Wilson Audio speaker questions
polkfarmboy
Posts: 5,703
Does anyone know what the whole line up in the wilson series of speakers is ascending by year?. Is there particular models to stay away from? What would be the best value pair out there to look into?
Comments
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The more recent, the better. The Alexia is my lotto speaker. If I were starting, later Sophia's would be my entry.
Do you really think the Alexia is that good?
I've auditioned Maxx 3s, which were good, but did not blow me away. In the sweet spot, they were great, but the soundstage was quite focussed in my view, with which my daughter and wife agreed. We all preferred the breadth and projection of the SDA SRS's soundstage.
And we were auditioning the Maxx 3s with superb components in a very high-end Manhattan audio dealership. As I recall they were an Esoteric K-03 CD player and a Spectral preamp and amp.
Family Room, Innuos Statement streamer (Roon Core) with Morrow Audio USB cable to McIntosh MC 2700 pre with DC2 Digital Audio Module; AQ Sky XLRs to CAT 600.2 dualmono amp, Morrow Elite Speaker Cables to NOLA Baby Grand Reference Gold 3 speakers. Power source for all components: Silver Circle Audio Pure Power One with dedicated 20 amp circuit to main panel.
Exercise Room, Innuos Streamer via Cat 6 cable connection to PS Audio PerfectWave MkII DAC w/Bridge II, AQ King Cobra RCAs to Perreaux PMF3150 amp (fully restored and upgraded by Jeffrey Jackson, Precision Audio Labs), Supra Rondo 4x2.5 Speaker Cables to SDA 1Cs (Vr3 Mods Xovers and other mods.), Dreadnaught with Supra Rondo 4x2.5 interconnect cables by Vr3 Mods. Power for each component from dedicated 20 amp circuit to main panel, except Innuos Statement powered from Silver Circle Audio Pure Power One. -
What about the ones that show up used for about 5k, the audio watt series?
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On another forum a member went from an Alexia to a Magico S5 and didn't regret it at all.Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
I am very familiar with the current offerings of Wilson. They sound good, but with caveats. I think the cabinets and the engineering is great. I think that the fact that it's a 1 and 2 man team voicing it means there is consistency across the range.
I think the CST tweeter is good, lots of detail without sounding forced... But it sounds a little muted to me.
I have heard Sophia 3, Sasha 2, and Alexia. I wanted to purchase either the Sasha 2 or Alexia's but I could not bring myself to like them more than just merely liking them and respecting their design.
The Sophia 3 is nowhere near the Sasha 2 in terms of midrange clarity and state depth . I think soundstage depth is a very good indicator of midrange resolution and is more important as an indicator of speaker superiority.
Alexia is better than the Sasha 2, but I don't find the presentation to be believable. To me I don't enjoy the presentation and it does not have the midrange effortlessness of say a magnepan or bowers and wilkins diamond speaker.Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
polkfarmboy wrote: »What about the ones that show up used for about 5k, the audio watt series?
Probably Sophia 1 or watt 6Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
polkfarmboy wrote: »Does anyone know what the whole line up in the wilson series of speakers is ascending by year?. Is there particular models to stay away from? What would be the best value pair out there to look into?
Best value probably Sasha 1. Solid speaker.Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Agreed, synergy is key.
I think you meant 35,000 btw... I also watched the used market for a while on the alexia but can't justify the purchase.The high end game is so cruel. You can bring the same setup to a show two years in a row, and one year it sounds fantastic, while the next year it sounds awful. I don't disagree that there are many avenues to pursue for upper echelon speakers. If you think matching gear was crucial at mid-fi levels, wait until you move to speakers of this caliber.
I looked pretty intensely at the used Wilson market after hearing the Alexia. I couldn't bring myself to buy any, but there was one pair that caught my eye in Utah for about $3500. I wouldn't pursue watt/puppy, but some of the newer models might not be bad. I still want to get my ears on the original Duette.
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R
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I was going to say... If you passed on a pair of Alexia's for 3500$, you need to get your head checked.
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
PFB, IIRC, the Sophia is an evolution of the Watt/Puppy.
The Sophia stemmed as a more musical version of the wp7 and it was designed as an easier to optimize speaker. I recall vividly comparing the wp7 and the sophia1 back to back and I remember thinking the sophia was an easier to live with speaker. I can't recall how it stands against the products today but my perception was very favorable at the time.
