Keces DA-131 (modded)
heiney9
Posts: 25,165
So, even though I have spent less time here on CP, although I do lurk at times, I have been keeping up with some tube buying for the awesome Eastern Electric Mini Max pre-amp. Office rig(s) have seen little use lately as the computer crashed and I have been on a netbook recently. That's all going to be remedied soon.
I wasn't even looking for a new piece (that's usually when the best stuff shows up) and I still have a great love for my office Keces DA-151 (USB only) DAC. I found a DA-131 which is the non-USB version to try in the main rig. This particular unit has the upgraded op-amps and 12 - Black Gate caps throughout.
Going to put it up against my modded Adcom GDA-600 of the early 90's and see which I prefer.
The Keces DA-131 is enroute
STAY TUNED
H9
I wasn't even looking for a new piece (that's usually when the best stuff shows up) and I still have a great love for my office Keces DA-151 (USB only) DAC. I found a DA-131 which is the non-USB version to try in the main rig. This particular unit has the upgraded op-amps and 12 - Black Gate caps throughout.
Going to put it up against my modded Adcom GDA-600 of the early 90's and see which I prefer.
The Keces DA-131 is enroute
STAY TUNED
H9
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
Comments
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Looking forward to your thoughts, H. I sold my 131 (unmodded) when it was bested by Arcam rDac (bottom end response, wider soundstage) and W4S dac1 upped to dac2 spec plus femto (fuller richer sound, wider deeper ss). This was on the Aleph30, revel m22/maggie rig.
Dunno why the Keces never grabbed me by my uh elbow like it did most others.b]Beach Audio[/b]: Rega RP6 (mods) - AT33PTG/II - Parks Budgie SUT - PSAudio NPC * Eversolo DMP-A6 * Topping D90iii * Joule-Electra LA-100 mkIII * Pass Aleph 30 * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 2.3tl (mods) * PSAudio PPP3
Beach Study: Pro-Ject Stream Box S2 Ultra & Pre Box S2 * Pass ACA * DH Labs SS Q10 * Brines Folded ML-TQWT RS 40-1354 * PSA Dectet
Beach Master: WiiM Pro * Dayens Menuetto * Zu Libtec * Dynaudio Audience 50
Beach Den: Bluesound Powernode 2i * DH Labs SS Q10 * Zu Omen DWII * Richard Gray RGPC
Town Study: WiiM Pro * Chord Qute (Pardo) * Elekit TU-8600 * MIT S3 * Revel M22 * Beyer DT-990 * Shunyata Hydra 2
Town Den: Music Hall mm5.1se - Denon DL-103r - Jolida JD9ii (mods) * WiiM Pro * Cary xCiter * Rogue 99 Magnum * Schiit Aegir * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 1.2tl (mods) * Dectet * Bottlehead Crack - Senn 600
Town Porch: WiiM Pro Plus * Sunfire Sig II * Canare 4S11 * Magnepan 1.6 * Dectet -
It'll be interesting because the DA-151 is in the office rig and in general I use a different standard when evaluating that rig vs. the main rig. If the DA-131 doesn't dethrone the modded Adcom, I'll still use it a secondary rig that's not computer based.
It was too good a deal to pass up and the office rig with the DA-151 in the mix sounds most excellent.
I am just as curious to see how it all goes too.
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
do you have the means, or plans to compare the 151 to the 131?Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
Brock.... you've put the Keces stuff on my list a couple times and I've almost pulled the trigger a time or two... maybe one day I will snag one."....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
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Congrats on the new dac Brock. I'm sure it's found a home.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Congrats & definitely keep us posted on your thoughts. I'll bet it's gonna leave you smiling!"2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
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do you have the means, or plans to compare the 151 to the 131?
It would be very hard to compare them head to head since they are different designs and use a different decoding chipset. Plus the DA-131 is modded with Black Gate caps.
The DA-151 is USB only (needs proper set-up to sound it's best) the chip is only capable of 24-bit/48kHz resolution. It also uses coupling caps at the output.
The DA-131 is coax/toslink only and is capable of 24-bit/192kHz. Uses no coupling caps. Both units use the upgraded op-amp LME49710.
H9
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
I am once again reminded of this review.
http://enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0808/keces_da151.htm
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
thanks Brock. I was curious if I might want to explore the USB or if it would be more of a lateral move.Polk Lsi9
N.E.W. A-20 class A 20W
NAD 1020 completely refurbished
Keces DA-131 mk.II
Analysis Plus Copper Oval, Douglass, Morrow SUB3, Huffman Digital
Paradigm DSP-3100 v.2 -
Cool, Brock.
Interested in hearing your thoughts; I picked up a 131 locally a couple months ago and have been enjoying it. Look at the two of us, each with a tweaked Adcom and a Keces DA-131.Jay
SDA 2BTL * Musical Fidelity A5cr amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono * A hodgepodge of cabling * Belkin PF60
Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0 -
This particular unit has the upgraded op-amps....
