Rare bird found... Popes
Joey_V
Posts: 8,552
Finally I was able to source 4 pieces of Pope tubes.
Took me months of searching but found 4 a few weeks ago.
Seller was very tough negotiator but I was finally able to break through.
Here they are... I can smell the oldness of the vintage boxes.
Ahhh....
*sneeze*
Took me months of searching but found 4 a few weeks ago.
Seller was very tough negotiator but I was finally able to break through.
Here they are... I can smell the oldness of the vintage boxes.
Ahhh....
*sneeze*
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R
Comments
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Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Pope is rebrander. Probably Heerlen Holland. Be interested to see the tube codes to see who actually manufactured them. Might be able to tell by the construction as well.
The only Euro 6SN7 is made by Brimar and possibly one made by Valvo Hamburg and Holland, but I am going on memory here, foggy at that.
Let's see some photo's of the tubes and codes.
H9Post edited by heiney9 on"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
......"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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The Brimar is an excellent 6SL7 among the best, but American 6SN7's and 6SL7's are about the best around. The early Tung Sol's and Sylvania's are superb. Also look for the RCA 5691 (6SL7) and 5692 (6SN7), superb as well.
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
Most likely made in Holland. They are nice tubes. They should have flat, ladder plates.
Pope like Ediswan and Adzam were arms of the Philips conglomerate."Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
yes would also like to see them.
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I hope they live up to the hype. Tubes are a funny little corner of audio. All it takes is a bit of internet chatter on a particular tube and all of a sudden the price sky rockets, the supply becomes scarce and after a while the legend is born. Sometimes the legend is deserved, many times it's not.
Did you get a chance to hear them before you took the plunge? Not those per se, but ones like it? I have a couple holy grail tubes that I bought and then thought WTF.
Good luck, I hope they are your last stop for that piece of gear Joey. A quad of those doesn't come cheap if they are the real deal
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
H9
Looks like the real deal as I compared the plates to others on the Internet. There are no markings on the glass though but the box has all the markings from
Upscale audio and it looks to be tested and within their highest parameters.
I will take a pic when I get home.
Where are these numbers you speak about? At the base?Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Usually acid etched on the glass towards the bottom. If they are from Upscale, they are the real deal unless someone faked the sticker.
Nice grab, they should sound real nice.
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
None of mine had numbers etched in glass all were on the plastic base in print. Brock is this a European thing? I have not had the privilege to get any European tubes. Reason I asked is I know that the Soviet and other Iron Curtain types of 6SN7 also had the date/lot numbers on the plastic bases also.
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I gotta look closely... No white markings on the glass that I recall
I called Kevin from upscale just now to see if he knows of pope tubes without the white marking on the glass...
His response:
"Dude you're calling me about some tubes you got on the used market? I got 2 customers in 2 sound rooms."
Great guy.
What a loser.Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
None of mine had numbers etched in glass all were on the plastic base in print. Brock is this a European thing? I have not had the privilege to get any European tubes. Reason I asked is I know that the Soviet and other Iron Curtain types of 6SN7 also had the date/lot numbers on the plastic bases also.
You got popes too?Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Here is the tube with the markings on the glass... Not mine...
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Mine better be real or I'm going to be pissed. I paid good money for themMagico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R
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Yes, etched on the glass or in the case of Brimar tubes the codes are painted on with the label. Or codes are inconspicuously painted on the front, or back or sides.
I just found a Pope tube (12AT7) that the box said made in Holland, the tube said made in Holland but the etched codes show the tube was made at the Blackburn Plant in England. It happens all the time with Philips tubes.
Finding/verifying tube codes is the only way (besides knowing construction) that you know for SURE what tube you are buying. There was sooooooooo much swaping of stock between brands and rebranders.
H9
P.s. I have a very rare and early ECC82 with the Telefunken label but it has a "D" getter, TFK's don't have d getters. It's actually a 1955 Siemens tube based on the codes, but I already knew that because of the construction. 2 staples per plate with the tabs in, D getter and cross hatch on the top.
TFK's don't have D getters and their plate staple tabs are always out, not in."Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
None of mine had numbers etched in glass all were on the plastic base in print. Brock is this a European thing? I have not had the privilege to get any European tubes. Reason I asked is I know that the Soviet and other Iron Curtain types of 6SN7 also had the date/lot numbers on the plastic bases also.
You got popes too?
nope but I have had more 6SN7 tubes that you can shake a stick at:)
Might see if you can run 6BL7 or 6BX7 there are some great triple mica tubes there that are dirt cheap and are good substitutions for 6SN7. Brent Jesse turned me on to those. -
I'm going to post the tubes and you examine them...
I wanna punch Kevin deal.Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Mine better be real or I'm going to be pissed. I paid good money for them
They most likely are, especially since they have Upscale stickers on them. But like I said just because it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck doesn't mean it's a duck. Many sellers aren't even aware of what they are selling.
I always ask questions, ask for many pics and if I'm not sure and it's a decent amount of $$$$, I pass.
