HiFonics banned for too much power...

exalted512
exalted512 Posts: 10,735
edited December 2004 in Car Audio & Electronics
http://www.maxxsonics.com/hifonics/toomuchpower.html
Music is like candy, you have to get rid of the rappers to enjoy it
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  • MacLeod
    MacLeod Posts: 14,358
    edited December 2004
    What a crock! This is yet another flop laid at the feet of European judges. IASCA just had some controversy over crap some UK judges did.

    Even if it was 5 amps in one, so what. The classes arent by how many amps you have, they go by wattage. If you have one 3200 watt Colossus and its 2 amps in one and I have 4 Orion 2500D's, whats the difference.

    I wonder if there is more to this story. Surely an organization wouldnt ban an entire manufactuer solely on the basis of some email.
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  • AustinKP
    AustinKP Posts: 861
    edited December 2004
    That's pretty screwed up. I'd like to hear IASCA's side of the story, but it doesn't sound promising...
    -Austin
    http://www.silverdragon.com/punkie/cybertusk/net.idiot.html - Read it, know it

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  • ntculenuff
    ntculenuff Posts: 1,146
    edited December 2004
    sounds like BS to me.....I think some one was scared too lose.
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  • Thom
    Thom Posts: 723
    edited December 2004
    This was dB Drag racing, it has nothing to do with IASCA. DB Drag did this a few years ago with a Zapco amp (4KW) at Finals, so it's not that shocking. Manufacturers try to skirt the rules and sneek new products through, and I think that dB Drag has a class that only allows one amp so when someone throws several amps in one chassis it's not fair to the other guys in that class. I'm pretty sure these guys who weren't allowed to compete must have been competing in the "street" class or whatever, and weren't in the higher classes where guys are using multiple amps. I don't think it would've been an issue then.

    They accomplished what they wanted, this gave them something to talk about. It's not a sure thing that these competitors would have won their classes, so Maxsonics has something better to talk about- our amps are TOO POWERFUL. WE GOT BANNED. It's the biggest, best amp out there.

    Oh, yeah, that JBL/ Crown amp is bigger. Oh well...
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,804
    edited December 2004
    Yeah but the JBL/Crown amp doesn't have a cool name like Colossus!
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  • AustinKP
    AustinKP Posts: 861
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by Thom
    This was dB Drag racing, it has nothing to do with IASCA.
    Oops, that's what I meant. I read Mac's post and confused the two...
    http://www.silverdragon.com/punkie/cybertusk/net.idiot.html - Read it, know it

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  • Thom
    Thom Posts: 723
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by MacLeod


    Even if it was 5 amps in one, so what. The classes arent by how many amps you have, they go by wattage.



    It's only the street classes, but all of them have limits on amps.

    Street A has a one amp limit, Street B has a two amp limit, etc...
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  • jroberts_101
    jroberts_101 Posts: 106
    edited December 2004
    could someone explain wats the big deal about the hifonics amps? maybe compared to the polk ? thanks
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  • MacLeod
    MacLeod Posts: 14,358
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by Thom
    It's only the street classes, but all of them have limits on amps.

    Street A has a one amp limit, Street B has a two amp limit, etc...

    Oh, ok. Shows what I know. I thought they were classified by wattage and it didnt matter how many amps you used.

    JR - Hifonics has kind of a cult following it seems. There are a lot of people that swear by them but there seems to be just as many that dont. Ive never had any direct experience with them but Ive read several negative things about them. However Ive heard just as many great things about them as well.

    Bottom line is Im sure they are good gear but Im leary of them. Just my opinion.
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
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  • Thom
    Thom Posts: 723
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by jroberts_101
    could someone explain wats the big deal about the hifonics amps? maybe compared to the polk ? thanks

    It appears they put two amps into one chassis with the intention of skirting the rules in dB drag street classes. They, of course, are saying that's not the case.

    Who knows.
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  • swerve
    swerve Posts: 1,862
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by Thom
    They, of course, are saying that's not the case.
    Who knows.
    iT SEEMs everyone is cheating now days... first MLB players now Hifonics.... the world is crumbling slowly ...

    Cody has talked me into a Hifonics amp... if I don't like it I'm driving to his place and beating him over the head with it. I'm VERY VERY leary just like Mac, but I'll give it a shot. ;)

    -adam
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,804
    edited December 2004
    I really don't think Hifonics was cheating nor did they have the intent to. The design of teh amplifier is modular but there aren't two amplifiers in there. It is capable of running as a stereo amp with a mono subwoofer channel and it also takes stereo inputs. It is and it is classified by other sanctioning bodies as a single amplifier. I think the problem here is how teh rules are interpreted with reference to the design of the amplifer.


    As far as Hifonics amps go, yes, you can get them cheap from the discounters but retail prices on them would make youre head spin. My 5 channel Zeus hits almost 700 bucks and teh two amps I recently got for a friend run around 400 for the sub amp and about 450 for the 4 channel and those are teh CHEAP amps. I have used roughly 12 Hifonics amps in my 11 years of **** around with car audio and I have yet to have a problem or even be dissappointed by performance. They are, IMO, one of the best amp companies out there. Their speakers leave alot to be desired though.
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  • swerve
    swerve Posts: 1,862
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by Jstas
    I really don't think Hifonics was cheating nor did they have the intent to.
    obviously i forgot to put
    "/end sarcasm"

    it's o.k. though, I know they probably didn't intend to do anything liek that. :D

    -adam
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  • ntculenuff
    ntculenuff Posts: 1,146
    edited December 2004
    lanzar did this about 10-11 years ago they had there cheater amp
    1 amp rated at 50 watts 25x2 that was 1/4 ohm stable and did some 1500 watts or something crazy like that..
    man those were the fun days of car audio big huge systems ungodly amounts of bass and wattage. an installer freind of mine and me have been talking about getting a few of the old orion hcca red amps (need a heater, this will do) and building a ridiculous system, just for fun. now i have gotten older and just want as much sound as i can get with out taking up space,
    damn age. i will buy a car just for a stereo one day:D :D
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  • MacLeod
    MacLeod Posts: 14,358
    edited December 2004
    I remember those old Orion amps. They would usually trounce the competition....but then youd have to send it off for servicing! LOL Not very reliable.

