Whole house standby generator
muncybob
Posts: 3,057
We had given recent thought to going solar with battery back up, but holy moly is that expensive! We only average about $80/mo on electricity so it probably would be time to replace the panels before we break even.
So now we are considering standby gens powered by lp(and not the vinyl kind). Looking for experienced homeowners and their thoughts. What do we need to be aware of when comparing them?
So now we are considering standby gens powered by lp(and not the vinyl kind). Looking for experienced homeowners and their thoughts. What do we need to be aware of when comparing them?
Yep, my name really is Bob.
Parasound HCA1500A(indoor sound) and HCA1000(outdoor sound), Dynaco PAS4, Denon DP1200 w/Shure V15 Type V and Jico SAS stylus, Marantz UD7007, Polk L600, Rythmik L12 sub.
Parasound HCA1500A(indoor sound) and HCA1000(outdoor sound), Dynaco PAS4, Denon DP1200 w/Shure V15 Type V and Jico SAS stylus, Marantz UD7007, Polk L600, Rythmik L12 sub.
Comments
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We had given recent thought to going solar with battery back up, but holy moly is that expensive! We only average about $80/mo on electricity so it probably would be time to replace the panels before we break even.
So now we are considering standby gens powered by lp(and not the vinyl kind). Looking for experienced homeowners and their thoughts. What do we need to be aware of when comparing them?
I've been doing similar research on this very same thing lately, and though I don't own a whole-house generator yet, I can offer some info from what I learned thus far. When researching generator mfrs., take a good look at their spec sheets. They will tell you things like dB rating, fuel consumption based on load (you will be surprised at how much propane you might use), and accessories like battery chargers & engine warmers.
Depending on where you live, total installation costs will probably end up at about $1/watt. So a 13Kw Generac (the brand I am considering) will cost about $13k installed, including a large enough propane tank with piping, and all the electrical connections and an automatic whole house transfer switch, though this can be less money if your main service panel isn't 200 amp. There may also be several requirements as far as the propane tank too, check your local building codes for that information.
So, are you willing to put forth a little effort or are you happy sitting in your skeptical poo pile?
http://audiomilitia.proboards.com/ -
FWIW, I went with a portable gen mainly because we don't have NG in our area yet, and just throwing this out if you don't want a more permanent unit. That being said, a 13 or 17Kw NG unit would be sweet.
Found a Powermate 11000 with a 20HP Honda twin and has 13,750W surge. This is enough to run our A/C while starting the 1.5HP well pump 550' down. I modded the exhaust and added a mass loaded vinyl backed surround while maintaining
portability which dampens the sound considerably.
The single largest task as well as the best option was to swap the main panel for a gen-ready panel. This is a 50A model, they also have 60A but the hookups are harder to come by.
Having a gen-ready panel allows me to select any of the 36 circuits.
Add a 50A inlet box and wattmeters and it's GTG. Those panels are also avail with watt meters built in which is also nice.
Again, just an option if you cannot get a NG or LP standby gen.
Edit to add: The A/C and the well pump are the largest loads on a regular basis, it's capable of running pretty much everything. Lights, microwave, TV, fridge, range, HVAC, never hiccups while cycling the well pump.
I do shut down the water heater until we need it. Last time we lost power for an extended time was during a snow/ice storm for a good 27 hours.
When I run the water heater, it only needs 30 min to an hour max to heat up, I can leave the well pump off for that which is easily manageable with the large holding tank.
Reason is the water heater pulls 4500W and with the A/C running, the well pump packs quite a surge for the rating of the gen.
Whatever generator you select, get the largest you can afford and/or work into your house.
Electric motors take a large surge to get going, on average 3 times their running current. Microwaves use a surprising amount of current also.
Swap incandescents to LED to reduce load.
If you have a NG furnace/water heater/range, then a 13KW may be plenty. -
Yup. Do a critical circuit load sum and add 25-30% more for surge demand. Motor load starts (LRA) are where you need some headroom.
Edit: Good call on that panelboard, Doug. -
As a retired hydrogeologist, I’m curious as to where you live. A 550 foot pump setting is pretty deep, even for some areas in eastern Oregon where I had projects monitoring declines in water levels.
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As a retired hydrogeologist, I’m curious as to where you live. A 550 foot pump setting is pretty deep, even for some areas in eastern Oregon where I had projects monitoring declines in water levels.
This is maxward looking for water. -
My mom has one. Don't know what she spent but she loves it. The power went out for 3 days and she didn't even know till day 2.When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
The quietest standby I've read about is still around 60db+. Maybe it's not near the house?
I wish I had one of those panels for my portable gen, instead I had extension cords through the windows...not pretty. Portable served it's purpose but I'm getting too old to lug that thing out of the shed and uphill...and it's extremely noisy.
Anybody have any experience with Norwall Power Systems? They have a good selection with lots of specs and pricing seems decent too. Was interested in a Champion brand until I saw made in China.Yep, my name really is Bob.
