Polk Audio RTiA9 Crossover modification

VR3

Tweeter Network -
Clarity Cap ESA
Mundorf Mox
Jantzen Inductors
Streetwires 14 awg, gold disconnects

Midrange Network -
Clarity Cap ESA
Bennic bypassed by Clarity ESA
Jantzen Inductors
Streetwires 14 Awg, gold disconnects

Woofer Network -
Bennic bypassed by Clarity ESA
Jantzen Inductors
Streetwires 14 awg, gold disconnects

Aluminum plate, powder coated black, lexan substrate, point to point, gold plated binding post

scotvl

Wow what a work of art, too bad its going to be buried inside the cabinet.

VR3

Thank you

VR3

VR3

Here is a build without the inductors and wiring

ZLTFUL

Come on over baby, whole lotta inductin' goin' on...

As always, beautiful work Trey.

VR3

Thank you sir!!

gp4jesus

Are those aluminum plates available blank? I'll install 3 sets of BPs.

VR3

I sell them as tri-wire as well

Inspector 24

I keep bugging you about getting this done...First the HSU VTF-15mk2 upgrade kept me from doing it...then a Big Sky Audio HCA-3500 came along that I had to have...I'm really hoping my next and final upgrade for the A9's will be this.

gp4jesus

VR3 wrote: »

I sell them as tri-wire as well

Tri-wire pre-drilled and/or loaded w/BPs? I have BPs I also want 2 bi-wire plates.

Regardless, how much $? Do you take PayPal?

Thnx Tony

VR3

The plates can come tri-wire or bi-wire, you can do binding post or supply your own. The plates are $40 each plus + shipping/paypal 3% - I can offer powder coating (satin black) for $10 each, I have a painter now that does an incredible job.

They are made out of extremely high quality aluminum.

pablo_rodz

I apologize for my ignorance and for bringing this back after so long, but what is the purpose of the inductors?

Theheadsn

Doing a little grave digging with this thread. What kind of improvements come from this kind of upgrade? I'd be interested, just need someone to sell me on the idea

Inspector 24

I think Tonyb or F1nut did similar mods on the RTi series and was quite pleased with the results.

I have wife approval to upgrade our a9's to full VR3 Trey fortress plus status, looking forward to it.

gp4jesus

Theheadsn wrote: »

I just need someone to sell me on the idea

do a search on Polk speaker mods. Read reviews from:
VR3 come to mind has done much work for others
Jbooker & I think Nbrowser to name a few have done their own work.

IME something as minor as an internal wire gage increase is worth the effort Ignore the naysayers - most if not all haven't tried it.

So what's stopping you from ordering the parts? And for your ears sake include ordering bigger, better wire* for the inside to the mids & bass drivers. Unless you turn obsessed, don't change the tweeter wire. Polk ships them w/ LOUSY**, thin** internal wire - trust me on this* at the very least! Even 14 gage is an improvement though if you'll study my sig you see by my example smaller than 12 ga is a compromise.
** quality; 17-18 gage

I welcome your PMs. Tony

F1nut

Polk ships them w/ LOUSY**, thin** internal wire - trust me on this* at the very least! Even 14 gage is an improvement though if you'll study my sig you see by my example smaller than 12 ga is a compromise.
** quality; 17-18 gage

The RTiA series stock chassis wire is 16 gauge stranded copper.

F1nut

Theheadsn wrote: »

Doing a little grave digging with this thread. What kind of improvements come from this kind of upgrade? I'd be interested, just need someone to sell me on the idea

The stock crossover components are generic electrolytic caps and ceramic block resistors. They are used to met a price point and are easily bettered by film/foil caps and non-inductive wire wound resistors resulting in mo' better sound.

Just do it.

gp4jesus

F1nut wrote: »

The RTiA series stock chassis wire is 16 gauge stranded copper.

Seemed thinner when I messed it. My bad

citation16

I wrote a couple pf times to the VR3 people with no answer...

I took out the RTiA9 crossover. There is no wiggle room to take the Xover out, once the four screws holding it are out. So I had to undo the front woofers to disconnect them from the Xover. Then the mids and the tweeter wires are kind of glued through a hole in the separate internal top enclosure and there is no slack for those wires leading to the Xover..
So I cut the mid and teeters wires to relieve the Xover out of the speaker.
The wire are not 16 gauge and are very thin.

Looking inside the speaker it seems there is just enough glue holding the side bracing and elsewhere that I can see. So I added some industrial Lepage Pl premium glue ( big tube is $5 can) on the bracing and other areas while the speaker is standing and then the next day, with the speaker upside down, more glue. In essence, I provided added bracing and deadening effect using a generous application of the Lepage glue on both top and bottom of the internal bracing and other areas accessible..

I then changed the woofer wires to a 16 gauge that is easily twice as big as the existing internal speaker wire used. It required to slightly enlarge the holes that solder the woofer wires onto the board. I did not change yet the other wiring for the mids and the tweeter.
I did extend all wires some 12 inches, so I can take out easily the Xover and work on it later to mod the Xover and/or change the other wires.

The connections to the woofers were soldered for a better connection than the meager crimps. I would like to use possibly some silver coated stranded copper wires for the mids and the teeter. At the same time I would likely add glue to the inside of the upper internal box of the mids at tweeter.

The easiest mod to the crossover seems to be the 2 bipolar 100 volt capacitors of 180uf and 220uf. Changing the other smaller ones would be more involved but not impossible. As soon as I can find the capacitors, I plan to change them, but looking at the web sites selling them its difficult for me , at least, to figure out and find the right parts to buy.. Any help in sourcing the parts would be appreciated ..

