Mid-Fi Power Amp Comparisons
Comments
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Having owned a couple of Carver M-1.0t amps, they are on the warm side. I would recommend having the MKII opt2 upgrade done to your amp. Will take it to a whole new level and more than double the output while making the amp sound more refined and life-like.
Great to have more input on Carver! I have read about the upgrades: there is MKII, and then Opt2 as an additional upgrade on top of MKII, right? After the mods, it puts out 400+wpc, IIRC. But then there is the question of 'who' does the work on the upgrade
"This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
Okay, between the Adcom GFA-555 and the Carver M1.0t that I currently have in my possession, the Carver suits me best. IMO, the Adcom is VERY detailed and bright in the higher frequencies, but rolls off too quickly in the lower frequencies. Some might say it is 'tighter' in the bass, but I personally like a little more looseness in the lower frequencies, whether it be a string bass, double bassoon, or electronic. Bass strings in various string instruments have two things in common: they are big and thick, and they vibrate at low frequencies. To me, that equates to a little bit of looseness and resonance that comes through better in the Carver than in the Adcom. Just my opinion.
It will be a full week from today before I get the B&K amp, so I will be laying low until then, preparing an eBay listing for this Adcom
One thing I have to look forward to is replacement tweeters for my SDA-2Bs. I have a pair of RD0194s replacement tweeters in transit
So far with these amp auditions, I have been using 10A monitors.
BTW, the Haflers are officially out now...no love for them here.Post edited by jdjohn on"This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
Having owned a couple of Carver M-1.0t amps, they are on the warm side. I would recommend having the MKII opt2 upgrade done to your amp. Will take it to a whole new level and more than double the output while making the amp sound more refined and life-like.
Great to have more input on Carver! I have read about the upgrades: there is MKII, and then Opt2 as an additional upgrade on top of MKII, right? After the mods, it puts out 400+wpc, IIRC. But then there is the question of 'who' does the work on the upgrade
Actually if you do the MKII and opt2 mods, the, Carver will produce more than 500 watts per channel. I would go to the Carver forum and look up any of the Carver techs there. Anyone of them can do the mods for you. I am fortunate one of them is only 20 minutes from my house. -
Okay, so I'm getting this guy: http://www.audioasylumtrader.com/ca/listing/Amplifier-SS/McCormack/DNA-125/Stereo-Power-Amplifier/145926
Once I get them all in-house, I will have the Adcom GFA-555, Carver M1.0t, B&K EX-442, and this McCormack DNA-125. I will continue to do comparisons, but a couple of them will have to go! Too much money tied-up in these things!"This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
IMHO....won't even be a contest, The McCormack is going to stay.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
jdjohn, I like your willingness to assemble an entire stable of amps at once to get things figured out. Keep us posted.Jay
SDA 2BTL * Musical Fidelity A5cr amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono * A hodgepodge of cabling * Belkin PF60
Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0 -
That concept really hit home with me when I purchased my SDAs from a Korean gentleman who was kind enough to let me into his home to hear them first. After hearing the SDAs, he also let me hear his big ESS speakers, which sounded very nice as well. I asked him how many watts were driving them, and he said 25watts. I thought I heard him wrong (he had a very strong accent), so I asked him to repeat, and yeah...it was 25. It was some type of tube amp, I believe.
Great sound can be had from low or high powered home audio amps. Many factors come into play, you have to match the pieces to each other, the room and your tastes. One of my rigs has an amp in the 500wpc range while another rig has an 8wpc amp and yet another is 70wpc. I enjoy all of them immensely. That said, there is no substitute for large radiating surfaces and a man's amp.
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I would recommend having the MKII opt2 upgrade done to your amp. Will take it to a whole new level and more than double the output while making the amp sound more refined and life-like.
It should be noted that Mr. Carver does not approve of that mod. Something about overtaxing the power supply, IIRC and I know I've seen comments about some of the modded amps failing.
