What's "transparency?"

Early B.

What does it mean when someone says a speaker has excellent "transparency?"

sowen010599

It means, when you are playing material, you can look directly at the speakers and you can't tell the sound is coming from them.

hamzahsh

Originally posted by sowen010599
It means, when you are playing material, you can look directly at the speakers and you can't tell the sound is coming from them.

Exactly! agree with sowen010599,

When I play music on my RT800i's, it sounds like its coming through my center channel. My speakers are angled towards the listener in the middle, so they create a triangle. The angle is more like 60 degress in my room. Also this eliminates some reflections in the room when sound travels from one spot to another, things like wall and furniture can effect the sound alot but they sound perfect and the imaging and soundstage is solid. This is what I called a "SWEET SPOT" and this is where you start to feel the sound.

IMHO it is an excellent idea to keep changing the position of the speakers and experiment on different angles to make them sound best in your listening environment.

Early B.

OK, so as a point of reference, would you guys consider the Lsi7's to have excellent transparency?

VR3

Ok...

Dont get me wrong, I agree with what has been said...to an extent

I want my sound...taking over the room, not...in the center.

I want a strong center image, but I also want my guitarist on the OTHER side of the mains...

While doing this, it draws no attention to the speakers

However, this is only possible through good recordings, period...

To each their own though

Basically, I dont want the entire band crammed in a 10 foot space (which is about impossible to do in my small room )

sowen010599

Transparency and imaging are two different things, but closely related.

Some sounds are supposed to come from the stereo center, some aren't. With really good imaging, from only two speakers, sounds can be heard behind you (very weird). One of the best illustrations of this is Lightning Crashes by Live off their Throwing Copper album. During the guitar intro, with a properly set up system, and great imaging, the guitar swirls around the room. It swirls all around you, infront, beside, behind. It's very strange, just like 5.1 only much more believable, and still with only 2 speakers.

You can have good transparency with poor imaging. Like hamzahsh said with the sounds coming from the center, that's good, sometimes. Some sounds are supposed to come from there. If you can look at the speaker, left or right, but you can't tell they're on, THAT'S good transparency.

Then, you have imaging. You can't really have good imaging without good transparency. Good imaging happens when you hear different instruments coming from different places, even to the outside of the stereo pair. Basically, you can close your eyes and hear the whole band spread out in-front of you, taking up the whole room. You can point to the place where each instrument is playing.

Lsi 7's, well, they're good if your in the "sweet spot" but, move in any direction and their imaging and transparency collapses. If you are "in the triangle" they're pretty good.

VR3

Yes, I always plant the guitars on the sides, voices/drums in the center

In my room, I have very good imaging - from side to side, front to back, and center...

Transparency is kinda hard to achieve when sitting 4-5 feet from tweeters...but it is as close as I can get it within my lil abode...

What I meant was, if you have EVERYTHING in the center -- you have problems. Plain and simple, lol

Soundstaging, transparency are the first things I look for in a speaker. If it can do one or the other, I dont even consider it

dcarlson

Umm... I think you guys are talking about imaging and soundstaging.

Transparency is when a component recreates exactly what it is fed and is "transparent" in the chain of components. Regardless of imaging and soundstaging.

Early B.

Transparency is when a component recreates exactly what it is fed and is "transparent" in the chain of components. Regardless of imaging and soundstaging.

OK, so can someone clarify all this for me? If the definition given above is correct, how is it possible to determine whether or not a component is recreating exactly what is fed to it? Seems to me there's only one guy who could know what it's supposed to sound like, and that's the fella who mastered the original CD/DVD. Taking another approach, if this definition is correct, then it's not possible for any component to be transparent because they all add their own flavor. Hell, even the freakin' room has got something to contribute.

Just trying to gain a better understanding. I hear these words being thrown around all the time when describing speakers and other components, and most of these words may be just a bunch of hogwash.

dcarlson

Originally posted by Early B.
Just trying to gain a better understanding. I hear these words being thrown around all the time when describing speakers and other components, and most of these words may be just a bunch of hogwash.

That's the fun in READING about audio, no?

Personally, I think it best to listen and if you like what you hear, buy it (if you can). It's all subjective upon the writer. It's hard to buy based on writen opinions but writen opinions can steer you towards listening to a good component.

Early B.

It's hard to buy based on writen opinions but writen opinions can steer you towards listening to a good component.

Agreed. Virtually every professional review paints such a rosy picture that it's hard to distinguish the good stuff from the great stuff. That's why I prefer to read consumer reviews. Unfortuantely, too many consumers try to sound like professionals and use a host of meaningless terms.

Tour2ma

Originally posted by dcarlson
Umm... I think you guys are talking about imaging and soundstaging.

Transparency is when a component recreates exactly what it is fed and is "transparent" in the chain of components. Regardless of imaging and soundstaging.

ED Zachey... Transparency = lack of coloration...
Coloration = the degree to which a given component, or sequence of components add their own, audible signiture to the signal being reproduced...

Example: The old SL2000 tweeters added a hump around 15 kHz, i.e., they colored the sound.

Coloration is not necessarily a bad thing, if you are in control of it, e.g., judicious use of an EQ. Al you are doing is tayloring the music to fit your ear, just as the sound engineer did to fit his...

EDIT: How can you know when your rig is colorless... can't really... What you can tell is when a single change you make moves the sound of your system away from where it was in one direction or another... Mostly if it's more pleasing, a reviewer will say it's less colored. If it is less pleasing, nasty ol' coloration...

Forgot to mention above that your listening room is also part of the equation..

mantis

Ask a hundred people and get a hundred different answers....


In the audio world, people make up there own words to describe what they hear....

Dark sounding , Cool , clear , Muddy , boomy , airy , bright , dead , colored , etc.

These words mean different things to diferent people. We somewhat have an idea what the hell people are saying....but not always.

You'll hear / read new ones all the time. Not to mention you'll start making up your own.

Listen and you'll see.

When I use the word " Transparency " what I mean is the speakers go away in the room. The sound is coming from the room not pin point to the speakers. Like the center channel coment , the sound is in the room sounding like it's coming fromm somewhere else.

Transparent also can mean that the instruments are floating in thin air.

Dan

RuSsMaN

Originally posted by mantis
When I use the word " Transparency " what I mean is te speakers fo away in the room.

Thanks for clearing that up for me. Makes perfect sense now.

Lucky numbers: 15 22 36 41 47 59

Cheers,
Russ

mantis

Thanks for clearing that up for me. Makes perfect sense now.

Edit the last post it reads correctly now

Tour2ma

FWIW... taken from:
http://www.audiovideo101.com/dictionary/dictionary_cat.asp?catid=18

Transparency A subjective term used in audio to indicate how easily and how much of the sound of the live event comes through a recording when played through an audio system.

Early B.

Wow, that definition of "trasparency" means nothing.

OK, so what do we make of all these so-called expert audio reviewers who throw these buzz words around if they have no real meaning? If the buzz words are meaningless and the specs are meaningless, then the only way to judge the quality of speakers and other audio gear is by hooking them up to your existing gear in your room and listen with your ears. Damn. No wonder some of you guys trade out gear so often. There's an inifinite number of combinations to try out and it's virtually impossible to compare one setup to another.

Geez, I need a new hobby...

Tour2ma

Easy, EB... wasn't my definition either... Just one I stumbled across...