Crazy vintage prices
F1nut
Posts: 50,551
Maybe it's me, but $4k for a vintage receiver is just crazy. Says professionally serviced, yet the phono section still needs work. Seriously, for that coin it better look and play flawlessly.
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/receivers-pioneer-sx-1980-receiver-2017-04-06-vintage-equipment-01062-florence-ma
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/receivers-pioneer-sx-1980-receiver-2017-04-06-vintage-equipment-01062-florence-ma
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk
Comments
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Yep, those Pioneers bring stupid amounts of money. I'm with you. One could buy something way better for the same coin.
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Yup, any of the big power receivers are going for $$$$
I don't get it, but it is what it is. Yes they are neat, but not 4k neat."The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson -
The Sansui beast is pretty spendy too isn't it? Something something 9000?afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
The problem with SX-1980 is -- that it doesn't sound very good.
Other than that... it's OK, I guess.
Definitely from the "more is more" school of thought.
SX-1980p1 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr
According to these guys, the MSRP in 1978 was $1295 (but I didn't pull out any old catalog to double-check). http://classicreceivers.com/pioneer-sx-1980
FWIW - and any of you who would care about this know this already - it wasn't the "most powerful [stereo] receiver ever". The SX-1980 was rated at 270 wpc (per FTC 1974 regulations). The Technics SA-1000 (which wasn't nearly as nicely built as the Pioneer, FWIW) was the big sweepstakes winner at an FTC-compliant rating of 330 wpc.
They don't sound too good, either.
SA1000 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr Post edited by mhardy6647 on -
Yeah, thought it was a bit bizarre myself.Basis 2200 Signature, Vector 4, Transfiguration Proteus, Allnic H3000, Meridian 200/563, CJ ET5, McIntosh 501's, Thiel CS6, 3.6, Polk SDA SRS 2.3tl, MIT EVO, KS/Wywires PC's
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I posted a public question on his ad calling him a fraud and a scammer for quoting the original price as $5199. His response was he had the receipt from purchasing it somewhere for that price (yeah, ok) and that I could just deal with it. I posted again that he wasn't a fraud but an idiot for purchasing a unit for $5199 with a non working phono section and then turning around and selling it for $4000. DEALT WITH IT.
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I posted a public question on his ad calling him a fraud and a scammer for quoting the original price as $5199. His response was he had the receipt from purchasing it somewhere for that price (yeah, ok) and that I could just deal with it. I posted again that he wasn't a fraud but an idiot for purchasing a unit for $5199 with a non working phono section and then turning around and selling it for $4000. DEALT WITH IT.
Maybe he has a time machine... or maybe he's just an a$$ hole...
"Conservative Libertarians love the country, progressive leftists love the government." - Andrew Wilkow
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
The Sansui beast is pretty spendy too isn't it? Something something 9000?
The 9090db always go for a good price on Ebay.
Back in the Day (t.m.), in the mid 70's I was looking at Sansui gear. I wound up getting an AU-11000A integrated and a TU-9900 tuner. I had looked at the Sansui BA-5000 amp that had, at the time some pretty good reviews. But being as I hadn't made admiral yet, I had to lower my sights somewhat. I would have had to go with the CA-3000 which was a "little" bit more than I could afford. The integrated/tuner I think I paid a total of $280/$220, total of $500.
Here's what the BA-5000 goes for on Ebay:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/SANSUI-BA-5000-Stereo-Power-600-Watts-RMS-Vintage-1975-Profesional-50kg-Like-New-/231831683841?hash=item35fa3ec301:g:ktsAAOSwsW9YxWuE
I'm not sure what 5000 Euros translates into, but I'm sure that isn't cheap.
Sal Palooza -
Roughly $5325.00.
That amp has a big fan on the back, bet it's not quiet either.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
It was up for a bit, then he removed it. Same with the follow up. Hey, if someone is dumb enough to buy it more power to him.
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With "Free Enterprise"some prefer to base their pricing relying on the motto "there's one born every minute!" And in situations such as these ones all that's needed!
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Those are crazy prices.
I have been wanting to put a vintage system together, something like what my dad had, but just can't bring myself to spend the kind of money it will take to get what I want. And then I will need to have it serviced and updated.2 Channel Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II, 2 REL Carbon Limited, Norma Revo IPA-140B, Lumin U2 Mini, VPI Prime w/SoundSmith Zephyr MIMC, Modwright PH 150, Denon DP-59l w/Denon DL-301MKII, WAY Silver 3 Ana+ Speaker Cables, WAY Silver 4+ Interconnect Cables, AudioQuest Niagara 7000 w/Dragon and Hurricane Power Cables -
Those are crazy prices.