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
One thing I have to look forward to is replacement tweeters for my SDA-2Bs. I have a pair of RD0194s replacement tweeters in transit So far with these amp auditions, I have been using 10A monitors.
This could be one reason why you think the Adcom is bright.
I've been running a GFA535ll with a pair of 2Bs (with the TL mod, RD0198 tweeters)
for several years and do not find them bright at all.
YMMV, of course.
So, are you willing to put forth a little effort or are you happy sitting in your skeptical poo pile?
http://audiomilitia.proboards.com/ -
That said, there is no substitute for large radiating surfaces and a man's amp.
I plan on snuggling-up with mine.I would recommend having the MKII opt2 upgrade done to your amp. Will take it to a whole new level and more than double the output while making the amp sound more refined and life-like.
It should be noted that Mr. Carver does not approve of that mod. Something about overtaxing the power supply, IIRC and I know I've seen comments about some of the modded amps failing.
I noticed on the Carver forum quite a bit of chatter on 'who' does the mods (I think there were two main guys doing them); there are apparently different ways to skin that cat, so maybe some approaches work better than others. Some of them have pretty strong opinions about it...imagine that Even though I have no technical knowledge about the mods, it does seem like something would 'give' if you doubled the output. "This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
One thing I have to look forward to is replacement tweeters for my SDA-2Bs. I have a pair of RD0194s replacement tweeters in transit So far with these amp auditions, I have been using 10A monitors.
This could be one reason why you think the Adcom is bright.
I've been running a GFA535ll with a pair of 2Bs (with the TL mod, RD0198 tweeters)
for several years and do not find them bright at all.
YMMV, of course.
Fair enough. It could also be due to the Onkyo receiver that I have feeding the amp. A better integrated pre may be my next upgrade."This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
One thing I have to look forward to is replacement tweeters for my SDA-2Bs. I have a pair of RD0194s replacement tweeters in transit So far with these amp auditions, I have been using 10A monitors.
This could be one reason why you think the Adcom is bright.
I've been running a GFA535ll with a pair of 2Bs (with the TL mod, RD0198 tweeters)
for several years and do not find them bright at all.
YMMV, of course.
Agreed....my take isn't that the Adcoms are necessarily bright, but a tad harsh sounding on those upper frequencies. They don't have the finesse of other amps.
Kinda like a 60's Mopar, lots of balls and great as long as your going in a straight line. Try and corner though and your screwed.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Agreed....my take isn't that the Adcoms are necessarily bright, but a tad harsh sounding on those upper frequencies. They don't have the finesse of other amps.
Yes, maybe 'harsh' is a better descriptor for the highs, especially since it was fatiguing my ears. It was most obvious with strings in the high frequencies. Honestly, I think my ears are rather sensitive.Kinda like a 60's Mopar, lots of balls and great as long as your going in a straight line. Try and corner though and your screwed.
Especially with posi-traction...no slip-diff in those."This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
As we age our ears do change and those higher frequencies especially become bothersome. That's why you'll find most older audio guys with tubed gear, or gear that has a somewhat smoother top end. Those days of bangin' Cerwin Vega's on cheap amplification or pro amps is long gone for us.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
As we age our ears do change and those higher frequencies especially become bothersome. That's why you'll find most older audio guys with tubed gear, or gear that has a somewhat smoother top end.
I was going to suggest a tubed pre, as my next assault on your wallet (lol)
After you settle in on the McCormack.....sell the other amps to invest in a tube pre, then Enjoy the music!Main Rig:
Antipodes DX > Roon > PS Audio Directstream Jr.>deHavilland Ultraverve 3 >Belles Reference 150a >Harbeth C7 ES3
Second Rig:
Roon> PS Audio Directstream Jr Bridge II > EE Minimax pre (Tutay mods) >Belles 150A Ref >Monitor 5 (Westmassguy-modded) -
dkfreebird wrote: »I couldn't agree more with the above statement.I just got back into 2 channel a couple of years ago and have used the carver 1.0,Tfm 55,adcom 555,Denon 2400 and Sunfire Signature.I still have the Parasound 1200ii but the McCormack 0.5 deluxe is the best I have heard so far.I have never heard the B&K so I can't speak for it.Put a tube preamp into the mix and you are set.
Sorry Dhart. I already spent that money for him2 Channel
Polk 1.2tl's Modded with dreadnought
Musical Fidelity M6Si
North Star Intenso Dac
Auralic Aries Mini Streamer
Oppo 103
Pangea PC
Wireworld Equinox 7 interconnects
Wireworld Equinox 7 Speaker Cables and Jumpers
Backups 2.3tl, Crs+ pin/blade with stands.Monitor 5 peerless,Monitor 4 peerless,Polk R200,McCormack Dna 0.5 Deluxe McCormack Dna 1,Dared Sl 2000A,Dayens Ampino Rogue Magnum 66 pre -
I wasn't going to bring that up, but I did remember. Wait, ssshhh...hear that? That's my SDAs with new RD194 tweets. And this is the SDA's first run with proper wattage since the Adcom blew a tweeter on the first attempt. Me likey.
BTW, I'm not seeing any tube pre's with a preout for the power amp? I'm looking at integrated pre's."This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
I'm running a Dared sl2000a with mine.2 Channel
Polk 1.2tl's Modded with dreadnought
Musical Fidelity M6Si
North Star Intenso Dac
Auralic Aries Mini Streamer
Oppo 103
Pangea PC
Wireworld Equinox 7 interconnects
Wireworld Equinox 7 Speaker Cables and Jumpers
Backups 2.3tl, Crs+ pin/blade with stands.Monitor 5 peerless,Monitor 4 peerless,Polk R200,McCormack Dna 0.5 Deluxe McCormack Dna 1,Dared Sl 2000A,Dayens Ampino Rogue Magnum 66 pre -
dkfreebird wrote: »I'm running a Dared sl2000a with mine.
Those look very reasonable. But I need more inputs, I think. I use mine for all-round use with USB, wifi, iPod and of course vinyl."This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
That is where the Dac comes in. But I don't know about the vinyl part since I don't have it.2 Channel
Polk 1.2tl's Modded with dreadnought
Musical Fidelity M6Si
North Star Intenso Dac
Auralic Aries Mini Streamer
Oppo 103
Pangea PC
Wireworld Equinox 7 interconnects
Wireworld Equinox 7 Speaker Cables and Jumpers
Backups 2.3tl, Crs+ pin/blade with stands.Monitor 5 peerless,Monitor 4 peerless,Polk R200,McCormack Dna 0.5 Deluxe McCormack Dna 1,Dared Sl 2000A,Dayens Ampino Rogue Magnum 66 pre -
I really like my Dared MC-7P, lots more inputs than the SL2000A plus it has a phono preamp.afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
Clearly I have some research to do. Thanks for the leads! I already have a phono pre, a Pro-ject Phono Box DS+ that I am keeping. I have been curious about DACs."This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
Okay, between the Adcom GFA-555 and the Carver M1.0t that I currently have in my possession, the Carver suits me best. IMO, the Adcom is VERY detailed and bright in the higher frequencies, but rolls off too quickly in the lower frequencies. Some might say it is 'tighter' in the bass, but I personally like a little more looseness in the lower frequencies, whether it be a string bass, double bassoon, or electronic. Bass strings in various string instruments have two things in common: they are big and thick, and they vibrate at low frequencies. To me, that equates to a little bit of looseness and resonance that comes through better in the Carver than in the Adcom. Just my opinion.
It will be a full week from today before I get the B&K amp, so I will be laying low until then, preparing an eBay listing for this Adcom
One thing I have to look forward to is replacement tweeters for my SDA-2Bs. I have a pair of RD0194s replacement tweeters in transit So far with these amp auditions, I have been using 10A monitors.
BTW, the Haflers are officially out now...no love for them here.
No love for Haflers? They're a pretty nice warm sounding and easy to listen to amp. Adcoms sound brighter and perhaps more neutral, but then again our resident Adcom "hater" the Raging one just don't like'm.
McCormack? Garlic Salt, Oregano, or Paprika? lol
Sounds like you did FINE!Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!
Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
[sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash] -
I would recommend having the MKII opt2 upgrade done to your amp. Will take it to a whole new level and more than double the output while making the amp sound more refined and life-like.
It should be noted that Mr. Carver does not approve of that mod. Something about overtaxing the power supply, IIRC and I know I've seen comments about some of the modded amps failing.
Maybe with the early test runs for these mods, but the current one approved by many of the modders on the Carver forum swear by the mods done to both of my amps. I never was able to even get two LEDs lit with my Magnepans after the mods were done. So I don't think I could overtax the power supply. -
I received the B&K EX-442 and the McCormack DNA-125 yesterday. The B&K sounds good (i.e., it works), although I haven't done a real comparison yet. Sadly, the left channel in the McCormack is dead. I got a good deal on it, and hate to send it back, so I'm going to have it checked out. Hopefully it will be something simple/cheap.
Of the three I have received through shipping (picked up the fourth locally), two have had issues that apparently weren't there before shipping, according to the sellers. The Adcom was not packaged too well (not double-boxed) and had clearly been dropped at some point in its history, so no real surprise there. But the McCormack was packaged very well, although it has been butt cold outside, so I wonder if the cold temps made connections brittle or something."This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
I'd send the McCormack back and ask for a refund. One bad channel is a deal breaker....unless the seller wants to pay to get it fixed, which I doubt.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
I assume fuses have been checked??
If that model has them??Pio Elete Pro 520
Panamax 5400-EX
Sunfire TGP 5
Micro Seiki DD-40 - Lyra-Dorian and Denon DL-160
PS Audio GCPH phono pre
Sunfire CG 200 X 5
Sunfire CG Sig 405 X 5
OPPO BDP-83 SE
SDA SRS 1.2TL Sonicaps and Mills
Ctr CS1000p
Sur - FX1000 x 4
SUB - SVS PB2-Plus
Workkout room:
Sony Bravia XBR- 32-Inch 1080p
Onkyo TX-DS898
GFA 555
Yamaha DVD-S1800BL/SACD
Ft - SDA 1C
Not being used:
RTi 38's -4
RT55i's - 2
RT25i's -2, using other 2 in shop
LSI 15's
CSi40
PSW 404 -
I don't know if this model has fuses or not, but I did read that some other Mac models have fuses internally on the power rail. I will check before deciding on anything, whether returning or getting repaired. Of course if it blows a fuse twice (assuming I find and replace), then something more serious is wrong. I can't find any type of wiring schematic for the DNA-125.
TonyB is right that the seller will not 'authorize' (pay for) any repairs. I got this one for $700 shipped, so I feel like that's a good deal and may be worth investing in a repair. These don't seem to come up for sale very often, so again I hate to let it go easily."This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
McCormacks are great amps that don't come up that often, but if the owner didn't want to contribute to repairs, I would really consider returning, unless of course it was a really cheap/simple fix. Just sayingMain Rig:
Antipodes DX > Roon > PS Audio Directstream Jr.>deHavilland Ultraverve 3 >Belles Reference 150a >Harbeth C7 ES3
Second Rig:
Roon> PS Audio Directstream Jr Bridge II > EE Minimax pre (Tutay mods) >Belles 150A Ref >Monitor 5 (Westmassguy-modded) -
"No such thing as a free lunch."Even though I have no technical knowledge about the mods, it does seem like something would 'give' if you doubled the output.
Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside* & out 8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out *soldered LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & “Plugged*” Mids - 981, connected w/MP Premiere ICs Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s *Xschop's handy work
