WTB: Starter Turntable

joebass3

I have a small amount of vinyl that I would like to listen to. I may upgrade to something better in the future but I was wondering if I could get anything decent for about $200? I'm in the Wash. DC area. Is there anything on CL or FB marketplace near me that I should check out? I was looking at a Technics SL-1900 but it has a broken part. Is it worth considering for the price?
https://m.facebook.com/marketplace/item/549690092904789/?ref=browse_tab&search_query=Technics turntable&tracking={"qid":"-6897652671631208163","mf_story_key":"4397155520401226","commerce_rank_obj":"{\"target_id\":4397155520401226,\"target_type\":0,\"primary_position\":-1,\"ranking_signature\":0,\"commerce_channel\":503,\"value\":0}"}

Tony M

That looks like a good starter to me.

Maybe get a reduction in the asking price too.

TroyD

Go new.

You can get a very decent Fluance table for under 300 with a decent cartridge. Or spend a few bucks more and get the entry level Rega table. Solid investment that will play music well as opposed to just spin vinyl.

SeleniumFalcon

Good advice!

jdjohn

Are there certain features you are looking for that could be deal-breakers? Direct-drive vs belt-drive, auto-functionality, straight arm vs S- or J- shape arm?

joebass3

jdjohn wrote: »

Are there certain features you are looking for that could be deal-breakers? Direct-drive vs belt-drive, auto-functionality, straight arm vs S- or J- shape arm?

This is all new so I haven't even thought about the pros and cons of different options. Fully auto would be a plus but the one I saw on marketplace, although it has that feature, it is broken currently. One thing I do love is fixing things so the thought of buying vintage actually appeals to me.

TroyD

Just food for thought.....by the time you rehab the table....assuming you can find the parts....get a new cartridge (you’ll need it) and get it mounted correctly (not a no brainer....requires a protractor and scale and an understanding of how it all works) etc etc, you’ll be in for what a new table would probably be.

I just went through this rehabbing an AR XB.....for what I have in it, I could have bought a new Fluance....

jdjohn

joebass3 wrote: »

This is all new so I haven't even thought about the pros and cons of different options. Fully auto would be a plus but the one I saw on marketplace, although it has that feature, it is broken currently. One thing I do love is fixing things so the thought of buying vintage actually appeals to me.

Well, the piece that is broken on that unit is the tonearm rest. It is a 'static' piece, and does not control the auto function. The lifting of the tonearm is done via that curved piece (with a rubber bumper on top) behind the tonearm rest, and just in front of the tonearm bearing/pivot point. If the auto functions aren't working, there is more to it than the broken tonearm rest. I hope that makes sense. Having said that, it may not be difficult to fix, but I haven't looked at how that one works.

Looking on CL in your area, this 'Kentwood' tt for $150 caught my eye:

https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/ele/d/arlington-turntable-kentwood-kd-2070/7441649791.html

I have a few vintage starter 'tables available, but of course it would have to be shipped...but not too far - Nashville to DC.

joebass3

jdjohn wrote: »

joebass3 wrote: »

This is all new so I haven't even thought about the pros and cons of different options. Fully auto would be a plus but the one I saw on marketplace, although it has that feature, it is broken currently. One thing I do love is fixing things so the thought of buying vintage actually appeals to me.

Well, the piece that is broken on that unit is the tonearm rest. It is a 'static' piece, and does not control the auto function. The lifting of the tonearm is done via that curved piece (with a rubber bumper on top) behind the tonearm rest, and just in front of the tonearm bearing/pivot point. If the auto functions aren't working, there is more to it than the broken tonearm rest. I hope that makes sense. Having said that, it may not be difficult to fix, but I haven't looked at how that one works.

Looking on CL in your area, this 'Kentwood' tt for $150 caught my eye:

https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/ele/d/arlington-turntable-kentwood-kd-2070/7441649791.html

I have a few vintage starter 'tables available, but of course it would have to be shipped...but not too far - Nashville to DC.