I have been wanting to put a vintage system together, something like what my dad had, but just can't bring myself to spend the kind of money it will take to get what I want. And then I will need to have it serviced and updated.
Like what kind of hardware, if I might be so bold to ask?
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Maybe it's me, but $4k for a vintage receiver is just crazy. Says professionally serviced, yet the phono section still needs work. Seriously, for that coin it better look and play flawlessly.
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/receivers-pioneer-sx-1980-receiver-2017-04-06-vintage-equipment-01062-florence-ma
That has to be a misprint??...You can get a worked over MC 240 for less than that..and infinitely better gear too... -
"One of the best receivers ever made..." Yeah, right.
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HT- Samsung PN50B860/Integra DTR 30.3/Rt55 Fronts
Rt35i Surrounds/Cs1000p Center/SVS BP1000 Sub
2CH - B&K MC-101 pre/B&K EX-442 amp/NAD 2400 amp
Polk SDA1C, Polk Monitor 7, New Large Advents and Polk RTA 8T
BR - Yamaha CR800/Polk monitor 5 -
mrbigbluelight wrote: »I wound up getting an AU-11000A integrated and a TU-9900 tuner.
That Tu-9900 brings almost 1000.00 at times now. VERY NICE tuner. I know folks at FMtunerinfo.com who PUT 1000.00 into having them rebuilt ground up like we do here with our speakers.
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Dynaco ST 70 Year Introduced:1959
Price:$99.95 kit
$129.95 assembled . Makes this look like a real bargain.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dynaco-ST-70-Vintage-Tube-Amplifier-/292074562636?hash=item440100244c:g:wOMAAOSwc-tY4TBW -
mrbigbluelight wrote: »I wound up getting an AU-11000A integrated and a TU-9900 tuner.
That Tu-9900 brings almost 1000.00 at times now. VERY NICE tuner. I know folks at FMtunerinfo.com who PUT 1000.00 into having them rebuilt ground up like we do here with our speakers.
Yep I paid 1G for my TU9900 modded, aligned and mint about 8 years ago. I'm quite happy with that purchase for sure as it is a great performer. But I can't for the life of me see the value in a stock and crummy sounding 70's monster receiver. Must be for bragging rights for the owner to someone else that also sees value in that sort of thing I'm guessing. -
motorstereo wrote: »mrbigbluelight wrote: »I wound up getting an AU-11000A integrated and a TU-9900 tuner.
That Tu-9900 brings almost 1000.00 at times now. VERY NICE tuner. I know folks at FMtunerinfo.com who PUT 1000.00 into having them rebuilt ground up like we do here with our speakers.
But I can't for the life of me see the value in a stock and crummy sounding 70's monster receiver. Must be for bragging rights for the owner to someone else that also sees value in that sort of thing I'm guessing.
Agree for sure. Those specs they always listed were pipe dreams at best for most. -
The SX1980 weighs nearly 80 pounds. My B&K weighs 42 pounds and does 225 watts. I realize weight isn't the only factor but 270 watts out of the Pioneer isn't a stretch IMO.afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
Oh it would "do" 270 watts, into an 8 ohm resistive (noninductive) load. It would do it after the FTC mandated preconditioning (30 minutes, if memory serves) at 1/3 of full output power. These were (are) "sine wave" tests and very brutal relative to 'real' music signal waveforms. It would even "do" 270 watts at its rated distortion level from 20 Hz to 20 kHz.
But...
Haven't you learned that it's not all about how many watts, especially under contrived (if brutal) measurement conditions?
More to life than watts.
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mhardy6647 wrote: »Haven't you learned that it's not all about how many watts, especially under contrived (if brutal) measurement conditions?
More to life than watts.
Mr. Hardy, how in the world did you come to the conclusion that's what I think by my rebuttal to "the specs are a pipe dream"?afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
motorstereo wrote: »]...But I can't for the life of me see the value in a stock and crummy sounding 70's monster receiver. Must be for bragging rights for the owner to someone else that also sees value in that sort of thing I'm guessing.
Agreed - if you are restoring one of the behemoths, you'd best be doing it for purely historical and aesthetic reasons. In that respect, it's much the same as restoring old cars...
"Conservative Libertarians love the country, progressive leftists love the government." - Andrew Wilkow
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
mhardy6647 wrote: »Those are crazy prices.
I have been wanting to put a vintage system together, something like what my dad had, but just can't bring myself to spend the kind of money it will take to get what I want. And then I will need to have it serviced and updated.
Like what kind of hardware, if I might be so bold to ask?
Some version of SDA's. Not the big boys as I have already had a pair but something smaller that will be more room friendly in a smaller room (16x14'ish).
Amp, Preamp and tuner from either Pioneer, Marantz or McIntosh.
Technics SL-1200.
