PS Audio SGC “dac” measurements .....

gyosa
gyosa Posts: 751
edited October 2019 in Electronics
Uh oh ......
WTF ???

-Bk

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-the-ps-audio-stellar-gain-cell-dac.9273/
PS Audio S300 , WiiM Ultra , Yamaha wxc-50 , Salk SuperCharged Songtowers , Kimber Kable 4TC, Sony 42” - BEDROOM

B&K EX-442 ( it will go in my casket when I die ... ) , PS Audio 4.6 preamp ( old school , but it still jams on ... ) , Eversolo DMP-A6 , Boston Acoustic voyager 7’s - POOL

Parasound A21, Eversolo DMP-A8 , Kimber Kable 4vs , Ascend Acoustics ELX Ribbon Towers , Sony XBR-A8F 65” OLED - DEN , MAIN system

Onkyo TX-nr609 , Polk atrium 7 , Boston acoustic sound ware (4) , Boston acoustic sub , B&W center , Sharp 65” TV - PATIO
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Comments

  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,895
    edited October 2019
    good old Amir... what a piece of work.
    He can take measurements but he has no idea what they mean, much less why they do (or don't) matter.
    Waste of space is he, IMO.
    EDIT: I am in no position to judge whether the person's a waste of space -- only the drivel that is posted to his website. I do enjoy looking at it, though. Read his take on the Schiit Aegir amp. He likes it, even though it fails to meet its most basic specifications. Weirdly inconsistent -- from him/them. ;)


    ... and mind you, I am not anti-analytics (being an analytical/quantitative analysis kind of guy myself) -- but I am anti-dogmatics, and anti-lack of common sense.

    :|
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  • displayname
    displayname Posts: 1,148
    I put zero value in any reviewer that willingly and openly omits listening impressions. His demeaning tone towards other audiophiles doesn't inspire me to come back.
    Analog: MoFi MasterTracker > MoFi UltraDeck > Sutherland 20/20
    Digital: Cambridge CXC / Streaming > Cambridge CXN v2
    MastersounD Dueventi > Rosso Fiorentino Certaldo or Arcam rHead > Hifiman HE4XX
    Discogs
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  • gyosa
    gyosa Posts: 751
    Yep ,
    Hence the , “ WTF ? “....
    I just found it interesting ...
    He never actually LISTENS to anything , just measures it .....
    I’ve never seen a review , other than this , that wasn’t glowing .....

    Bk
    PS Audio S300 , WiiM Ultra , Yamaha wxc-50 , Salk SuperCharged Songtowers , Kimber Kable 4TC, Sony 42” - BEDROOM

    B&K EX-442 ( it will go in my casket when I die ... ) , PS Audio 4.6 preamp ( old school , but it still jams on ... ) , Eversolo DMP-A6 , Boston Acoustic voyager 7’s - POOL

    Parasound A21, Eversolo DMP-A8 , Kimber Kable 4vs , Ascend Acoustics ELX Ribbon Towers , Sony XBR-A8F 65” OLED - DEN , MAIN system

    Onkyo TX-nr609 , Polk atrium 7 , Boston acoustic sound ware (4) , Boston acoustic sub , B&W center , Sharp 65” TV - PATIO
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  • kharp1
    kharp1 Posts: 3,453
    edited October 2019
    I've never turned on a set of measurements and rocked out. Never gotten lost for hours in a bunch of numbers. I listen to music and let my ears decide. I've never heard the SGC, but, he did pan the Directstream DAC as well, and, I can say with 100% confidence that I've stopped looking for a DAC.

    Who cares what the measurements are so long as the designer builds a piece that sounds good. The name of the website should be a good indicator of where he's at. I listen to music, not science.
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  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    The stellar is a great sounding pre and DAC. I have Never purchased anything from measurements in this hobby. And my next purchase might just be slightly less than lateral, but I have to try it.
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  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,949
    Measurements are simply a visual representation of how a product was engineered.

    Anything else you infer from them is your personal interpretation of said measurements.
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  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,949
    edited October 2019
    Also for the record, regarding the PSA Stellar GCP/DAC, it's measured performance had nothing to do with my decision to sell it. I had already decided to sell it and listed it for sale here before it's measurements were posted.
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,895
    If those ASR cats reviewed cars, he'd get a Ferrari and rank it against all of the other cars he tested based on how close to spec the torque was on all of the lug nuts on all four wheels.

    "They" have (he has) no clue -- although I was amused at the snide comments about the uselessness of the 'special sauce' analog buffer module thing in the PSAudio ICEpower amp the/reviewed.


    https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-ps-audio-s300-pwr-amp.9302/
    It is a sigh of relief that PS Audio had not managed to reduce the performance of the ICEPower modules. Response and sonic abilities are completely determined by those modules unlike what PS Audio marketing says. The ICEPower module used here has a distinctly lower performance than Hypex modules we have tested in the past. So you are not going to get state-of-the-art performance. For that, you need to go to amplifiers higher in the SINAD graph.

    Some pretty amusing observations about NFB in the review and in the comments, too.
    The comments from the sycophants are at least 50% of the fun!