If the right price came along, it would still be a solid speaker choice today.
Reasons for it being a simpler speaker was the fact that it needed no alignment of the upper module and I think the design was supposed to be as a less transparent version of the same model
year wp.
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Where have you been all these years Joey? We need more guys like you around here again.
I've been busy brotherman... Took a hiatus but am back.
Btw, my local Wilson dealer brought out the XLf yesterday but I couldn't make the unveiling yesterday because I was working. I am seriously having a conundrum of whether I should go audition it or not. I really don't want to screw up my plans for my 2 channel set up. Not that I would buy a pair but atleast hear what the hoopla is about.
And I know I asked the wife and she laughed at me and told me there is no way in hell I was going to even remotely think about bringing a pair home. That speaker are for people with cash to burn... And burn... And burn.
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
The problem with the Wilson's is that they can't be properly set up except by a professional. Can't be done.Things work out best for those who make the best of the way things work out.-John Wooden
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My only experience with Wilson was with a pair of Watt Puppies...and I can't say I was all that impressed. Sort of like the TAD Ref1s and CR1s where, sure, they sounded good but they didn't, as one of our members is so fond of saying, "Blow my skirt up".
I have heard others in shows...the Alexias...Sophias...and wouldn't mind spending some time with them but am still sort of jaded from my time with the Watt Puppy. Granted, this was mostly at my buddy's shop and then in his house over a period of 3 months but our sentiments were pretty similar."Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."
"Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip -
The WP tends to have that effect on people, hence why I recommended pursuing a later model. Wilson has worked on getting away from the purely analytical sound to a more refined, but engaging sound.
There is a possibility that if I spent more time with the Alexia, I might be less drawn to it. However, the layering of the music and the precision of the sound is still something I compare my own rig to on a daily basis.
Or... you spend more time with it and you might be more drawn to it. They do have a cult like following.
It seems like you know your audio well, I would put a lot of stock on your first impressions.
Regarding Wilsons and older models, I would not put much stock on opinions of older models when comparing to newer ones, the sound signature has definitely changed over the years as Dave Wilson began to hear differently. That experience he had at the Musikverein really did a number on his line up.Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
Don't worry...I am all for second chances. Especially as I get closer and closer to being able to chase my audio goals financially.
"Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."
"Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip -
Where have you been all these years Joey? We need more guys like you around here again.
Thats what I was thinking too!
As far as setting Wilsons up without a pro, how does that work as its just a pair of speakers?
From what I understand so far I would be looking at the Sasha and those are about 14k. If I want that analytical sound for HT then the Watt series would be something to look at. -
polkfarmboy wrote: »Where have you been all these years Joey? We need more guys like you around here again.
Thats what I was thinking too!
As far as setting Wilsons up without a pro, how does that work as its just a pair of speakers?
From what I understand so far I would be looking at the Sasha and those are about 14k. If I want that analytical sound for HT then the Watt series would be something to look at.
They do the wasp method... I am sure there is documentation in the internet on how to do that.
Basically they start from the wall facing you and start vocalizing and at some point they find a spot where they sound most natural. Then they go from there. There are "speaker whisperers" who can set up better than your average Wilson dealer such as Bill (metaphacts) on audioaficionado who was sumiko trained and they are for hire.
I would not have the fact that a dealer can't set up a used set of Wilson's deter you from a great used deal. After all, even if you buy brand new and move to a new place, they're not going to re-set up your Wilson's without charge.
That said, it would behoove you to befriend a local
Wilson's salesman as you can probably get them to help you set up a pair for a six pack or something... But if you're at a Wilson dealer and you prematurely mention that you will be buying used - you will be shown the door.
Wilson's are notoriously very well guarded and tightly controlled. They will not be undercut by second hand sales. They know they make superior products and will use that to leverage the dealers into doing whatever it takes to keep the incentive to sell only brand new products.Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
polkfarmboy wrote: »
From what I understand so far I would be looking at the Sasha and those are about 14k. If I want that analytical sound for HT then the Watt series would be something to look at.
It went watt/puppy then became Sasha. Technically the Sasha 1 is the watt/puppy 9. And the current Sasha 2 is the watt/puppy 10.
