media players - servers - music management

thejckthejck Posts: 842
I have tried Roon and really liked it mainly for its ability to manage my music library and its multi room setup.
In the past I have tried Kodi, foobar, plex, jriver
I have set all these up for bit perfect playback of lossless audio stored on a file server.

I am wondering if anyone has done any A-B testing between these different media players and determined the sound quality differences?

If you know what you are doing and have setup these different players for bit-perfect playback does the player make any difference at all?

I have used Kodi and Foobar with the wasapi audio driver and have been been able to tell the difference.

I am just trying to make a determination if roon is worth the cost from a sound quality perspective only

Comments

  • thejckthejck Posts: 842
    edited April 17
    Also maybe I have been out of the game for a bit. What is the advantage to up sampling your lossless source audio. I always thought that bit-perfect was the de-facto line in the sand.
    To clarify. up sampling PCM to DSD? is this snake oil or actually worth something if you can afford a DSD dac?
    99% of my source is flac (pcm)
    Post edited by thejck on
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 32,461
    I haven't been able to tell much difference when those formats are used on a computer. The different dacs used make a difference, and stand alone music streamers make a difference, but computer audio is slight to my ears while the accompanying dacs make the majority of the differences audio wise.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • thejckthejck Posts: 842
    that is what i am trying to determine.
    on the same dac. is roon vs a properly setup jriver vs foobar or kodi going to make a difference?
  • vcwatkinsvcwatkins Posts: 1,976
    When Roon first came out, I compared with Media Monkey. JRiver, LMS, and Bryston's app. Roon was at least as good, if not slightly better, than those. Some or most will probably disagree, but IMO infrastructure (wifi/ethernet, isolation, power supplies, server, hard drive, cables :# , damping) is a bigger factor than the player software (at least wrt the ones I was using - can't speak to Foobar, Kodi, Plex). Given the huge leap in UI, I stayed with Roon.

    I usually do not upsample if the gear provides a choice. However, I do like the sound of the PSAudio Directstream Jr; so I guess I'm not solidly in any upsampling camp.

    Den: Roon (Sonic Transporter) * PS Audio DirectStream Jr. * Adcom GFP-750 * Sunfire Signature II * PSAudio PP3 * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 1.2
    Study: Roon * ProJect Stream Box Ultra & Pre Box S2 * Pass ACA * PSA Dectet * DH Labs Q10 * Brines Folded ML-TQWT RS 40-1354
    Studio: Roon * LG v30 phone * Dared MP-5 * DefTech SM45
    Beach: Rega RP6 * AT33PTGII * Budgie SUT * Jolida jd9 * Roon * Sonore UltraRendu (LPS-1, WW Plat7, Iso Regen, Lush) * Schiit Yggdrasil * Joule-Electra LA-100 mkIII * Pass Aleph 30 / First Watt F5 Clone * PSA Dectet * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 2.3tl
    Beach Den: Sonore microRendu * Dayens Menuetto * Fostex BK-12m Folded Horn / KEF LS50 / Dynaudio Audience 50 / Revel M22

  • thejckthejck Posts: 842
    so no realy advantage in roon sq vs a properly setup bitperfect playback solution?

    i would rather spend the money on a better dac and deal with the work cleaning up my library and give up the UI.d
  • gudnoyezgudnoyez Posts: 7,449
    That's what a lot of people say about roon is that managing your library is where it shines. I use foobar sloppy interface and navigation at first but foobar and a good Dac is fine by me. I think your leaning in the right direction.
    Home Theater
    Parasound Halo A 31 OnkyoTX-NR838 Sony XBR55X850B 55" 4K RtiA9 Fronts CsiA6 Center RtiA3 Rears FxiA6 Side Surrounds Dual Psw 111's Oppo 105D Signal Ultra Speaker Cables & IC's Signal Magic Power Cable Technics SL Q300 Panamax MR4300 Audioquest Chocolate HDMI Cables Audioquest Forest USB Cable

    2 Channel
    Adcom 555II Vincent SA-T1 Marantz SA 15S2 Denon DR-M11 Clearaudio Bluemotion SDA 2.3tl's (Z) edition MIT Terminator II Speaker Cables & IC's Adcom 545II Adcom Gtp-450 Marantz CD5004 Technics M245X SDA 2B's, SDA CRS+

    Stuff for the Head
    JD LABS C5 Headphone Amplifier, Sennheiser HD 598, Polk Audio Buckle, Polk Audio Hinge, Velodyne vPulse, Bose IE2, Sennheiser CX 200 Street II, Sennheiser MX 365

    Shower & Off the beaten path Rigs
    Polk Audio Boom Swimmer, Polk Audio Urchin B)
  • DaveHoDaveHo Posts: 2,694
    Briefly looked at Roon. They lost me with the yearly subscription fee. I must be missing something. I can navigate my own library and Tidal just fine with bubble, mconnect, or my streamers app.
  • thejckthejck Posts: 842
    anyone have any thoughts over the PCM and DSD debate? If i got this right. you can use a software player like jriver to convert your PCM flac files into a DSD output if your dac supports it?
    Some people say its great and some not when doing a A-B comparison between the 2?
  • sbb2112sbb2112 Posts: 125
    edited June 7
    I have roon on 2 different systems and the office rig runs thru a musical fidelity m6s which upsamples to 768 unless you turn it off. The other system runs thru an oppo 203. I haven’t took the mf unit home to compare but the difference is noticeable. I am not sure that is the the difference but the mf setup seems less cluttered musically. Granted we are splitting hairs but it is there. So at arms length, the dac is the difference. The dsd really is noticeable. Both roon feeds come from a mac mini on a gigabit router. Most of the files are flac with some dsd in there
    Main System
    Marantz AV8802A PrePro
    Marantz MM7025 Amp rear surrounds
    McIntosh MC7205 Amp center, ceiling and mid surrounds
    McIntosh MC300 Amp front mains
    Oppo 203 Bluray
    Polk SDA-SRS with VR3 monastery crossovers
    Polk FX1000 Mid surrounds
    Klipsch RP-440C Center channel
    Klipsch RP-15M Rear surrounds
    SVS prime elevation ceiling surrounds
    Rythmik F15HP sub
    Samsung 8500 curved screen 65" LED 4K
    Mac Mini Server

    Office System
    Musical Fidelity M6s dac/preamp
    Oppo 103D Bluray
    Polk SDA-SRS 2
    Parasound HCA-1500A
    Polk PSW 650 sub
    Microrendu
    Roku Ultra
    Mac Mini Server
  • invalidinvalid Posts: 82
    You mean you can pick out each instrument better, And it isnt just a wall of sound?
  • sbb2112sbb2112 Posts: 125
    No, more of a level of clarity, quieter background. From what I have read, the upsampling moves artifacts into the higher frequency ranges that are above the audible range.
    Main System
    Marantz AV8802A PrePro
    Marantz MM7025 Amp rear surrounds
    McIntosh MC7205 Amp center, ceiling and mid surrounds
    McIntosh MC300 Amp front mains
    Oppo 203 Bluray
    Polk SDA-SRS with VR3 monastery crossovers
    Polk FX1000 Mid surrounds
    Klipsch RP-440C Center channel
    Klipsch RP-15M Rear surrounds
    SVS prime elevation ceiling surrounds
    Rythmik F15HP sub
    Samsung 8500 curved screen 65" LED 4K
    Mac Mini Server

    Office System
    Musical Fidelity M6s dac/preamp
    Oppo 103D Bluray
    Polk SDA-SRS 2
    Parasound HCA-1500A
    Polk PSW 650 sub
    Microrendu
    Roku Ultra
    Mac Mini Server
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