Parasound HCA1500A(indoor sound) and HCA1000(outdoor sound), Dynaco PAS4, Denon DP1200 w/Shure V15 Type V and Jico SAS stylus, Marantz UD7007, Polk L600, Rythmik L12 sub. -
How is the power quality (sine wave harmonic distortion) with the whole-house generators? I know that I was strongly advised to get a fancy-schmancy (Honda) inverter generator because we have some moderately sophisticated (i.e., delicate & expensive to repair) home appliances that don't like dirty AC. Our wall mount boiler was explictly mentioned. I know the incremental cost of the generator I bought was less than the CPU board in our boiler would cost(!).
I guess I'd like to think the wired-in generators produce good quality power -- but you know what "they" say:trust but verify -
I have yet to find any that specify THD other than less than 5%.Yep, my name really is Bob.
Parasound HCA1500A(indoor sound) and HCA1000(outdoor sound), Dynaco PAS4, Denon DP1200 w/Shure V15 Type V and Jico SAS stylus, Marantz UD7007, Polk L600, Rythmik L12 sub. -
My moms is on the side of the garage. Last time I was there it did a monthly cycle and yeah you can hear it in the garage but not in the house.
She is not into audio and as long as my step dad has his sports on TV and the freezer works that is all they care about.
They did spend some coin on it. Living in Oklahoma they need it.When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
This is maxward looking for water.
That looks more like a boomerang to me. I had my property witched when I first bought it. The well driller told me it was all crap. I told him I don't care, I want you to drill right here... All the wells in the neighborhood are really deep. One of my neighbors well is like 900 ft and he only get 1.5gph so he has to have a reservoir and his pump runs 24/7. The well driller called me and said he hit water at 290 ft. and the water level was at 120 ft. I was like "See, I told you witching isn't BS". He said "Even a blind squirrel gets a nut sometimes". Pessimists.Gustard X26 Pro DAC
Belles 21A Pre modded with Mundorf Supreme caps
B&K M200 Sonata monoblocks refreshed and upgraded
Polk SDA 1C's modded / 1000Va Dreadnaught
Wireworld Silver Eclipse IC's and speaker cables
Harman Kardon T65C w/Grado Gold. (Don't laugh. It sounds great!)
There is about a 5% genetic difference between apes and men …but that difference is the difference between throwing your own poo when you are annoyed …and Einstein, Shakespeare and Miss January. by Dr. Sardonicus -
As a retired hydrogeologist, I’m curious as to where you live. A 550 foot pump setting is pretty deep, even for some areas in eastern Oregon where I had projects monitoring declines in water levels.
Our house is in northern VA, the well was about 250' when the previous owners had issues. They took it down to 550' and that solved the problems.
Yeah, it's deep, I watched the guys change our pump and couldn't believe how much pipe was coiled in my yard. At the time the 1.5 HP was the largest single-phase pump we could get while maintaining the current size romex.
Our previous generator was 5000/6250 and couldn't start the older 1HP pump, too much voltage drop I assume.
@mhardy6647
Our current generator has a brushless head (most do) and we have no issues powering electronics, no artifacts in the TV or added noise.The quietest standby I've read about is still around 60db+. Maybe it's not near the house?
Big $$$ but for a portable, 58db is pretty darn quiet.
https://powerequipment.honda.com/generators/models/eu7000is
Check with the local POCO and they may even allow a generlink to be installed at the meter. Many don't allow this as it doesn't use a mechanical interlock. Probably the best and easiest solution but hard to find a POCO that allows them.
http://www.generlink.com/
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I have yet to find any that specify THD other than less than 5%.
That's probably adequate (1% is "hifi"!
) -- be good to see the output sine wave,though, just to be on the safe side. -
Years ago I knew nothing about clean power. We were on day 3 w/o electric and running the portable gen. That day was the NY Giants 1st game so I had to turn the tv on. I think I saw about 10 seconds of that game Yep, my name really is Bob.
Parasound HCA1500A(indoor sound) and HCA1000(outdoor sound), Dynaco PAS4, Denon DP1200 w/Shure V15 Type V and Jico SAS stylus, Marantz UD7007, Polk L600, Rythmik L12 sub. -
I'm responsible for keeping available at all times a half dozen big generators, up to 200kw. I've had gensets for many years including the little hand carriable ones too.
The main thing to know about generators is that's it's not a one time purchase. You don't buy it and then have to use whenever you need it. You have to service them. All the time. Service never ends. If you don't, then when you rrrrreally need it, it won't run.
Depending on where you live geographically, the "cold weather package" could be smart. Extra expense up front and yup, more maintenance costs, but if you want reliable service when an ice storm takes down power, then it may be worth looking at.
Quiet performance is not just the obvious better exhaust but also the style and treatment of the housing. The extra padding inside and the style of doors can really make them quiet down.
Service. Remember to have a pro service!
CJA so called science type proudly says... "I do realize that I would fool myself all the time, about listening conclusions and many other observations, if I did listen before buying. That’s why I don’t, I bought all of my current gear based on technical parameters alone, such as specs and measurements."
More amazing Internet Science Pink Panther wisdom..."My DAC has since been upgraded from Mark Levinson to Topping." -
I know about running them on a regular basis, the usual engine maint. and testing under load...what else?Yep, my name really is Bob.
Parasound HCA1500A(indoor sound) and HCA1000(outdoor sound), Dynaco PAS4, Denon DP1200 w/Shure V15 Type V and Jico SAS stylus, Marantz UD7007, Polk L600, Rythmik L12 sub.