I cannot do all the fantastic stuff done by the VR3 people. I would simply run longer leads wires for the new caps to the top of the Xover.

Earlier, I also put each speaker on thick black quartz pieces with the spikes and some small spike metal round base pieces glued to the quartz. That made a noticeable difference. (Did the same today with thick bamboo cutting boards, from the dollar store, on other speakers giving better imagining and bass.)

The speakers are bi-amplified with 2 dual mono amplifiers, each at 250w/channel at 8 ohm.
For the bass the speakers are fed 8 or 10 size wires and the upper fed some 12 gauge wires.

The mods so far reveal a more tight sound, better focus and image and tighter bass. The vocals are more pure and true. The overall effect is a more solid sound, so to speak.. Definitely a big difference for a small cost ( glue and copper wire ) plus some DIY time..

F1nut

Vr3 has closed shop for the foreseeable future.

I suggest you study any examples of his crossover mods you can find in here to see how it is done because you cannot simply swap in new poly caps, resistors and inductors on the stock boards, just not enough room.

16 AWG is 1.3mm in diameter. That is what Polk used.

gp4jesus

A little diggin' will reveal F1nut has done mods to his 'A7 XOs w/pics galore - check 'em out for ideas.

Tony

citation16

Thank you F1 and gp4jesus for the feedback. The F1 nut mods are incredibly well done and very impressive, to say the least ! The modular connection is a fantastic idea.

The wire numbering here in Canada must be different. In any case, the wire I used is approximately a little over 2 X bigger than the stock wire.

Using hurricane nuts is brilliant. The stock screws holding the drivers into the mdf could easily damage the mdf by over-tightening. I may later simply add wood glue around the driver's mdf opening to let it sink into the mdf and make it stronger.

I wonder if you, F1, also installed gaskets for the drivers? But I have yet to read all of your posts.

Going to look at parts and caps at Sonic Craft...

gp4jesus

citation16 wrote: »

Thank you F1 and gp4jesus for the feedback.

you're welcome.

Way to go - I applaud your bravery. Inside is the place to start, you'll realize the biggest "bang for your $ & efforts.

citation16 wrote: »

The wire numbering here in Canada must be different. In any case, the wire I used is approximately a little over 2 X bigger than the stock wire.

You should hear a warmer, more percussive bottom. I crimped* 8 ga to my A7 woofers - I'll "finish" w/solder next time I'm inside. After I 12ga'ed my CC - big dif in the lower registers.

citation16 wrote: »

Using hurricane nuts is brilliant. The stock screws holding the drivers into the mdf could easily damage the mdf by over-tightening.

VERY easy to do.

citation16 wrote: »

I may later simply add wood glue around the driver's mdf opening to let it sink into the mdf and make it stronger.

you're not suggesting gluing the screws, are you? Next time I'm inside any given speaker, I'm gonna "H nut" the mid and/or woofer(s) as appropriate - seems easy if one is careful and a cheap, worthwhile mod.

Tony

Inspector 24

Wha happened to VR3?!?

citation16

I ordered some Mundorf 250 volt film caps for my RTiA9's from Sonic Craft, thanks to the info provided in the posts of F1 and Martin at Sonic Craft. For now I plan to change only the 180uf and the 220uf caps. Those seem to handle the mids and the woofers. At $423. us, it becomes almost $600 can , once the exchange, duties and taxes kick in..
I made all the wires longer, to be able to take out the crossover and work on it easily, as per photo. Will report later on installing the film capacitors & if and what difference I hear.

Inspector 24

DSkip wrote: »

He hung up the soldering iron for the time being. He's still doing well, just redirected his energy elsewhere.

Damnit. Damnit. Damnit

Planned on upgrading mine this fall to stave of the desire for new speakers...

citation16

I have received the film caps from Sonic Craft to change/replace the 180uf and 220uf caps
.
They are way bigger than anything I saw on this board ( re: F1) and from the VR3


mods.
I wrote to Sonic Craft about getting smaller caps...

gp4jesus

I applaud you addressing the THE problem instead of "fixing the symptoms" w/cables, ICs, and/or amps.

What about the Mundorf that trumps anything Clarity Caps makes? I'm using CC PXs on my tweets for DC blocking. (Bi-amped)
And...
Before you tuck away those beautiful upgrades, can you make time to study the XO circuitry? Either publish your findings here or PM me - 1000 thank you's in advance.

1. are both mids XO'd @ the same ~?
2. or they're different like the CSi A6; 1.5hz & 3.8hz - don't sweat frequencies, not important.
3. Are the woofers wired in series, parallel, or series/parallel?

Clearing up these mysteries would let any 'A9 fan know if going all active, (tri-amp) is remotely practical or ridiculous, quad or possibly quint

gp4jesus

Part Two

My dumb smart phone keeps cutting off the bottom of post.

...to triamp maybe or quad/quintamp RIDICULOUS!

Finally before closing the hood I'd apply Armaflex Dynamat to the driver baskets & enclosure baffles. Further, upgrade the LAME internal wire Polk used.

12 ga "warmed up" my CC; 8 ga made my 'A7 woofers more percussive & efficient.

12 ga from BP to the mids;
10 ga, if you can, 12 if you can't to your woofers.

ANYTHING heavier would help. I don't care what the naysayers spout.

Thnx for reading this far, I look forward to your findings.

Tony

citation16

From the Polk Audio web site, the specs indicate that the 2 mids cut at the same frequency as well as the woofers.

I just wrote to Polk teck help asking for the schematics of the RTiA9. It cost nothing to ask...