Yamaha MX-A5200 and CX-A5200

BjornB17BjornB17 Posts: 661
edited January 16 in Electronics
I'm working on building a home theater in a new house and it is time to upgrade some of the equipment in my signature which is getting a bit long in the tooth. I'm planning on selling my Harman Kardon receiver, CD player, & DVD player & selling the emotiva Amp, and likely going with the yamaha amp and receiver below. I recently switched from a HK to Yamaha amp for my home office and am surprised at how much it tamed my RTi4's there and it sounds great!

https://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/mx-a5200_u/index.html

https://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/cx-a5200_u/index.html

I guess my main question is - regarding the Yamaha Amp, looks like it is 11.2 and I can bridge or bi-amp the front mains, which I would like to do. That would be 200 wpc for each of the front towers, either my current RTi10's or if I can find a good pair of RTi12's I will use those instead.

I know those towers are demanding and would actually probably be a little less power than my current Emotiva. Is 200 watts of clean power good enough to drive RTi12's well?

By the way, the Velodyne sub will likely be replaced by a pair of SVS SB-3000 or something similar. Room is 19'x16'x10'.

Thanks!
polkaudio RTi10 bi-amped at 300 WPC
polkaudio CSi5
polkaudio FXi3
Velodyne CHT-12
harman/kardon AVR-254
harman/kardon FL-8385
Emotiva UPA-7
System Under Renovation!

Comments

  • GospelTruthGospelTruth Posts: 343
    I will start this by saying that I am a Yamaha fan. I have had two receivers by them and will buy another when the time comes.

    With that said, you have picked the two top end products from Yamaha. My only concern is reading the specs on the Yamaha amp. It is rated at 170 W (6 ohm, 0.06% THD), 150 W (8 ohm, 0.06% THD). But that is only two channel driven, not all channels. Most other high end amps provide their specs with all channels driven. So even with the bi-amping, I don't know if you are really going to get what you want out of that amp. I could be wrong though.

    From reading this forum and if it were me, I think I would be going with either the Aventage 3080 or 2080 receiver depending on what features were needed. Yes, they are 9.2 channel receivers instead of 11.2, but that depends if you need that. With the receiver you get the amplification - but I would augment that an external amp (either 5 or 3 channel) for the front 3 + 2 rear. I would let the receiver handle the other channels as they won't need as much amplification. For the same price point, I might get a Parasound A52. Personally with my budget though, I would look for something like that used - but that's me.

    The CX-5200 comes with no amplification at all. So you would need to either buy the Yamaha MX-5200 or a couple 5 channel amps to get what you want if you don't go with the Yamaha amp. That is why I suggest a Yamaha receiver instead.

    Maybe others can chime in with their thoughts on the Yamaha amp. From what I've learned here though, I would find something like a Parasound, Bryson or keep your Emo. Buy used even if you want.

    The big things you are getting with the combination you have up there is the balanced connections and 11 channels of amplification in one chassis. If those are critical for you then I think that's a good combination.

    Regardless, your initial choice will probably still sound amazing.
    Speakers
    Energy RC-70 Mains, Energy RC-LRC Center, Energy RC-R (x4) Rear Channels, Energy RC-R (x2) Front Effects
    Polk 5jr+
    Polk SDA 2B
    Polk SDS 3.1TL

    Equipment
    Panamax 5510 Re-generator Power Conditioner
    Yamaha RX-V3800 Receiver
    Digital Sources: Sony CDP-X339ES CD Player, HHB CDR830 BurnIt Professional CD Recorder, Sony PS3, Oppo DV-983H DVD Player
    Analog Sources: Sony TC-K890ES Cassette, Nakamichi DR-1 Cassette, Technics SL-7 Turntable
  • BjornB17BjornB17 Posts: 661
    I will start this by saying that I am a Yamaha fan. I have had two receivers by them and will buy another when the time comes.

    With that said, you have picked the two top end products from Yamaha. My only concern is reading the specs on the Yamaha amp. It is rated at 170 W (6 ohm, 0.06% THD), 150 W (8 ohm, 0.06% THD). But that is only two channel driven, not all channels. Most other high end amps provide their specs with all channels driven. So even with the bi-amping, I don't know if you are really going to get what you want out of that amp. I could be wrong though.

