All amps sound the same.
ab0tj
Posts: 40
in Electronics
Ok, sorry for the clickbait title. I just wanted to get a discussion started on the science behind why this is not true. So, here's what I've learned/realized recently...
Many that make the claim that all amplifiers sound the same like to cite Ohm's law as an example. The claim is that for a given load (an 8 ohm speaker for example), watts equals volts times amps so there is no possible way a large amplifier can deliver more current at a given power level than a small amplifier. Sure, this part is true. But there is more to the picture. For the sake of discussion, we'll ignore the fact that the math is more complicated for a speaker due to the fact that this is an *impedance* we're talking about, not a resistance.
So, given all this, the math says an amplifier will put twice the power into a 4 ohm load versus an 8 ohm load. Yet if you look at the specifications of many well respected amplifiers, this is usually not the case. Why? Because an amplifier isn't a perfect constant voltage source. As the current drawn from the amplifier goes up, the voltage drops a bit. How much it drops depends on the amplifier design.
Most users of this forum will already know that the resistance (impedance really) of a speaker varies with the input frequency. This interacts with the amplifier by dropping the voltage, and thus the wattage, more for certain frequencies rather than others. Some amplifiers will be better at "holding up" the voltage at the lower points in the speaker's impedance curve than others. How this affects the sound will depend on the design of the speaker itself. This is exactly why it is important to match the amplifier to the speaker. The complex nature of all these interactions is also why it is best to use your ears to choose an amplifier instead of just looking at specs... If you can't audition the amplifier with your speakers, at least ask someone who has used the combination.
This is only one of many things that can "color" the sound, but my point is that this is not magic. The math backs up the claim that not all amplifiers sound the same.
Many that make the claim that all amplifiers sound the same like to cite Ohm's law as an example. The claim is that for a given load (an 8 ohm speaker for example), watts equals volts times amps so there is no possible way a large amplifier can deliver more current at a given power level than a small amplifier. Sure, this part is true. But there is more to the picture. For the sake of discussion, we'll ignore the fact that the math is more complicated for a speaker due to the fact that this is an *impedance* we're talking about, not a resistance.
So, given all this, the math says an amplifier will put twice the power into a 4 ohm load versus an 8 ohm load. Yet if you look at the specifications of many well respected amplifiers, this is usually not the case. Why? Because an amplifier isn't a perfect constant voltage source. As the current drawn from the amplifier goes up, the voltage drops a bit. How much it drops depends on the amplifier design.
Most users of this forum will already know that the resistance (impedance really) of a speaker varies with the input frequency. This interacts with the amplifier by dropping the voltage, and thus the wattage, more for certain frequencies rather than others. Some amplifiers will be better at "holding up" the voltage at the lower points in the speaker's impedance curve than others. How this affects the sound will depend on the design of the speaker itself. This is exactly why it is important to match the amplifier to the speaker. The complex nature of all these interactions is also why it is best to use your ears to choose an amplifier instead of just looking at specs... If you can't audition the amplifier with your speakers, at least ask someone who has used the combination.
This is only one of many things that can "color" the sound, but my point is that this is not magic. The math backs up the claim that not all amplifiers sound the same.
Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
Comments
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No offense, but most here already know amps don't sound the same. It's a topic beaten to death over 20 years. Wish I could say the same for other forums who proclaim this, along with all dacs sound the same, cables don't matter, and a host of other kooky conclusions.
If you recently learned this, good for you on moving forward. Keep an open mind and let your ears judge.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Dude, buy that Parasound and call it a day.The best way to predict the future is to invent it.
It is imperative that we recognize that an opinion is not a fact. -
Sorry if I missed it, but every topic I have seen here where it has been debated, people just say "no that's not true", and never really get into *why*. I just thought it would be interesting to get some of those reasons put out there. I'll drop it thenNo offense, but most here already know amps don't sound the same. It's a topic beaten to death over 20 years.
Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505 -
I will be doing just that... I asked about the comparison between those amps on here because I live in a podunk town where it would be difficult for me to audition before I buy, and there's a high likelihood that people here have used bothmotorhead43026 wrote: »Dude, buy that Parasound and call it a day.Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505 -
I was referring to the ancient question you put forth about "do all amps sound the same" No they don't, is why you were advised to buy the Parasound.The best way to predict the future is to invent it.
It is imperative that we recognize that an opinion is not a fact. -
Sorry if I missed it, but every topic I have seen here where it has been debated, people just say "no that's not true", and never really get into *why*. I just thought it would be interesting to get some of those reasons put out there. I'll drop it thenNo offense, but most here already know amps don't sound the same. It's a topic beaten to death over 20 years.
If you go back far enough in the archives, you'll find many reasons. Gets old rehashing the same stuff from the naysayers who read an article on the web proclaiming the opposite. Many of us avoid these topics.
In todays day, the internet is a great tool, but it can also be confusing to some with limited experiences. Audio is the type of thing where ya have to get into the weeds, you just can't sit on the sidelines and read internet articles and make judgement calls based on that.
Most members who participate here, are well into the weeds of audio. Hang around, ask questions, join the fray and have some fun along the way. Welcome to the forum.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Fair enough.If you go back far enough in the archives, you'll find many reasons. Gets old rehashing the same stuff from the naysayers who read an article on the web proclaiming the opposite. Many of us avoid these topics.
Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505 -
Subjective hobby is subjective...who'da thunk it!?
Not meant to be rude, just an observation.
Too many people take this hobby as something that has to be measurable to make an impact.
But it is subjective experiences that make this hobby what it is.
The same way some people think cilantro tastes like soap or that Gin tastes gross, some people enjoy clinical reproduction of sound while others want something more warm and well rounded instead.
As has been said time and time again here and elsewhere, "Stop overthinking it and just enjoy your music."
It is, after all, what makes *your* ears happy in the end that really matters. Everything else is flotsam and jetsam."Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."
"Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