Yeah I was looking at the pic of the Technics unit and you are right. That piece has nothing to do with the auto function, it is just the tonearm rest and it also locks the tonearm for transport. Found this online that might be a good place to start looking for the real issue. I'll check out the unit you linked also.

https://youtu.be/dm4gi-fb038

joebass3

TroyD wrote: »

Just food for thought.....by the time you rehab the table....assuming you can find the parts....get a new cartridge (you’ll need it) and get it mounted correctly (not a no brainer....requires a protractor and scale and an understanding of how it all works) etc etc, you’ll be in for what a new table would probably be.

I just went through this rehabbing an AR XB.....for what I have in it, I could have bought a new Fluance....

Believe me I know you are right. Parts for an old unit could definitely be a problem. I"ll spend some time researching the Fluance. I spent about 5 minutes earlier today and the reviews are mostly positive.

jdjohn

joebass3 wrote: »

Yeah I was looking at the pic of the Technics unit and you are right. That piece has nothing to do with the auto function, it is just the tonearm rest and it also locks the tonearm for transport. Found this online that might be a good place to start looking for the real issue. I'll check out the unit you linked also.

https://youtu.be/dm4gi-fb038

I was only going to glance at that video, but ended-up watching the whole thing since I could totally relate to it I didn't realize how much I would enjoy doing that kind of work until I inherited about 20 tt's from my dad, and needed to work on just about every one of them to some degree. Most vintage tt's just need 'servicing' (like the one in the video), and not necessarily new parts, except for belt drives that need new belts. It looks like the tonearm rest on that one is a replaceable part...might even have a shared part number with other Technics from that era.

Soooo...if you go check that one out, you could probably demonstrate/show the seller that the auto function problem is not due to the broken tonearm rest, but rather (likely) the cue lift not moving up-and-down. Then the negotiations really begin

skrol

I have a couple turn tables available and up i95 a bit in Howard Co. These would be well under the $200 and both are in good working condition. One is a fully automatic Onkyo CP-1046F, quartz locked direct drive and the other is a Pioneer PL-514 semi-automatic, belt drive.

joebass3

Think I did good!

mhardy6647

I'd say so.
I like that era of Technicses

In fact... do I have one of those?
No... but kinda close.


(apropos of nothing, I do actually have the original headshell for it...

msg

Nice!

I think I have the 13xx series of that table. Does this 1610 maintain speed? This old one I picked up sometimes needs assistance to start spinning and would vary a bit. It was the first one I picked up cheap while trying to find a reasonable 1200 at the time. Last time I checked it, it doesn't even get up to speed. I cleaned all the pots, which helped initially. It did seem to work a little better playing with the power lever a bit

mhardy6647

dunno about sluggish start up -- but IME speed variance (fluctuation) in the Technics DD and in their servo belt drive tts is "always"* due to dirty speed adjustment pots. There are two sets of 'em on most Technics tts -- the two on the top deck (ahem "plinth") and two more "inside", on the drive control PCB, IIRC. All four are potentially dirty at this late date -- but respond well to DeOxit or other good contact cleaner (again, IME).

* OK, OK... In fairness, there are true electronic failures (most likely hard to find ICs) that sometimes hobble these ol' workhorses... but, so far, every wobbly one I've encountered responded very favorably to a pot cleanin'.

... and vinylengine has the service manuals for enough of these old decks that it's not hard to figure out how to find the internal adjustment pots.

EDIT Derp I shoulda actually read @msg's post before replying! Sorry.

msg

Good info, Doc, I don't recall being aware of the inside pots when I last checked it, but I'll look for the manual and check it out. Thanks!

joebass3

msg wrote: »

Good info, Doc, I don't recall being aware of the inside pots when I last checked it, but I'll look for the manual and check it out. Thanks!

Here is a good video that mentions the other 2 pots. I'm guessing the 1300 and 1600 are similar. He discusses it at the 3 minute mark.

https://youtu.be/vFFJ_Yg1vxI

jdjohn

Those inner pots are for macro adjustments, so good to mark/note their existing settings before turning/cleaning them.

Navy_Goat

Awesome. You caught one heck of a deal. I am not sure how I missed it. I am in your neighborhood (I think) and I have been looking for a table for a buddy who is looking to dip his toe in the vinyl pond. I really like the SL-XX10 series. That slightly darker shade is great!

mhardy6647

yeah, the charcoal colored ones are very nice. They're a little under-the-radar (maybe even still today)... but, heck fire, that's indeed an amazing price in this day & age!

joebass3

The turntable currently only works manually so I'm sure that factored into the price. Hopefully it just needs to be cleaned up and new silicone grease applied. The repair looks to be fairly straightforward. Waiting for the grease and damping fluid for the cueing device to be delivered but I'll probably try it out manually in the meantime. 🙂

mhardy6647

joebass3 wrote: »

The turntable currently only works manually so I'm sure that factored into the price...

Personally, I'd say that's a plus!
But we're fully-manual and sans cueing here -- the way real men spin wax!

maxward

Real men embrace manual transmissions and turntables!

joebass3

Problem is I've been an auto mechanic for 40 years, so fixing things is in my blood! Not saying I'll use the auto feature but it will work, unless there is a broken part that I can't find (or fabricate). 🙂

mhardy6647

joebass3 wrote: »

Problem is I've been an auto mechanic for 40 years, so fixing things is in my blood! Not saying I'll use the auto feature but it will work, unless there is a broken part that I can't find (or fabricate). 🙂

It OK... as long as you don't actually use it

No, in all seriouness... unless it's some abstruse, proprietary plastic dohickey/dealie that's become brittle with time, it may well simply need, as the camera buffs put it, CLA. Cleaning, lubrication, adjustment.
And if there is a broken plastic dealie, somebody's probably 3D printing replacements & selling them on eBAY.

Tony M

This is a great read on Alan's journey before he was called to duty again.

It's not your TT but you'll get a GREAT discussion on diving into repairing the auto return and shut-off lever/ mechanism that's buried DEEP.

I bought a re-made plastic lever (I think it's 3D printed too) per Alan's research. He had his in place but had to go. I haven't heard from him since and I've never had the nerve, patience and devotion to see this kind of project through.

Alan said it just a project. Study and take plenty of pictures while disassembling a complicated machine.

I read online from a TT expert..."do not try this at home". Leave it to an expert like him. He knows all the tricky stuff that comes from experience.

https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/180682/exploring-lp-s/p1

jdjohn

It has been fascinating for me to work on turntables with various drives systems - idler, belt, direct-drive - and different tonearm bearings - gimble, unipivot, magnetic suspended - and suspension systems - suspended sub-chassis, in particular.

Some of the old Duals are like mechanical clocks, with only the motor and contact switch being electrical...even the speed adjustments were mechanical in nature. Then the Japanese came along with circuit boards and integrated chips. Of course, some have no speed adjustment at all, so it sometimes comes down to the thickness of the belt.
Anyway, I like 'em all.

mhardy6647

jdjohn wrote: »

...
Some of the old Duals are like mechanical clocks, with only the motor and contact switch being electrical...even the speed adjustments were mechanical in nature...
Anyway, I like 'em all.

You may already know this, but the product name DUAL came from the dual power options (wind-up or electric motor) for their early gramophones!


https://www.gramophone.com/dual

As an aside: I bought a pair of beautiful, used Dynaco A-25s for my parents back in 1980 from Gramophone, who were just north of the Baltimore Beltway on Falls Road
That pair of A-25s now resides here -- fine loudspeakers they were, and are.

SeleniumFalcon

I worked at Gramophone during the early '90's at that location. Six degrees of stereo separation!

jdjohn

mhardy6647 wrote: »

You may already know this, but the product name DUAL came from the dual power options (wind-up or electric motor) for their early gramophones!


https://www.gramophone.com/dual

I did not know that! I only knew DUAL as the acronym for Deutsche United Audio Limited. Der Mann Alfred Langer mentioned on that page still sells OEM Dual parts over there. I purchased a few parts from him not too long ago for a CS-630Q and a 721. DualFred.de is his website, FYI.