Enclosed cabinet heat issue - your experience?

polkatese

Gents.
as some of you know, I have a highly modded Philips SACD1000, that has undergone tube transplant and DAC doubling in all multichannel. Sonically, it sounds amazing, but it generates heat like a power amp. I have installed a RS fan, coupled with a wallwart. It works great in cooling the player. I have a couple of questions that I ponder:

1. The player will exhibit statics distortion in the output stage (in the front two channel, hence it gotta be the main L&R output), when I forget to plug in the fan (usually after 3-4 hours of extended play) in a warm sunny afternoon (it has been unseasonably warm around SoCall lately) When it happened, I would stop it, reset, and it will be fine again. I am sure is due to heat: if the fan is on, it plays forever (longer than 8 hours at times) without exhibiting the problem. Based on this symptom, do I have to be concern that damage has been done? should I have it checked? other than this problem, everything else is a ok (i.e. superb 2 and multi channels quality)

2. Is there a way to rig the fan to be turning on and off, using the 12v trigger of the B&K ref 50? I need to find a way to cost-effectively implement a solution for this. I looked into the Elan ZFan2 option, but have to rule it out due to the cost overkill ($299 for the unit, which basically do exactly the same, with the benefit of having it controlled by the trigger, and perhaps a tad quieter).

Any idea would be appreciated...TIA

steveinaz

Active Thermal Solutions makes a number of fan set-ups for audio gear that have thermostat switching as an option. The fans run at half speed, so the units are very quiet. The fans were so quiet that I removed the thermistor and just ran them anytime I switched the amp on.

http://www.activethermal.com/default.htm

organ

Is the transport enclosed in its own chssis? If so, you can try operating the player with the cover off. I'm afraid that the constant hot/cold cycles could damage or shorten the lifespan of your equipment. Extreme heat could alter the values of resistors, caps, etc.

The static you're hearing could be the op amp or diode running when it's not suppose to due to heat build up. The usually require arond 0.7V to begin condcting but extreme heat could make them conduct. Heat is a friend of vacuum tubes but an enemy of SS equipments.

Have you thought about installing another fan? Try to contact the person who performed the mod and tell him about your problem.

Maurice

phoneisbusy

Does the B&K have a switched outlet? If so, could you plug the wall wart into that for the time being? Or are you looking for a more polished looking solution?


regards

Dave

sowen010599

I use three of these in my cabinet... http://www.directron.com/4312mv.html Noise: 22db(A)

I have them wired to a wall-wart, which is plugged into an extension cord, which is plugged into the switched power on the Yamaha RX-V2400. From about 4 feet away, I can't hear them running, even when the volume is muted. Just make sure you have plenty of exhaust area. If the exhaust is restrictive in any way, pressure will build to a small extent in the cabinet and those fans get LOUD!

By aware fans amplify the dust problem by an enormous amount. After only a few weeks, everything needs to be cleaned out and we never have dust on anything else in our house. My wife keeps it spotless.

brettw22

Without seeing exactly what kind of entertainment center you have, I can't give you an exact suggestion, but look HERE at my system showcase to see what I did to solve my problem with heat buildup on my B&K.

Personally, I think that it's a HORRIBLE idea to plug anything with a running motor into your electronics. You're only asking for problems, in addition to noise created in the line. Bad all the way around IMO.

You have to be careful about what kind of fan you get if you install something like I did. I went and bought a 4" fan from Fry's and when I plugged that thing in, it sounded like my whole entertainment center was about to take off and float. I didn't use speed control and I refused to try to tame that beast. I kind of happened into some fans from when we closed some of our stores, and I do have a few extra if you'd be interested. You'd just have to go to Home Depot and purchase a short little 3' cord and plug to make it work. That's something like $3 in parts max.....

sowen010599

Well, ordinarily I would agree. BUT these are computer fans and being such, they have to be electrically noise-free (or nearly so). Computers are VERY susceptible to electrical noise and, on top of that, the fans are directly connected to the motherboard (or a pass-through connector, no transformer here baby). Any noise generated would be directly transferred to the motherboard, resulting in extraordinary system instability.

Most motors (DC and some AC) are brushed. Brushes cause small arcs (sparks) as the brushes ride along the commutator. Arcs cause RF interference. If you have a drill, you can see the arcs (blue sparks) when you operate it.

Computer fans, as well as hard-drives, CD drives, anywhere RF interference would be undesirable, use brush-less motors. In a brush-less motor, a small computer chip, a sensor, and a transistor (sometimes several) power the coils, instead of brushes. It uses a sensor to monitor the armature’s position and power the coils in sequence. With this type of motor, nothing contacts the armature except for the bearings, therefore, no arcs, no electrical noise, no arcs no RF interference.

CD players use the same type of motor to spin the CD. You wouldn't hesitate to use one of those would you?

With computer fans, smaller generally equals louder. The 4" fan you used (probably an 80mm fan) is probably a regular old case fan. 80mm fans are anything but subtle. They tend to be very loud. Generally speaking, larger fans are quieter. They do not have to spin as fast to move an adequate amount of air. Lower RPM's means less turbulence, less turbulence means less noise. Since the "silent computer" movement started a few years ago, fans stated getting labeled (in db). That way you can easily discern the loud ones from the quiet ones, and make and informed purchase. Some don't care about noise, they want CFM. Others are more concerned with noise, thus the label. Some of the larger fans (120mm) are very quiet. Some are so quiet in fact, you can't hear them unless you put your ear right next to it. Fan controllers are also available so you can slow them down even further for even less noise.

polkatese

Thanks guys for the recommendations!

Steveinaz, I will check out the link, looks promising!

Maurice, with the fan on, I don't experience the problem, so I am hoping that there is no permanent damage so far, nevertheless, I am concern. The modder thought that it shouldn't because of the heat, but he might not aware of what kind of enclosed cabinet I have. There is no ventilation in the back, the only opening is from the front (it has glass door, but never really used them for obvious reason)

Dave, B&K ref50 doesn't have switched outlet at all, so, I have it connected to Panamax 5500, the downside it is a manual process (plug-in plug out) I could live fine with it, as long as I can turn it on in tandem with the player/preamp.

Sowen, I have a similar setup such as yours, it sits on top of the player right now, blowing air out to the front opening.

Brett, The cabinet is part of a wall unit (pics are on my showcase). Thanks for the offer, I might take advantage of it once I figured out a way to have it triggered by the preamp/power.

phoneisbusy

Too bad about the lack of a switched outlet. I remembered there use to be a product for my sander that would turn on the vacuum when the sander went on. I can't for the life of me remember what it's called. Of course, I'm not sure of the sensitivity.

How about one of these?

http://www.asihome.net/rsact1.html

I happened upon it while I was googl'ing for the power tool triggered outlet search. Kinda pricey but maybe there's a cheaper model?

regards

Dave