    From reading this forum and if it were me, I think I would be going with either the Aventage 3080 or 2080 receiver depending on what features were needed. Yes, they are 9.2 channel receivers instead of 11.2, but that depends if you need that. With the receiver you get the amplification - but I would augment that an external amp (either 5 or 3 channel) for the front 3 + 2 rear. I would let the receiver handle the other channels as they won't need as much amplification. For the same price point, I might get a Parasound A52. Personally with my budget though, I would look for something like that used - but that's me.

    The CX-5200 comes with no amplification at all. So you would need to either buy the Yamaha MX-5200 or a couple 5 channel amps to get what you want if you don't go with the Yamaha amp. That is why I suggest a Yamaha receiver instead.

    Maybe others can chime in with their thoughts on the Yamaha amp. From what I've learned here though, I would find something like a Parasound, Bryson or keep your Emo. Buy used even if you want.

    The big things you are getting with the combination you have up there is the balanced connections and 11 channels of amplification in one chassis. If those are critical for you then I think that's a good combination.

    Regardless, your initial choice will probably still sound amazing.

    That is great input, thanks for the help. I looked at the RX-A3080 and it seems to basically be a combination of the CX-A5200 pre-amp section and the MX-A5200 amp section but costs the same as the CX-A5200. I wonder what the catch is other than being just 9.1? I supposed I could get a A3080 to power the surrounds (4 on wall and 2 in ceiling) and then the MX-A5200 to bi-amp the front 3 speakers?
    polkaudio RTi10 bi-amped at 300 WPC
    polkaudio CSi5
    polkaudio FXi3
    Velodyne CHT-12
    harman/kardon AVR-254
    harman/kardon FL-8385
    Emotiva UPA-7
    System Under Renovation!
  • pitdogg2pitdogg2 Posts: 12,320
    I myself wouldn't worry about the bi-amping you are getting two top of the line items from Yamaha that are made for each other. Stop trying to compare Emotiva to the Yamaha that is like comparing Honda Civic to a Acura NSX two completely different critters. It is not all about the watts for one thing. Yamaha has always been known to under rate their top end stuff in the past. Besides 150 compared to 200 WPC in 99% of cases you would never be able to tell a difference. Now let us look at current delivery that Yamaha I would think would have higher current delivery than the Emotiva. If you can swing the price I'd go for it. That pre-amp has all new HDMI 2.2 top of the line ESS Saber Pro DAC's which are not cheap and they are very very good. Will you get those in the receiver? Doubtful

    both seem to be made for multiple zones so you could send music to other areas of you house.


    A receiver is a jack of all trades and a master of none.

    These two products ARE a master of exactly what they were built to do.


    Yes I am a Yamaha fan also years ago I had a Yamaha receiver that was rated at 85 watts x 5 Meanwhile a buddy had a receiver of another brand rated at 150WPC x5 well with all channels driven his only put out 52WPC mine WAS rated and drove 85WPC x5. Yes Yamaha truly rated it properly and in 2 channel mode it was well past 150wpc.


    If you can find a Yamaha dealer get your ears on it and find out what they are all about personally I hate not being able to audition stuff of that price range before buying. For me that just doesn't make sense.


    let me go back to that Bi-amping just run the speaker cables to the speakers. Without external crossovers you gain nothing by doing what you want to do tweeters do not need nor can the use all those watts. You are STILL sending the signal through the very same crossover. So if you could put 1000watts through that speaker the crossover IS ONLY going to send a small minuet amount of that north to the tweeter.

    best thing to do is get rid of the brass jumper and make a set or buy a set of good jumper cables to put in place of the brass jumper.
  • BjornB17BjornB17 Posts: 661
    edited January 16
    Great, I feel a lot better about it now, and thanks for the input about the bi-amping. I guess I can still bridge the channels on the front mains to get that extra juice to them since I will only have 9 speakers instead of 11, and have lots of power for stereo listening. As a bit of a minimalist I do like the idea of having less cables to route so that works fine for me.

    The new Yamaha stuff seems great. I'm used to the Yamaha stuff from 10 years ago that tended to be on the bright side which was a bad combo with the RTi speakers, but yamaha seems to be warmer now and quality wise seems really good, although i haven't checked these particular products out yet, but I'll seek them out in person. I also like the nice clean design of them.
    polkaudio RTi10 bi-amped at 300 WPC
    polkaudio CSi5
    polkaudio FXi3
    Velodyne CHT-12
    harman/kardon AVR-254
    harman/kardon FL-8385
    Emotiva UPA-7
    System Under Renovation!
  • alucidideaalucididea Posts: 112
    edited January 20
    Hey there. Yamaha RX-A3070 owner here. These surround receivers are pretty awesome. As far as audio quality, my experience is that the dialogue is a tiny bit muddled and could be a bit clearer. But that could easily be solved with proper EQ settings and is most likely more associated with the quality of the source and not the output of the receiver. The YPAO measurements also do a decent job of room correction. Though I will say it seems like it favors ramping up high-frequencies quite a bit.

    Video-wise, if it were me, I’d make sure the 3080 also can pass-through HDR10+ as well, if that’s anywhere in your mind. The last time I checked, it’s not supported and the last time I talked to their tech support they couldn’t tell me if it would ever be. This may or may not be a consideration to you.

    Anyways, this thing drives plenty of power for most. Your RTI10’s can be somewhat power-hungry (right?). But depending on how many channels you’re actually using, it could work okay for the surrounds/center. If you’ve got the cash, which it seems you do considering your options, going for the 3080 and an external amp for the fronts and the center could be a good choice. Those 3 speakers need/deserve everything you can give them for an ideal soundstage and then relying on the receiver to power the rest could make an impressive setup.

    My thoughts on a power amp would be the following:
    Yamaha’s output voltage spec is > 1v. Makes sure whatever power amp you get is spec’d with this input sensitivity in mind. Parasound makes some great amps that have such a sensitivity (even a 3 channel I believe? I could be wrong there.) Also, remember wattage is less important than amperage. I’d buy an amp rated @ 45 amps peak/channel over one that did 35 amps, almost no matter what the wattage said. Obviously there are other considerations, as well. It’s all just food for thought.

    Side note: I’ve also been using a Yamaha A-S300 for my RTI4s and previously had an A-S500 powering some RTI8’s, and then it was powering my center channel (an LSIM 706) in a different setup. The power they give can be magical given the right circumstances.

    If you’ve got any other questions, I’m happy to answer them.
  • BjornB17BjornB17 Posts: 661
    edited January 24
    After looking at my options in more detail, I think I might be going a different route. I took at look at Emotiva's website and I am really excited about some of their new products and might be a better fit for me.

    I could get:
    -Emotiva XPA-DR3 to power the front 3 speakers (RTi12 & CSi5) @ 450 wpc
    -Emotiva custom spec 8 channel amp @ 65 wpc for in-wall & in-ceiling surrounds in a 7.2.4 system
    -Emotiva RMC-1 Processor + blue tooth module.

    Another good thing is all those products will fit in a BDI Corridor 8173 Low media console underneath the projection screen so all the electronics will be stealthy, and still has room left inside for an LG 4k blu-ray player and a PS4
    https://www.bdiusa.com/products/corridor-low-media-cabinet-8173

    I might also spring for a pair of SVS SB-16Ultra's in Black Oak to match the veneer on the RTi towers.

    Oh yeah, and a 4K projector along with a 150"-200" elite sceens Aeon.

    I only upgrade my home theater once every 10 years so why not.

    Also I'm meeting with home builder tomorrow to go over the design. I may bump out the room 2' in either direction, so we're looking at a 21'x18'x10' or so room, pretty healthy size for a home theater, which will double as a private living room for guests on the second floor.
    polkaudio RTi10 bi-amped at 300 WPC
    polkaudio CSi5
    polkaudio FXi3
    Velodyne CHT-12
    harman/kardon AVR-254
    harman/kardon FL-8385
    Emotiva UPA-7
    System Under Renovation!
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