    I think classifying according to how many amps is kind of stupid. Why not just go on total watts?
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
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  • Thom
    Thom Posts: 723
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by MacLeod
    I remember those old Orion amps. They would usually trounce the competition....but then youd have to send it off for servicing! LOL Not very reliable.

    I think classifying according to how many amps is kind of stupid. Why not just go on total watts?

    Because of cheater amps, like the ones mentioned above. Kicker had an amp like that back in 96- 97, rated at 50x2 and put out 1KW+ at 1 ohm bridged. Soundstream was the worst with it's "sleeping beauty" which was rated at 1/2 watt total (1/4 watt x 2 at 4 ohms) which put out 1KW (bridged at 1 or .5 ohm) if I remember correctly.

    Since power can't be confirmed it's easier to go by one amp, two amp, etc., or by number of woofers, etc. It's harder to find loopholes...
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  • AustinKP
    AustinKP Posts: 861
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by Thom
    Soundstream was the worst with it's "sleeping beauty" which was rated at 1/2 watt total (1/4 watt x 2 at 4 ohms) which put out 1KW (bridged at 1 or .5 ohm) if I remember correctly.
    That's insane! How well did they hold up? It seems something that runs at that low impedance would be fairly unreliable...
    http://www.silverdragon.com/punkie/cybertusk/net.idiot.html - Read it, know it

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  • exalted512
    exalted512 Posts: 10,735
    edited December 2004
    as long as they had some massive cooling capabilities, i dont think they would be horribly unreliable
    -Cody
    Music is like candy, you have to get rid of the rappers to enjoy it
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  • exalted512
    exalted512 Posts: 10,735
    edited December 2004
    i just found at usamps got bought out...god if theyre quality goes down im going to be really pissed...
    -Cody
    Music is like candy, you have to get rid of the rappers to enjoy it
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,804
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by AustinKP
    That's insane! How well did they hold up? It seems something that runs at that low impedance would be fairly unreliable...

    Not necessarily. It depends on how the output circuit was designed. Keep in mind that for a DB Drag style event where LOUD is the key, clean is not a high priority. Infact, I knew a competitor back in the early 90's who got high SPL ratings by running pink noise than any test tone.

    Alot of those cheater amps would use a seperate circuit and stepping transformer to achieve those levels when switched to bridged mode. The Hifonics amp in question doesn't use seperate power circuits just seperate input circuits and crossover networks. Hence the 7 seperate PCB's that DB Drag is bitching about. It's still a single output stage.

    At least that is what it seems like from what I was reading about the amplifier. I could be completely wrong but honestly, knowing the way the multi-channel Hifonics amps are setup, it's fairly likely.
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  • Jstas
    Jstas Posts: 14,804
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by exalted512
    i just found at usamps got bought out...god if theyre quality goes down im going to be really pissed...
    -Cody

    Who bought them out?
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  • exalted512
    exalted512 Posts: 10,735
    edited December 2004
    http://forum.elitecaraudio.com/showthread.php?threadid=104486
    you have to register though
    http://www.carsound.com/cgi-bin/UBB_CGI/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=000792;p=0
    this one you dont have to
    some people say one person, one person says its not him and he wants to remain anonymous
    -Cody
    Music is like candy, you have to get rid of the rappers to enjoy it
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  • swerve
    swerve Posts: 1,862
    edited December 2004
    Cody,
    Just to let you know I ordered the 15... the 18's they won't have till january.... so I guess I'm not a real man. I wouldn't have enough room for the 18 anyways. It would be 3 inches from my back deck....

    -adam
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  • Joelsbass
    Joelsbass Posts: 637
    edited December 2004
    Originally posted by exalted512
    i just found at usamps got bought out...god if theyre quality goes down im going to be really pissed...
    -Cody

    blow.gif

    :(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(



    well at least it looks like they're going with the same build as their current amps... although this means my TU-600 won't match my 2000 when i get it ranting.gif
    MacLeod: I guess youre lucky Polk has such lax hiring standards.

    Josh: Damn skippy!
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  • MacLeod
    MacLeod Posts: 14,358
    edited December 2004
    Phoenix Gold was doing that rating crap with the Tantrums. They were rated at like 15x2 for 50x2 amps.

    I see how that would be a problem with classifications.
    polkaudio sound quality competitor since 2005
    MECA SQ Rookie of the Year 06 ~ MECA State Champ 06,07,08,11 ~ MECA World Finals 2nd place 06,07,08,09
    08 Car Audio Nationals 1st ~ 07 N Georgia Nationals 1st ~ 06 Carl Casper Nationals 1st ~ USACi 05 Southeast AutumnFest 1st

    polkaudio SR6500 --- polkaudio MM1040 x2 -- Pioneer P99 -- Rockford Fosgate P1000X5D
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