I am really not that picky but would like it to be in good condition and sound relatively good. This is more for me and my dad to spend time tinkering with than main listening. Something that is closer to what he was building when I was a kid in the late 70's.
2 Channel Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II, 2 REL Carbon Limited, Norma Revo IPA-140B, Lumin U2 Mini, VPI Prime w/SoundSmith Zephyr MIMC, Modwright PH 150, Denon DP-59l w/Denon DL-301MKII, WAY Silver 3 Ana+ Speaker Cables, WAY Silver 4+ Interconnect Cables, AudioQuest Niagara 7000 w/Dragon and Hurricane Power Cables -
I am in to vintage equipment and the prices do continue to go up more and more at least for the top tier vintage receivers. After all this is a finite, high demand, product. The vintage units themselves, parts and the people who restore these are becoming harder and harder to find, so supply and demand is going to dictate the market and price.
People can advertise and put any price they want on a vintage piece, but what they actually end up selling these for is often a different reality. Occasionally, they might find a fish to bite at a ridiculous price, but often these pieces go unsold or the seller ends up making a deal for a much lower price.
High end, fully restored vintage receivers can hold their own in the sound department, but the real hook is in the styling and nostalgia that goes along with it. Being a music lover and stereo equipment lover in my youth, I always wanted those high end receivers I could never afford when I was younger. It is no different from those who wanted that muscle car in their youth and now have the disposable income to make it a reality.
In my neck of the woods, there are certainly a lot more old farts driving sports cars than teenagers and the same holds true for high end vintage stereo equipment. What price can you put on recapturing a bit of your youth?Living Room
Parasound Model 2250v2 amplifier
Parasound P5 preamp
Turntable 1 - Technics SL-1210Mk2 turntable with Shure V-15 Type III cartridge
Turntable 2 - Dual 1229 turntable, Dual AS-12 45 RPM stacker, Shure V-15 Type III cartridge
Schiit Mani Phono Preamp for Turntable 2
Oppo UDP-205 CD/SACD USB and FLAC duties
Technics RS-1500US reel to reel
Polk SDA SRS (2nd Gen) fully modded -
The SX1980 weighs nearly 80 pounds. My B&K weighs 42 pounds and does 225 watts. I realize weight isn't the only factor but 270 watts out of the Pioneer isn't a stretch IMO.
yes some were close to or on the rated specs, but it got to the point where the FTC stepped in to reign in the hyperbole on some of them. A lot of them were heavier back then they were built with heavy steel gauge chassis, thick Aluminum fronts and had real plywood wood, big laminated power suppliers. But some didn't have the caps to store some of that power. Some if my memory serves correctly might of been able to hit 300wpc at 9/10's of a microsecond at a certain frequency is all I meant. Sadly some overheated and shut down if ran very long I seen it way too many times at parties i went to back in the day.
If that is your cup of tea go for it they are and were pretty, had oodles of switches that got noisy, volume pots that got noisy and so forth. Not worth the prices being asked IMHO. -
mhardy6647 wrote: »Haven't you learned that it's not all about how many watts, especially under contrived (if brutal) measurement conditions?
More to life than watts.
Mr. Hardy, how in the world did you come to the conclusion that's what I think by my rebuttal to "the specs are a pipe dream"?
Well, there's a good question!
I guess I didn't recognize it was rebuttal to the post suggesting the SX-1980 wouldn't meet its specs.
Sorry!
(I do get a little antsy whenever I see even an implicit comparison between weight and power output -- or, even more so, between weight and quality. Electrovoice really did add a piece of steel plate to the underside of a component once to add weight to improve its perceived "quality". And, mind you, EV, by and large, produced quality components of many kinds.)
So, on the "specs" topic, then
Any given, factory-fresh SX-1980 almost certainly would "meet its specs"!
The only problem is how it would sound in so doing.
Case in point -- ultra-low THD levels obtained by crudely-applied (or simply over-applied) negative feedback.
By the second half of the 1970s, for most of the 'big names', the quest to measure good (and to look good) had largely outstripped the quest to sound good.
In fairness to the (mostly Japanese) hifi companies of the era -- they were responding to their market (particulary in the U.S.). Most of us (yeah, myself included, in those long-ago times - much as it chafes me to admit it!) were way more interested in the numbers on the back of the brochures, and the number of knobs, buttons, and colored lights -- than the way things sounded.
As long as they were loud and made bass and treble, most customers were happy.
The SX-1980 and its ilk catered to that market.
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Easy Runnin wrote: »
At least that one is in excellent physical and working condition unlike the eBay Pioneer.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I avoid the big power receivers for this reason. Too much $$$$.
Mid power integrated amps are still not cheap, but certainly not
in the 4 figure range."The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson
