New speakers and amp

dragon1952dragon1952 Posts: 4,688
edited June 9 in Car Audio & Electronics
I just had my car speakers and amp upgraded in my 2007 Hyundai Santa Fe Limited AWD. It had 4 x 6.5" speakers in the front and rear doors plus a pair of tweeters in the front. I went with the Hertz DCX 165.3's and a Kicker Key180.4 amp. Holy cow what a difference. I know these aren't expensive options but compared to the stock speakers it's just ridiculous. I knew stock speakers were cheap but when I saw what they took out of there I was shocked. The 6.5's weighed about 2 ounces and had the flimsiest paper drivers and the tweeters weighed maybe 1/8th of an ounce. No wonder they sounded so bad.
Having said that, there is an audible low frequency rumble with no source selected and the speaker volume at around 3/4. I'll go back tomorrow and point it out but just wondering in the meantime what might be going on.
____________________________
2 channel - PS Audio Stellar S300 amp, PS Audio DirectStream DAC, audio optimized NUC7i5 running Windows 10 Pro/JRiver MC24, Matrix X-SPDIF 2 USB interface, Blackbird SSD dock with 500 GB Samsung 860 EVO, Tom Tutay modded EE Minimax preamp, Furman Elite 15 Pfi power conditioner, Martin Logan Electromotion ESL speakers, Rythmik F12SE subwoofer, Kimber 4TC speaker wire, Gabriel Gold Reflection V2 IC's, VH Audio power cords, Wireworld USB and HDMI/I2S cables
Computer - Windows 7/JRiver, Topping D10 DAC, Fostex PMO.4n monitors

Comments

  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 7,129
    Sounds like a grounding issue.
    "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • codycatalistcodycatalist Posts: 2,522
    edited June 11
    Yeah either ground loop or bad connection somewhere. First check engine fuse block, then make your way to the amp. I hate redoing my grounds but sometimes worth it.

    Could also be the RCAs if they are ran near a power wire, can be picking up noise but normally that manifest itself as a whine.

    If your up for troubleshooting remove the rcas from the amp and see if the noise remains, if so it is a wiring issue.
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • dragon1952dragon1952 Posts: 4,688
    I took it back in yesterday. The tech said it was likely the gain on the new amp being a tad high and that he could adjust it but I'd lose a bit of power. It's not really an issue for me since it's not that loud. Kinda sounds like a fan on low and is not audible at all with music playing. The Kicker Key180.4 amp is only 45 WPC to begin with (speakers are rated for 60 and 80) and I don't want to sacrifice the power. I have the option to trade up to a higher power amp but don't want to give up the DSP tuning this amp offers.
    ____________________________
    2 channel - PS Audio Stellar S300 amp, PS Audio DirectStream DAC, audio optimized NUC7i5 running Windows 10 Pro/JRiver MC24, Matrix X-SPDIF 2 USB interface, Blackbird SSD dock with 500 GB Samsung 860 EVO, Tom Tutay modded EE Minimax preamp, Furman Elite 15 Pfi power conditioner, Martin Logan Electromotion ESL speakers, Rythmik F12SE subwoofer, Kimber 4TC speaker wire, Gabriel Gold Reflection V2 IC's, VH Audio power cords, Wireworld USB and HDMI/I2S cables
    Computer - Windows 7/JRiver, Topping D10 DAC, Fostex PMO.4n monitors
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 7,129
    Sounds like the tech was being lazy and didn't really want to troubleshoot what was causing it, and instead chose to make up excuses.
    "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,110
    edited June 11
    Clipdat wrote: »
    Sounds like the tech was being lazy and didn't really want to troubleshoot what was causing it, and instead chose to make up excuses.

    I agree with Drew. That isn't a gain issue. He turned the gain down because it will likely reduce the impact of the hum, not because he was fixing a damn thing.
  • codycatalistcodycatalist Posts: 2,522
    I third the opinion of above. That wasn't the problem at all.

    If you can live with it then go for it but there will be an underlying issue that remains.
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • dragon1952dragon1952 Posts: 4,688
    edited June 11
    Well there's a lifetime warranty on the installation so if it is an installation issue I'm covered. This is a stand-up shop with stellar reviews. The tech (which wasn't the installer) said it was the amp's noise floor we were hearing and could be adjusted by lowering the gain. I'm assuming it's like home audio where it's optimal to have the amp and preamp gain matched. I'm using my aftermarket Kenwood receiver which was there when I bought the vehicle. And, again, it's only audible when the volume is up there and with no source.
    ____________________________
    2 channel - PS Audio Stellar S300 amp, PS Audio DirectStream DAC, audio optimized NUC7i5 running Windows 10 Pro/JRiver MC24, Matrix X-SPDIF 2 USB interface, Blackbird SSD dock with 500 GB Samsung 860 EVO, Tom Tutay modded EE Minimax preamp, Furman Elite 15 Pfi power conditioner, Martin Logan Electromotion ESL speakers, Rythmik F12SE subwoofer, Kimber 4TC speaker wire, Gabriel Gold Reflection V2 IC's, VH Audio power cords, Wireworld USB and HDMI/I2S cables
    Computer - Windows 7/JRiver, Topping D10 DAC, Fostex PMO.4n monitors
  • codycatalistcodycatalist Posts: 2,522
    dragon1952 wrote: »
    Well there's a lifetime warranty on the installation so if it is an installation issue I'm covered. This is a stand-up shop with stellar reviews. The tech (which wasn't the installer) said it was the amp's noise floor we were hearing and could be adjusted by lowering the gain. I'm assuming it's like home audio where it's optimal to have the amp and preamp gain matched. I'm using my aftermarket Kenwood receiver which was there when I bought the vehicle. And, again, it's only audible when the volume is up there and with no source.

    Simple to test, remove the RCAs from the amp and see if the issue remains. Would rule out a wiring issue although I have had many headunit/amp combinations and never had the issue you described.

    Like I said though, if you can live with it screw it and just enjoy the music. :)
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,110
    If there is audible noise, there is an install problem. Ever heard any stock system with audible noise, even those with upgraded stereos? No.

    Don't accept their explanation. If you are hearing the noise floor of an amp, then you have a bad amp. I don't buy that excuse either.



    It sounds like it is a cabling or pre issue. If the only time you hear it is with silence and a higher volume, the amp isn't the issue - it doesn't work that way.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 7,129
    My money is on the grounding point chosen for the amp not having the paint cleaned/scrubbed off before being used.
    "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • codycatalistcodycatalist Posts: 2,522
    Clipdat wrote: »
    My money is on the grounding point chosen for the amp not having the paint cleaned/scrubbed off before being used.

    If it was a ground loop it should be independent of volume and always present...in theory that is. ;)
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 7,129
    edited June 12
    Not a ground loop, just a bad/partial ground. But yeah, I don't know for sure over the internet. In person I would be able to find the culprit in under 10 mins.
    "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • codycatalistcodycatalist Posts: 2,522
    That’s the beauty of car audio. Simple to troubleshoot, especially compared to home audio.

    That reminds me I should probably fix the wiring issue on my system tomorrow. Been driving me nuts having a thumping sub, just been so dang busy.
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • dragon1952dragon1952 Posts: 4,688
    So the other day I thought I'd look under the hood and see where they connected the ground. I didn't see it in the engine compartment but while I was in there I disconnected the cable from the + battery terminal and sprayed with electrical cleaner and re-torqued the nut which might have been a tad loose. No more noise
    ____________________________
    2 channel - PS Audio Stellar S300 amp, PS Audio DirectStream DAC, audio optimized NUC7i5 running Windows 10 Pro/JRiver MC24, Matrix X-SPDIF 2 USB interface, Blackbird SSD dock with 500 GB Samsung 860 EVO, Tom Tutay modded EE Minimax preamp, Furman Elite 15 Pfi power conditioner, Martin Logan Electromotion ESL speakers, Rythmik F12SE subwoofer, Kimber 4TC speaker wire, Gabriel Gold Reflection V2 IC's, VH Audio power cords, Wireworld USB and HDMI/I2S cables
    Computer - Windows 7/JRiver, Topping D10 DAC, Fostex PMO.4n monitors
  • codycatalistcodycatalist Posts: 2,522
    ;)
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
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