DSD versus PCM - Is DSD really better or is it a 'myth'

madmax

SCompRacer wrote: »

madmax wrote: »

Interesting article. http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/the-abcs-of-dsd-downloads/

This ain't analog yet.

Then you get into SPDIF, not all DAC's decode it the same. Some do not reply entirely on the embedded clock. Some DAC's sound much better when fed I2S versus SPDIF. I2S separates clock and data (and is the serial communication used in CD/SACD players), where with SPDIF the DAC must sort it all out. However I2S is not meant for long runs so you best to employ LVDS or Low-voltage differential signaling between devices.

FYI,
This is a family site, cursing is not allowed.

SCompRacer

madmax wrote: »

FYI,
This is a family site, cursing is not allowed.

You'd have to show me where I cursed.

madmax

SPDIFF, I2S, I wont even mention the rest!

So I just picked up a Tascam master recorder and recorded a few LP songs in CD quality, 24/96 and 2xDSD to compare.

I used the recorder fed directly with my phono preamp and monitored through HIFIMan HE6 headphones powered with the recorder headphone out. The recorder provided a reasonable monitoring volume level on the headphones and seemed to be of quality sound. This keeps things as equal system wise as I can. I compared the songs one by one and switched back and forth many times over a few hours.

CD was obviously different than the source, compared to the others it sounded sluggish with omission of a lot of detail. It sounded rough overall. The same songs at 24/96 and 2xDSD sounded somewhat close to each other with the 24/96 sounding like there was a higher energy in the highs (not like the original source, however somewhat close) and the 2xDSD being smoother overall and sounding like the original. Over time and with enough material I bet I could hear a difference between the 2xDSD and original source but this was a one evening thing. I'm guessing that some may like the 24/96 better than DSD because of the higher energy in the high end. Also, keep in mind this setup does not consist of $5K DACs, ADCs and a ton of recording software, only what the recorder provides.

machone

Good info.

SCompRacer

madmax wrote: »

SPDIFF, I2S, I wont even mention the rest!

Oh man....lol Vinyl guys will seek and pay for their holy grail vinyl mastered recording, cartridges, arms, tables, SUT's, painstaking setup and phono stages. The same effort can be put into digtal, but some die hard vinyl guys still bash it. In the end you get what you accept. Put enough effort in either format and you will be rewarded.

SPDIF and I2S even sound different. Best implemented is also a key factor. That’s why i believe one needs a full understanding of the digital process from input to output. That way one can do informed bashing instead of the regurgitated, debatable, uninformed bashing that occurs.

You want to research further, spend some coin, download a Blue Coast DSD and the lowest dithered down version. Same master recording, it's just dithered down into lesser cost and SQ formats. An apples to apples comparison.

Duell brought his recording gear here years ago and we recorded a Holland, Japanese and Robert Ludwig vinyl pressing of Moving Pictures. Hi rez sounded fantastic, dithered down less so but acceptable. The Holland pressing sounds best.

madmax

I'm not one of those anti-digital types, just have not had time to pursue it given all the vinyl cleaning and arm setup. With the results from the DSD recording experiment I'm actually a little excited about it! At least I can archive my best LPs and get a few digital downloads for now until I get more into it.

SCompRacer

If you want to go real simple, just go DSD/low pass filter only (no DAC chip required). Very similar to the Lampizator DSD. All you need is a USB input and an FIR low pass filter. I haven’t looked into it deep enough, but guessing that you can use JRiver to convert files to DSD on the fly and feed it.

The FIR board was sold by a Japanese fellow at diyaudio.

Here is an example…

http://www.xtremeplace.com/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=79005b1ff46fda43fcfcaa452d143179&topic=190645.0

Here is a great USB to I2S interface that does DSD (used in above example). I hope to finally install mine this weekend. Only had it for 8 months.... It's also a great USB interface for any diy DAC. Isolation, option to upsample PCM to 352/384khZ (or not), high quality Crystek clocks to use as master clock (replace DAC clock).



STANDARD FEATURES
Custom 8x/4x/2x OSF using a semi minimum phase design for reduced pre-ringing
Jumper to allow bypass of on board regulator for direct 3.6 VDC
Multiplexed DSD/I2S
Bit Clock=Bit Clock DSD
Word Clock=Data L DSD
SData=Data R DSD
Master Clock=Master Clock
On board sample rate LEDs
On board power LEDs
On board signal lock PCM/DSD LEDs

SUPPORTED PCM RATES
44.1 KHz-384 KHz

SUPPORTED DSD RATES
2.8 MHz (DSD64) - DoP, native (via ASIO)
5.6 MHz (DSD128) - DoP, native (via ASIO)
11.2 MHz (DSD256) - native (via ASIO)
22.5 MHz (DSD512) - native (via ASIO)

COMPATIBILITY
Native support on Mac OS 10.6 and later
Native support on Linux with UAC2 compliant kernel
Support for Win XP to W8 32/64 bit

SPECIFICATIONS
Power input: 5VDC, ~300 mA
Width: 74mm
Depth: 104mm

madmax

Thats very interesting, a dac without a dac!