Please Help. New AVR and AMP to power Rti10

New2PolkFanatic

Hey guys, its been awhile and I am here seeking some help and or advice. I just recently upgraded my AVR to a new Yamaha RX-a3050 from an Onkyo TX-NR1010. I also picked up a used Parasound Hca-2205a amplifier (excellent reviews). I still consider myself pretty new to all of this and I am hoping someone can chime in.

Setup;

AVR Yamaha RX-a3050
Fronts- Rti10
Center- Csi A6
Rears- Fxi A6
Sub- DWS Pro600
Power Amplifier- Parasound hca-2205a (220watts@5ch)
Sony PS4 for Blu-ray

I was running the entire system with just the AVR and with the Rti10 Bi-amped (through the receiver only) and everything sounded pretty decent. I knew that I would need an external Amp if I wanted the full potential of the speakers to shine and so I went ahead and found the 5 channel Parasound Amp (85lbs. beast).

Here are my questions; I have the 2 RTi10's and CsiA6 center plugged into the amp and the Yamaha AVR powering the 2 rear FXI A6's, and the sound barely improved? I was listening to the Rti10's in 2channel music, and although the music slightly improved, I had to crank the volume up pretty high to hear any improvements? The volume was at -15dcb (-75 lowest up to +16 max). I am not sure if this is normal or not, or if something is wrong but I am pretty frustrated. This is my first time ever using an Amplifier, and from all of the readings I've done, my system should sound completely awesome and much better than ever. Maybe my expectations are just too high, but the sound quality did not improve much at all. Any advice or suggestions on what I need to do? Thanks guys.

Willow

Your RXA is a higher end AVR, with that said most stand alone amps should/will yield a better over all sound. Couple things, are the polarities connected correctly? after installing the amp did you run YPAO again? is there a gain dial on the back of that amp?
FYI, I have the 1010 with a Rotel 1075 (not for long) and that amp made a huge difference with my Rti8,csi5 and rti6 and svs sub at the time I was using them.

mrloren

Turn the input knobs on the amp to full. re-run the speaker setup on the receiver. adjust the input on the amp till all your speakers are at 0db on speaker setup.

or you could be nice and give me the parasound

polrbehr

I don't think anything is wrong. I had a similar experience years ago, when I added an Adcom GFA555 2-channel amp to use with my front RTi10s, with similar results. Somewhat better sound, but not the night and day change I thought would happen. However, one thing I really did notice was the higher frequencies were a lot more tolerable once the Adcom was added; music became smoother, without any fatigue at higher (not nearly ear-piercing) volumes.

Where I believe the real benefits happen from adding an amp- more headroom, in that you will have much less chance to damage [by overdriving] your speakers even at moderate volume. And, you will also put much less strain on your AVRs power supply, as it will not be needed to drive the speakers, and produce much less heat. Since you have a 5-ch amp, I would go ahead and hook up the surrounds to that as well.

msg

Agreed with mrloren on gain knobs on the amp, for starters, and other recommendations for your AVR settings. You might even consider a factory reset just for good measure, and skip the calibration tool for now until you see whether you can find a satisfactory setup with minor adjustments.

Can you be a little more specific about what your expectations are, and what you feel is missing?

How is your room set up? Carpeted or bare floors?

Sharing a little of my own experience, I started with the RTi10's myself, along a similar path as you, and also added a 2205 amp, which I still use. I never could get the RTi10's sounding acceptable for music no matter the equipment I tried.

At the very least, if your amp is set up correctly, the RTi10's should be more impactful. It won't do much for the brightness though, I'm afraid. That's what I was hoping for when I added the Parasound, myself, but it really didn't do much in the way of taming highs or adding warmth, not with those speakers. Also, general consensus is that a Yamaha front end with RTi10's adds to the brightness. If you're set on keeping the RTi10's you may have to employ a bit of tone control. Even with that I always found them too crunchy. I enjoyed them for tv though.

I ended up switching to Monitor 10's for a while and then LSiM703's, both of which were better suited for music, imo.
I've tried switching in the RTi10's periodically over the past couple of years, but still too bright for my ears.

mdaudioguy

I have a similar setup with RTi10s, a similar Yamaha AVR, and an Adcom amp. -15 is fairly loud and where I would set it for enjoying an action movie. In any case, the amp should be adding clarity, not volume. However, increased clarity (less distortion) will allow for more comfortable listening at higher volume. Basically, what polrbehr said. msg and mrloren also make some good recommendations regarding proper setup, which is important.

mdaudioguy

Fyi, I agree with msg about lower end Yamahas adding to the RTi brightness, however, that is not my experience with the upper end Aventage line.

I've used at least 6 different AVRs with these speakers and am very satisfied with my RX-A2040.