Hey Brock, which op amps?
I just picked up some tubes! 6922's, Amperex PQ 7308. Also got a couple of Telefunken EF86. All for a project yet to be built.
Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 * -
Now you've gone and done it Rich. Posting up tube pics to Broch is like waving a crack pipe in front of a dope addict.
Post up some thoughts Broch, inquiring minds and all that.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
do you have the means, or plans to compare the 151 to the 131?
It would be very hard to compare them head to head since they are different designs and use a different decoding chipset. Plus the DA-131 is modded with Black Gate caps.
The DA-151 is USB only (needs proper set-up to sound it's best) the chip is only capable of 24-bit/48kHz resolution. It also uses coupling caps at the output.
The DA-131 is coax/toslink only and is capable of 24-bit/192kHz. Uses no coupling caps. Both units use the upgraded op-amp LME49710.
H9
To Rich's question (see above)
Is it ok to quote myself?
Lol
Nice tubes Rich, looking forward to seeing pics of the project.
The only way I stop acquiring tubes, is to go cold turkey, not quite there yet as I'm still looking for a couple stragglers.
Of course all this sleuthing and hunting has uncovered another rare gem masquerading as something else for a song. Now the hunt for a mate....lol.
I have the Keces in da' house. It's like new and was shipped very quickly. A great seller off Audio Asylum hooked me up. Now, I just have to find time to audition it.
H9
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
Cool, Brock.
Interested in hearing your thoughts; I picked up a 131 locally a couple months ago and have been enjoying it. Look at the two of us, each with a tweaked Adcom and a Keces DA-131.
Interested in your thoughts comparing the two units. I have only hooked up the DA-131 to see if it works properly, no critical listening yet.
I really, really like the modded Adcom, but it's always good to try some different (newer gear) in the mix to make sure one isn't stagnating. Plus, I'm curious.
H9
"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
Now you've gone and done it Rich. Posting up tube pics to Broch is like waving a crack pipe in front of a dope addict.
LMAO! Here's another to get him buying...lol Telefunken EF86. Some folks say the EF86 is perhaps the finest sounding low noise pentode made, being used in some exceptional microphones. Bottlehead Eros phono stage uses a pair of these as first gain stage. 6DJ8/6922/7308 is second gain stage. There are some even more desirable EF806S but very pricey. It was mostly used in commercial applications, better components for a minimum of 10K hours.
My bad Brock. I've been alone at work since Sept 2014. Trying to kill me with OT. Getting even older, fatigued.
LME49710 is the single version of the LME49720, which I have in my DAC's I/V board SE and headphone out (balanced out is discrete). It is a nice sounding op amp!Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 * -
I have been working OT as well; a special 5 week project that can only be done outside of the 9-5 work week. So I've been staying late, working through lunches and one 8 hour weekend day. Between 15 and 18 hours OT a week.
I am promised a substantial bonus when it's all done around the end of July, early August.......so I know what you're going through.
I concur on the LME49710's there is one for each channel at the output of the DAC. These replaced OPA604's and the difference was substantial. I'm speaking of my older Keces DA-151 (usb only dac). The new (to me) Keces 131 uses the same op-amps.
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
Brock, I'm in California for the foreseeable future, away from my rig. We'll fight over who can post impressions slower.Jay
SDA 2BTL * Musical Fidelity A5cr amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono * A hodgepodge of cabling * Belkin PF60
Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0 -
So, I have moved this piece along. I might regret it later. I did have a short opportunity to compare this to my modded Adcom. I didn't give it the usual 2-3 week comparison I should have, but then this was never intended to replace the Adcom. It was more or less a measuring stick. I really, really like the modded Adcom so there in lies a bias I hope didn't influence my choice too much.
First impression in the big rig, clean and very low noise.
Vocals are a bit upfront and just a tad 2 dimensional. Bass was a bit shy and didn't seem to extend as well as the Adcom.
The entire soundstage was smaller and more closed in. Not as much of the 3d, "in the crowd" type of presentation. Vocals were a bit less fleshed out.
Complex pieces were definitely more jumbled and overall the entire presentation was a little bit "drier" than the Adcom.
My expectation (especially since it was modded with Black Gate caps) was it would be a little closer in it's presentation to the Adcom, but in the end it wasn't. Not necessarily bad, but just different.
My intention was to use it in a 3rd upstairs rig with a tube integrated and a pair of Polk RT25i's
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
I'll be clear, I didn't move this piece along because it didn't sound similar to the modded Adcom. Different and still sounded excellent for it's price. I moved it along because a) a third rig might not happen (and really not necessary) b) looking at moving up to newer technology and replacing the Adcom. Then the Adcom can be used in a proposed 3rd rig.
I would have kept this if not for the above scenario. Starkiller had been looking for one and I figured, move it while you can.
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