The reason for the nomenclature change was because they felt the jump from 8 to 9 was significant enough. You will notice if you inspect the rear of the speaker that there no longer are jumper cables between the bass and midrange/tweeter sections of the speaker when you get to the Sasha 1. They say that this is the first watt/puppy where the two modules are no longer inherently separate (watt = upper module and puppy = lower module aka bass module) and there is just one speaker aka now called singularly as the Sasha.
I would say this - if you want to set a speaker goal I would aim for Sasha 1.
The alexia takes the Sasha further by incorporating larger woofers, a larger cabinet AND aspherical propogation adjustability which allows for better time alignment for enhanced imaging and staging and coherency.
Yes, there is an element of time alignment with the Sasha but not to extent of the Alexia's and the bigger Wilson.
But again the alexia will set you back around 35,000 used and so you gotta know when to call enough being enough. At 14-15,000, for a speaker that was touted as the best in its class not less than 18 months ago and was offered to me by the dealer for 27,000 full price, I would not be hesitant to call the Sasha 1 one of the better deals on the near current Wilson line up. Yes, you won't get the new tweeter (convergent synergy soft dome) but unless you want to pay 29,000 for the Sasha 2, I suggest you cut your expectations at the Sasha 1.
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
The only Wilsons I had an ear on are Watt Puppy 5's and Sophia's.....didn't care for either. Can't speak to the current crop.
Joey, have you ever had an ear on Salks ? I found their sound more pleasing than the Wilsons of old anyway.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Joey, have you ever had an ear on Salks ? I found their sound more pleasing than the Wilsons of old anyway.
Funny you should mention that...top secret little bird told me that there is a distinct possibility that Jim will be visiting my neck of the woods towards the end of March and will be setting up shop in a buddy's house for some demos. Pretty much already told my wife that when this happens, she will have to forgive me for abandoning her.
"Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."
"Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip -
WP 6's are the sweet spot (dollar/bang ratio) right now. I have heard Sasha, Sophias, W/P's and I prefer the W/P's (6,7,8) 6 being the one's my buddy bought. Definitely the finest speakers I have heard for my taste. I own old B&W 801's (as a reference for my taste) but if I had the cash, W/P's would be in my living room.-Kevin
HT: Philips 52PFL7432D 52" LCD 1080p / Onkyo TX-SR 606 / Oppo BDP-83 SE / Comcast cable. (all HDMI)B&W 801 - Front, Polk CS350 LS - Center, Polk LS90 - Rear
2 Channel:
Oppo BDP-83 SE
Squeezebox Touch
Muscial Fidelity M1 DAC
VTL 2.5
McIntosh 2205 (refurbed)
B&W 801's
Transparent IC's -
There is a local dealer here, but I doubt they would take a demo request
from me seriously. I think the room with the big dogs in it was powered
by boulder amps? I'm sure some of the more respectable DFW Polkies
have been in there to listen.
"The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson -
sucks2beme wrote: »There is a local dealer here, but I doubt they would take a demo request
from me seriously. I think the room with the big dogs in it was powered
by boulder amps? I'm sure some of the more respectable DFW Polkies
have been in there to listen.
Yes, I've listened to the Alexias and Sasha 2 and Sasha 1 and Sophia 3 there... have listened to full Boulder set up on Alexias.... out of my budget for the entire set but it was a very good experience. The ability for the Boulders to just compress that image to a ball of energy is fantastic.
Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R -
I'm going to go on an extreme limb here and say that the new Sabrina may be THE Wilson to get.
It's affordable (as far as Wilson speakers go) , it features a ridiculously awesome driver compliment, it's small enough to fit in most real-world listening rooms, and it should also play nicely with any higher amplifier that can handle a 2 ohm swing.
I haven't heard em' yet, but I'm guessing this speaker will sit at the sweet intersection between accuracy and musicality.
YOOOOO Sean... I was just thinking about how it's been what... 4 weeks since we spoke on the phone??Magico M2, JL113v2x2, EMM, ARC Ref 10 Line, ARC Ref 10 Phono, VPIx2, Lyra Etna, Airtight Opus1, Boulder, AQ Wel&Wild, SRA Scuttle Rack, BlueSound+LPS, Thorens 124DD+124SPU, Sennheiser, Metaxas R2R