New2PolkFanatic

Thanks guys for your response, I greatly appreciate it. The amp input volume knobs are all set to max. The room is carpeted and the system is in my living room (kitchen connected to it too) which is a fairly large room but my seating is only 10 feet in front. I've gone back to double check and triple check all wires (I even bought some expensive AudioQuest RCA interconnect wires) to make sure everything was plugged in correctly. If I listen to music in 2 channel without the sub, I get very little bass (speakers set to large).

I ran the YPAO auto calibration (YPAO allows me to make manual adjustments and save it). I kept all the speakers at small and 80mhz (YPAO had everything at large). The speaker level are currently +1 db for all speakers except the sub which is -2db.

My expectations were for the speakers to sound louder and clearer, but also at a lower volume setting. For example, before I bought the Parasound, the guy had it playing only through a CD Preamp with the volume knob at 20% and it sounded great. For me to achieve the same sound, I have to crank my volume up to a least 80%.

mdaudioguy, do you mind sending me your manual settings that you have for your speakers?

Also, I lost the brass plate connecters to the RTI10's when I was Bi-Amping them, but I read somewhere that I can just attached a speaker wire and connect the red-red and black-black?

mdaudioguy

I can do that next time I'm home. However, very little bass in 2-channel mode sounds strange. How about Pure Direct mode, which I believe eliminates sending any signal to the sub? Mine sound pretty decent in full-range Pure Direct.

mdaudioguy

Hold on... You have no jumpers in place???

You can use short lengths of speaker wire. I'm hoping you have them in place. If not, that's the problem.

New2PolkFanatic

No jumpers, but I have speaker wires connecting them in place of the jumpers. Is that do-able?

mdaudioguy

New2PolkFanatic wrote: »

No jumpers, but I have speaker wires connecting them in place of the jumpers. Is that do-able?

Yes. I actually have mine like that too.

Willow

Set them to small. All of them

New2PolkFanatic

Willow wrote: »

Set them to small. All of them

Hey Willow, I have them all set to small, what speaker setting would you recommend? I have them at +1db all around and -2db for the sub.

Willow

Did you run ypao again?

New2PolkFanatic

Willow wrote: »

Did you run ypao again?

Yes, I have ran YPAO again, but it keeps putting all of my speakers to large (I switch them all back down to small at 80hz each).

mrloren

cut your fronts over to 60 or 40hz

mrloren

you will need to play with the HZ for a bit. I found my RTi8's are crossed over at 60hz sound best. turn your sub up so it is 0db. Once you YPAO to 0DB that is when to start changing stuff.

For the most part I am at -15db on music or movies.

Willow

Same when I had my rti8 they were crossed over at 60 for my mains and 80 for all others if it is an option . Once you run the ypao , did you use multiple sitting spots? Either way, run it so it can do its thing then set them all to small. Also what Source are you watching or listening to? Say a bluray I tend to have to have it up to -30. Netflix is about -40. You don't compression or night time mode on do you?

New2PolkFanatic

Willow wrote: »

Same when I had my rti8 they were crossed over at 60 for my mains and 80 for all others if it is an option . Once you run the ypao , did you use multiple sitting spots? Either way, run it so it can do its thing then set them all to small. Also what Source are you watching or listening to? Say a bluray I tend to have to have it up to -30. Netflix is about -40. You don't compression or night time mode on do you?

I don't think I do, but I am still so new with this receiver that I wouldn't even know if I did or not to be honest. How would I know?

Nightfall

Press the "Option" button on the remote, go to "Adaptive DRC", make sure it's off.

tonyb

I'll throw my .02 in....

If you want more bass from the speakers, set them to large plus sub.....or without the sub just to see. Having a subwoofer in the mix, with speakers set to small won't present the amp with a load big enough to get the juices flowing imho. The subwoofer is taking all the heavy lifting away from the amp, which may be why you don't hear too much of a difference.

Put the receiver in pure direct mode for 2 channel.

Since you used speaker wire as the replaced jumpers on the speakers, make sure it's the same gage as the other speaker wire if not more. Make sure, if the ends are bare wire, none of that wire is touching another post or other wire. Also make sure none of the plastic coating on the wire is caught inside any of the connecting posts.

If your speakers don't rock with the above done, something else is amiss.

New2PolkFanatic

Hey guys, much thanks to all that chimed in and gave some very helpful advise. I just took the plunge and purchased a new pair of lsim705 along with a lsim706c. I am pretty happy with the sound quality and stage presence of these awesome speakers.

gp4jesus

I'll throw this out there: your (former) system may be louder than you think because of grossly improved SQ. It's easier to do than you know.

I recently finished I triamping my LR. That, due my chosen amp config, tripled their available power*. In spite of that*, WE tend to run the volume HIGHER these days per my pre/pro's output setting. My CC triamp is in progress. When finished, in spite of another significant power increase (2X+!), I'm confident we'll be cranking it higher still as yet another source will have way cleaner output.

My $.02. Tony