Eq question???

shrek001

Well sorry to report that my beloved audiosource eq 12 took a **** on me last night, it's about 5 years old and I have been running it pretty hard the last week, almost night and day trying to burn in my term 2's..

Question? now I know Eq's are a touchy subject, either you love'em or hate'em, and a true "AUDIOPHILE" would never use that crap right?? wrong!! anyway for those of you who have eq's could you give me some imput on some good quality eq's, I like audio source, and AudioControl, besides yammy, onkyo, and all of the reciever names, is there a company that makes a real good eq for around $500?? has to be at least 10 bands w/anaylizer, or seperate eq and anaylizer for the same price... any help would be appreciated......

RuSsMaN

....I love my ADC 'Sound Shaper' 20. Enough bells and whistles to be in a recording studio, pick one up used for under a Franklin.... (thanks George)....

I have heard good things about older BSR Eq's also.... Even had a Realistic 10 bander once, and it did what it was supposed to...

Nothing wrong with an EQ, its all about tailoring the sound to your tastes (or rooms for that matter).....

Cheers,
Russ

Ps, just checked eBay, lots of good deals on some ADC's right now.....

lbrenner

I have a bsr 4000xr which I'd recommend, if you can find one. It's got an analyzer, remote, 14 bands, 4 memories, subsonic filter switch, and can connect to two recorders and an external signal processor.

I hardly ever use it now, but the fact that it still works after all these years is certainly to its credit.

shrek001

looked for eq's on the web, didn't have much luck, picked up and audiosource 13 series II with mounting brackets, nice EQ.. put it in last night and made a huge difference, paid 69 dollars for it and it is as good as new, I have the denon avr5800 and I use it for my CD player, I can't listen to music without it.. instead of using the tape monitor loop, I just run my Cd player to the audio in and then out to the reciever, works just as good if not better, very little if any background noise(quiet) and I can control my soundfield except when I go direct PCM.. but I like analog for music, PCM is ok, I find it a little thin sounding and bright....


if your reciever or pre-amp doesen't have a tape monitor you can run it direct......

OrangeToupee

If your Denon is like mine (2802) all you've got are the bass and treble management. I agree that the default setting (both at zero db's) is flat and unfriendly for music listening. I had to knock my bass up to +6 and place my treble at +2 to get a better sense of the music. I would really like to add an eq, and I can't imagine why anyone wouldn't want/need one as well (I've read that eq's aren't regarded as apporpriate amongst audiophiles.) I think I'm confused about this subject, or maybe I don't understand my receiver well enough to get the best sound out of it.

George Grand

Check the Flea Market for a couple good used equalizers.

shrek001

I think thats a bunch of crap!!! I hear it also, but could you imagine how poor your pcm digital recordings would sound without equalization??? nobody points their fingers at them, it's really the people who have the krell monoblocks and genesis line of speakers, who spend 190,000 on the home stereo, thats right stereo who would never think of adding a piece of equipment that costs anywhere from 100-$500 dollars, but good news for them now if their room is sound proof or the sonic fabric isn't cutting it they can add the diva from audio control, price: $12,000 a total digital eq......

I used my slp meter and still I like the control of my 2 channel stereo(in analog!) that the eq gives me!! I can't handle how flat and thin and tinny it sounds without it... you can add the audio source 100 for $79 dollars from J&R, you do not need a tape monitor loop for it!! screw the tape and put your cd to the audio in and run the audio out to the reciever, for fun press the eq pass through button and see what you have been listening to, I guarantee you will wonder how you lived without it... by far the best improvement you could make for analog or stereo at any price!!

rskarvan

Hisssssssssssssssssss

shrek001

the hiss depends on the eq, lets face it go out to the wiz and buy a teac eq the hiss is quite loud, by any eq made by a major corp, yammy, denon, onkyo, sony, etc, you are going to get hiss.... buy an eq from a eq company, IE: audiocontrol and you will get a quality eq, with very little or no hiss, depending on the quality of the recording, the newer cd have no hiss to them, the older ones or the re-mastered have hiss, you can only do so much with an analog copy...... lets face it you bought speakers from polk( A speaker specialist) why would you buy an eq from sony??? or speakers from sony??

RuSsMaN

Two things.

1. Signal to noise ratio
2. Attenuation or boost of high frequencies

If you have hiss at 16Khz, and you boost it 3x over by 9db, expect to hear it (more). I do believe that an eq is NOT needed for flat response, with good gear throughout. HOWEVER, I don't think many of us live in and anehoic chamber. Room acoustics can be customized, esp in the bass dept.

Are they a must? Heck no. Can they tailor sound to your room/taste? F yeah.

Cheers,
Russ

Subjective hobby we have here fellas, there is no right or wrong answer.....

madmax

Could you speak up Russman, I had the door to the chamber closed.

I haven't seen anything better than the AudioControl eq's.

With that said and admitting that I own a few...

Problem #1: I've noticed that you end up getting something to sound how you think it should and get used to it then later on find out that most of your audio related problems go away when you finally unhook the eq.
Problem #2: I know very few people who can actually set one up properly.
Problem #3: You buy that high end receiver or pre-amp where the designer has picked a very good preamp stage, paid a lot of attention to phase shift and kept the signal paths short then you add another stage after it (the eq) which has a .39 cent transistor driving the output. This negates any quality you may have had.
Problem #4: Your friends start avoiding your invitations to spend an evening listening to your system.

madmax

RuSsMaN

Agreed, maybe I am reading too much into this. When I have used/use an EQ, I don't just plug up the Realistic 7 bander to an Anthem, make the typical 'V' on each side, and crank it.

I am very familar with getting used to an 'eq' sound. I had a friend recently weened from his eq.... He hated his new system without it at first, and over a week or so, he now 'hears' what he was missing.

Present time, only thing not absolutley flat in my system is my HT sub. Biggest problem here was it being a bandpass design. You and I both know they can sound a bit one-notish. Until the purchase of a new sub, I am using an EQ with the sub amp to 'flatten' the response in my room. +3db up @31Hz, -6db down @62Hz has seemed to really smooth out the response.

Some people want to make bad speakers/amps sound 'better' in their opinion, Some people like pulsing LEDs and spectrum analyzers. (I'm a v/u man myself...) Some people actually use an eq to fix an issue.

I see your point. Question to the end user is are they after the 'audio truth', or are they after booming lows and unnatural highs....... HOWEVER, I respect anyone who has tried it both ways, and either uses an Eq or doesn't, based on the way THEY PREFER their system to sound.

Cheers,
Russ

shrek001

ok, guys I tried the non eq thing for 2 days... I can't say I like it, but I can't say I don't.. I still perfer my eq.. it's not the lights, or the levers, or anything else of that sort, I just feel it gives the music some body, not unnatural sounding. But to tell you the truth when I throw on a cd in my onkyo integra cd player through the optical output, to my denon 5800, through the mit term2 speaker cable to the polk rt2000's , the seperation and the clarity is much better, but the body of the music still seems a little thin...

madmax

Hey,
That is a good test but I would give it a few more days. This is where your search for better system setup, room attributes etc begins. Sounds a little thin? There is surely something causing it that could be fixed. Better to take care of the problem than to add yet another piece of equipment in line to mask it. I think that is the thinking of most "audiophiles". (although some are stuffy people who only thrive to spend more than the next guy) Thin sound may mean that the bass and treble may not be quite what they should be or maybe the upper midrange is too peaky or something of that sort. Just a thought but are your speakers on the short end of a somewhat long room? Possibly you listen fairly close to the loudspeakers with a lot of space behind you? Just guessing because that is what I used to have and always described the sound as thin.
madmax

shrek001

no, actually my front left and right speakers are about 12 ft apart, the seperation is superb, I think you were on the right track about the highs being too high, sounds like I need more body in the midrange, the bass is tight and deep, when I turn the eq on the sound is full and presents a good soundstage, now when I switch to my integra cd player playing dts surround I have the same full soundstage without the eq, just when I use the megachanger I have to use the eq.... Sony isn't my top choice for a cd player under any conditions but the 400mega changer was free and gave me easy access to my cd collection, I think the eq is more like solving the sony prolbrem than masking another.. looking to buy the denon dcm5000, a real nice megachanger...

madmax

I used to use a sony es series cd player and the sound never pleased me. At one point I read somewhere that most sony cd players had a slight drop in frequency around 10 Khz which was somewhat their signature. Sure enough, I set my eq completely flat, raised whatever was around 10 Khz and liked it pretty well after that. I think I put a small dip somewhere else too. If an eq is used properly there is no problem with it (except quality issues) but if it is not generally flat you are probably creating your own sound hell. Some people use parametric EQ's rather than graphic EQ's because usually there is only one small peak or dip somewhere that you just cant get rid of any other way.
I like my Audio control EQ's a lot but they still stay in the closet most of the time.
madmax

shrek001

well I feel it's the sony, it's not the denon5800, it's not the speakers rt2000's, it's not the interconnects and speaker cable term2 using 2'from the denon pre-outs line leveled in the subs, I don't believe it the room, used a slp meter, my only conculision is th **** sony, but till I can upgrade the changer I will have to live with it, all in all with the cables and reciever eq etc it sounds damn good, but if i'm in the mood for one cd I throw on the integra and play it in pure direct and let the dacs on the 5800 do their thing... also have thought maybe it's the power to the system, I purchased 2 monster hts5000's and have everything running thru them, what a difference a good line conditioner can make... but sony sucks, I feel as passionate about sony as I do Bose....