One of the most erroneous tubes I see are true Black Plate Tung Sol 12AX7's. 99% of them are misidentified. They are ultra rare and were only made from the late 40's until about 1950. There are several identifiers to look for. Most people assume if it has the octagon on the tube it's a Tung Sol.
I have managed to hunt down 2 pairs, but it took me awhile since almost every sale I came across they were misidentified.
H9
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
I'm going to post the tubes and you examine them...
I wanna punch Kevin deal.
I've only spoken with the man on two occasions, both times I felt like he was "shaking me down" just to see how much money I had to spend.
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Mike Reeter wrote: »
Well I'm going to blast him on my other hi end forums.
And I am never buying from him nor am I letting my other local big spending buddies buy from upscale, ever.
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
might take a look here Brock just posted this seller for some other tubes. Some nice one here. I had read some good reviews for the MELZ tubes although they never came up in my price range. They are supposedly the better Soviet tubes besides the OTK's which I think are darn close to better Sylvania's which are pretty plentiful.
http://www.nostubestore.com/search/label/6SN7GT/6SN7WGT/5692/B65/VT-231 -
Appreciate it, but I use 6SL7's, they are close cousins to the 6SN7. Those MELZ tubes are supposed to be excellent. I have looked into the 6SL7 MELZ equivalent.
http://www.tubemaze.info/melz-6n8s6sn7-holes-in-plate/
http://www.tubemaze.info/melz-6n8s6sn7-gray-plates-holes-in-plate/"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
Mike Reeter wrote: »
Well I'm going to blast him on my other hi end forums.
And I am never buying from him nor am I letting my other local big spending buddies buy from upscale, ever.
It doesn't matter to him. He has enough people in the KD **** likkers club to keep him in business for years to come. I was trying to buy some tubes from him and he felt the need to try and belittle me. I spent my money elsewhere.If you can't hear a difference, don't waste your money. -
Mike Reeter wrote: »
Well I'm going to blast him on my other hi end forums.
And I am never buying from him nor am I letting my other local big spending buddies buy from upscale, ever.
It doesn't matter to him. He has enough people in the KD **** likkers club to keep him in business for years to come. I was trying to buy some tubes from him and he felt the need to try and belittle me. I spent my money elsewhere.
Maybe it doesn't matter to him, but he still sucksMagico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
I never had a problem with him, but he certainly has the reputation for being an a$$.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Appreciate it, but I use 6SL7's, they are close cousins to the 6SN7. Those MELZ tubes are supposed to be excellent. I have looked into the 6SL7 MELZ equivalent.
Yea I knew that. My sentence structure sucked I was referring to the OP. -
Mike Reeter wrote: »
Well I'm going to blast him on my other hi end forums.
And I am never buying from him nor am I letting my other local big spending buddies buy from upscale, ever.
It doesn't matter to him. He has enough people in the KD **** likkers club to keep him in business for years to come. I was trying to buy some tubes from him and he felt the need to try and belittle me. I spent my money elsewhere.
Maybe it doesn't matter to him, but he still sucks
I have dealt with him a couple of times. Actually bought my turntable from him. That transaction went fine. They we very helpful but I was buying a VPI Prime and Soundsmith cart.
On another occasion I was tube hunting for my SLP-05 and had an interest for the Pope's as well. He was rather obnoxious and told me since I did not purchase the SLP-05 from him he would sell me the tubes but only with a surcharge. I told him no thanks and went on my way.
Makes no difference to me how he runs his business but in the markets we are playing in I would think every customer counts.
Good luck with the tubes Joey. I would really like to hear your review of them.
2 Channel Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II, 2 REL Carbon Limited, Norma Revo IPA-140B, Lumin U2 Mini, VPI Prime w/SoundSmith Zephyr MIMC, Modwright PH 150, Denon DP-59l w/Denon DL-301MKII, WAY Silver 3 Ana+ Speaker Cables, WAY Silver 4+ Interconnect Cables, AudioQuest Niagara 7000 w/Dragon and Hurricane Power Cables -
On another occasion I was tube hunting for my SLP-05 and had an interest for the Pope's as well. He was rather obnoxious and told me since I did not purchase the SLP-05 from him he would sell me the tubes but only with a surcharge. I told him no thanks and went on my way.
Guess this guy has never heard that great customer service builds a bigger customer base to support your livelihood. What a crock to try and bend you over like that. Wonder if he does the same for possible customers coming in to buy cables and such.
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I guess that calling Joey for a long distance diagnosis for my next tummy ache when he has a waiting room full of patients is on my bucket list now....HT Optoma HD25 LV on 80" DIY Screen, Anthem MRX 300 Receiver, Pioneer Elite BDP 51FD Polk CS350LS, Polk SDA1C, Polk FX300, Polk RT55, Dual EBS Adire Shiva 320watt tuned to 17hz, ICs-DIY Twisted Prs, Speaker-Raymond Cable
2 Channel Thorens TD 318 Grado ZF1, SACD/CD Marantz 8260, Soundstream/Krell DAC1, Audio Mirror PP1, Odyssey Stratos, ADS L-1290, ICs-DIY Twisted , Speaker-Raymond Cable
