to borrow cables for a purchase.

    For now, the LSi/SVS will stay put. Haven't heard anything local (in my price range) that makes me want to upgrade.
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  • LuSh
    LuSh Posts: 887
    edited January 2005
    I hear you. I'm currently using a Museatex Bitstream DAC, bought the transport and using the SimAudio to LSi9's...I put them up for sale hoping to snag a pair of used Reference3a MM De Capo's, but I've since changed my mind and I'm going to hold off.

    People have emailed me about trading with PSB stratus, Paradigm Reference Studio's and Axiom's but I honestly feel these would be a step down and if I'm going to change, it will be more in line with the quality of electronics I'm currently using.

    I have no idea what you're using for your source right now, but since you live in Alberta I'd seek a Museatex DAC. These things are older Ed Meitner Design. But John Wright of Museatex mods them, and they sound fantastic. Just great. They have the Bitsteam and the BiDAT. People have been selling their $8k reference source players to get ahold of these things on Audiogon. A BiDat recently sold for as high as $3k two months ago on audiogon. It's orginal retail price of 7 years ago was much less, but Meitner was WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY ahead of his time. Check them out, Museatex/John Wright is based in Calgary. www.museatex.com

    This stuff is affordable and are absolute giant killers.
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    Thanks for all the replies gentlemen. I should have a Simaudio W-3 amp in the rack on Jan 24. It will be interesting to hear what the LSi/SVS combination will sound like.
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  • LuSh
    LuSh Posts: 887
    edited January 2005
    Congrats. Let me know how it sounds. What is your source btw?
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    For now, Pioneer DV-45a to Rotel RC-980BX pre amp.
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  • LuSh
    LuSh Posts: 887
    edited January 2005
    I'm not sure if you're looking to upgrade your redbook CD performance down the road, but if you do, get a Museatex DAC upgraded by John Wright. You live in the same area as him and could probably get one pretty cheap. I saw my DAC on sale again on Audiogon. $1500 US and it sold within 24hrs. I know for a fact that is more then what the owner paid. These things are pretty special, one guy sold another BiDat dac within 24hrs for $3000 us. The BiDat use to sell for $900 back in 96, the upgrades only cost $300...but they are so hard to find people will go apesh1t when they find one. Because you live in Calgary I bet you John could sell you a Bitstream. And make no mistake with the Amp you're about to get it will be a upgrade.
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    I am not sure which direction I will be going as far as the pre amp and source are concerned. I think that I will keep the 5-channel Rotel amp (RMB-1075) I have for the surround channels. No point upgrading this as 95% of the time I listen to two-channel music.

    My current thoughts are to get the Anthem D-1 and use this as the DAC for all sources including DVD-A and SACD via i-link (when available on unit) and SSP.

    Or do I get a better pre with HT bypass, better source and keep the old Sony SSP.

    So at this point, not sure which way the wind will blow me. Only time will tell.

    I will check out the lead here in town. Thanks.
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    Originally posted by LuSh
    Congrats. Let me know how it sounds

    The amp is in the house; it is in mint condition with no signs of use.

    This amp is smooth, revealing and dynamic. Did I say dynamic, I should say explosive. It dominates and controls the LSi9 speakers to produce an engaging soundstage that is intricate and vast in all dimensions.

    I have only spent 1.5 hours listening and have no regrets. I was worried that the source and pre would not be up to the task. I was wrong, they will be fine for now.

    Once again, thanks to all that responded.
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  • LuSh
    LuSh Posts: 887
    edited January 2005
    Hey Bro, Museatex is up for sale unmodded grab it while you still have a chance.

    http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/fsb.pl?dgtlconv&1&ctg&st1
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  • jmierzur
    jmierzur Posts: 489
    edited January 2005
    Thanks for letting me know about the unit; it was sold when I looked. At this point I still do not know if I will be concentrating on upgrading two channels or consolidating the two pre amps into a separate SSP (Anthem D-1?).

    The new amp significantly improved the soundstage. For example, a recording I like has three female singers in the center. With the old Rotel amp, they were grouped almost in one location. Now there is ‘air’ between them as well as depth! The player has the resolution to produce an image of this quality so I am in no hurry to upgrade. I will take my time and select the best path I can determine.

    I am also now thinking of an upgrade from the LSi9’s to perhaps Dynaudio S 1.4 or C1 if I see them on Audiogon or Canuckaudiomart in the future …

    Thanks for everything.
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