    Now -- I'll admit to a certain intrinsic bias B) but I heard an interview today with freshly-minted Nobel Laureate Dr. William Kaelin (Harvard & the DFCI), and one of his comments really resonated with me. He was saying that putting astronauts on the moon was fundamentally an engineering exercise; there was no "new science". What he said next sort of distills the difference between craft and art -- or engineering and science. :)
    "Engineers live for expected results. Scientists live for unexpected results."

    That's a big 10-4.
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,895
    kharp1 wrote: »
    I've never turned on a set of measurements and rocked out. Never gotten lost for hours in a bunch of numbers. I listen to music and let my ears decide. I've never heard the SGC, but, he did pan the Directstream DAC as well, and, I can say with 100% confidence that I've stopped looking for a DAC.

    Who cares what the measurements are so long as the designer builds a piece that sounds good. The name of the website should be a good indicator of where he's at. I listen to music, not science.

    The peak of the spec wars was -- of course -- the 1970s.

    One of my favorite bits of marketing copy from those days came from Onkyo -- albeit for a pretty decent quality, and decent sounding, product. I doubt that the folks who wrote, and approved, the brochure copy had any sense of the irony of their tag line :p

    12017183446_78b4c69b64_c.jpgonkyo by Mark Hardy, on Flickr
    You can hear the specifications

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  • tonyp063
    tonyp063 Posts: 1,087
    edited October 2019
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    ....
    the difference between craft and art -- or engineering and science. :)
    "Engineers live for expected results. Scientists live for unexpected results."


    Ladies and Gentlemen,
    We have here the winner of this years "That's sig material right there" award
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  • gyosa
    gyosa Posts: 751
    edited October 2019
    I think it’s important to note that he doesn’t “review” anything....
    He “measures” stuff .....

    I’ve met many girls who only “measure” a 32” bust , but my “review” of them Is a whole ‘nuther story .....😂😂

    Bk
    PS Audio S300 , WiiM Ultra , Yamaha wxc-50 , Salk SuperCharged Songtowers , Kimber Kable 4TC, Sony 42” - BEDROOM

    B&K EX-442 ( it will go in my casket when I die ... ) , PS Audio 4.6 preamp ( old school , but it still jams on ... ) , Eversolo DMP-A6 , Boston Acoustic voyager 7’s - POOL

    Parasound A21, Eversolo DMP-A8 , Kimber Kable 4vs , Ascend Acoustics ELX Ribbon Towers , Sony XBR-A8F 65” OLED - DEN , MAIN system

    Onkyo TX-nr609 , Polk atrium 7 , Boston acoustic sound ware (4) , Boston acoustic sub , B&W center , Sharp 65” TV - PATIO
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  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    Feel free to start a new review thread for that. I’ll subscribe.
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  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    Bust. Lol! What is this, Napoleon Dynamite
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  • gyosa
    gyosa Posts: 751

    Like that , huh ?
    😂😂

    Bk
    joecoulson wrote: »
    Bust. Lol! What is this, Napoleon Dynamite

    PS Audio S300 , WiiM Ultra , Yamaha wxc-50 , Salk SuperCharged Songtowers , Kimber Kable 4TC, Sony 42” - BEDROOM

    B&K EX-442 ( it will go in my casket when I die ... ) , PS Audio 4.6 preamp ( old school , but it still jams on ... ) , Eversolo DMP-A6 , Boston Acoustic voyager 7’s - POOL

    Parasound A21, Eversolo DMP-A8 , Kimber Kable 4vs , Ascend Acoustics ELX Ribbon Towers , Sony XBR-A8F 65” OLED - DEN , MAIN system

    Onkyo TX-nr609 , Polk atrium 7 , Boston acoustic sound ware (4) , Boston acoustic sub , B&W center , Sharp 65” TV - PATIO
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,981
    gyosa wrote: »
    I think it’s important to note that he doesn’t “review” anything....
    He “measures” stuff .....

    I’ve met many girls who only “measure” a 32” bust , but my “review” of them Is a whole ‘nuther story .....😂😂

    Bk

    Now your talking my language. lol

    Here we go, the old battle of measuring things vs actually listening to them. The same debate happens in all things audio related, think cables....right ?

    Anyone worth their salt in this hobby would never publish measurements without any actual listening review/notes as well. Clearly he has an agenda.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • jdjohn
    jdjohn Posts: 3,160
    At one point Amir gets personal:

    "I hear it: 'but it sounds great to my ears.' I am sure it does because a) audiophiles are terrible when it comes to critical listening abilities and hearing non-linearities, and b) you don't know how to do proper listening tests."

    328phpib1yjd.jpg
    "This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
    "Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
    Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon
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  • tophatjohnny
    tophatjohnny Posts: 4,182
    I think I can smell the specs
    ..that or I may just have not wiped very good??😂
    "if it's not fun, it's not worth it & remember folks, "It's All About The Music"!!
    *****************************
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    I love the punchy, meat on the bones character of the PS SGCD. Most enjoyable preamp I have ever owned.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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