Altec 604 8G in 612c Cabinets

rromeo923

I have the opportunity to purchase a pair of Altecs w/ 604 8G Drivers in 612C cabinets. I don't much about them. They were originally used in the theatre dept. of a local college. I am buying from a friend.
What questions should I be asking and what are some things to look for. We also haven't set a price yet and I would like ideas on the worth of this set up.

Thanks!

mhardy6647

Not much to say,not much to ask. Make sure that all four drivers (both woofers and both HF drivers) are working. What crossovers do they have?

The Duplexes are - at least for my money and tastes - among the finest conventional (dynamic) loudspeaker drivers ever made. They've been in more or less continuous production since the late 1940s (now, of course, made by Great Plains Audio), and at one time were the industry standard in studio monitors (and not just the US; the Beatles listened to themselves at Abbey Road on 605 Duplex monitors). They have a realism in the midrange that is virtually unrivaled at any price, even today (well, at least relative to my expectations). The Duplex is capable of the most realistic reproduction of piano of any loudspeaker I've heard with my own ears, and their capabilities with vocals are stunning - and legendary. They're also capable of, for lack of a better word, great resolution; as a friend of mine says, speakers like these let you hear "deeper into the music" than most speakers do.

The 8G are relatively modern Altec versions of the Duplexes -- probably better on paper than my 604Es, with more extended HF response and perhaps lower Fs as well.

These are high sensitivity loudspeakers and will (IMO) sound their best with extremely high quality amplification -- as far as I am concerned, vacuum tubes are the only way to go; single-ended/low power is sublime with Duplexes.

The only real bugbears with Duplexes.
1) they are not made for, nor do they require, high power. The 8G will probably take more input power than earlier Duplexes, but using more than 30 or 40 watts with them is probably asking for trouble. Fortunately, as long as GPA is solvent, repair and replacement parts are available (GPA is rumored, however, to be in less than great shape these days).

2) the factory Altec crossovers won't give the best results with these drivers. I reckon that later Altec XOs were better than the earlier ones, but the somewhat harsh, midrange-forward presentation that the Duplexes are known for (and reviled for, in some circles) is more about the XO than the speakers. There are good options for aftermarket or DIY XOs -- I don't know if its optimal for the drivers you're considering, but Doug Sax of the Mastering Lab developed improved XOs for Duplexes that work very well (that's what I use with mine). Greg Markwart has developed and published an array of phase-correct XO designs for various Altecs; I am not 100% sure there's one for the specific model Duplexes you're considering -- take a look. http://home.earthlink.net/~jmarkwart/

3) They're usually not inexpensive :- P That said, dollar for dollar, I think they're superb. YMMV, though, of course.

I hope it works out for you; I think that the Duplexes are forever loudspeakers; let us know what happens!

Sorry, I just cannot resist the opportunity to post a gratuitous photo of one of mine...

DSC_5735 by mhardy6647, on Flickr

[Deleted User]

Love when he posts his speaker pics.

mhardy6647

... and I just love to shill for Duplexes :- )

604Etest by mhardy6647, on Flickr

Everyone should spend some quality time listening to a pair; it'll help one - a lot - make judgments about other loudspeakers, I'd opine.

These Liverpuddlian lads spent plenty of time listenin' to 'em...


beatlesinstudio 2 by mhardy6647, on Flickr

http://www.recordingthebeatles.com/

drumminman

Great bit of trivia and pics re: the Beatles, mhardy. Thanks for that! Looks like a 4 track board they're using.

rromeo923

Hope to go take a closer look tomorrow.

mhardy6647

I hope you get to take a closerlisten...
:- )
-

rromeo923

I told my wife that I may be buying a set of speakers but they might be the last speakers I buy. She said " Buy them now!" LOL!

rromeo923

MHardy- How much did it cost to make those cabinets? Roughly speaking. The guy I am buying from may want to keep his 612C cabinets to use for a bass cabinet. What do you think about that?

mhardy6647

I had them made by my friend Michael Berg (a second career contractor and woodworker) in Hudson, MA. http://www.bergcarpentry.com/ Mike's built a couple of pairs of speaker cabinets for me; he's a skilled woodworker.

All in cost (parts and labor) for the cabinets in Baltic Birch was a kilobuck (several years ago).

BTW, I didn't finish 'em only because I figured they'd only look worse if I did -- they're a little stark :- p but I don't think they are unattractive -- kind of a variation on the Harbeth look ;- )

They were designed by a fellow in Canada as a modern repurposing of the Altec 620 cabinet - designed to go into corners to augment LF response (which is, I'd opine, optional... my corners are a little too far apart, and they sound great to me where we have placed them) and to raise the drivers to ear level. Plans are available at:
http://www.wardsweb.org/Billfort/
Their designer, Billfort, is active on AK (actually, if memory serves, he's a moderator there, too). Oh, and I believe that he uses SE 2A3 amplification with his (as do I). His drivers are the 604-8G, pretty darned similar to "your' 8H.

(FYI, there is one little detail on the vents that's not completely obvious from the plan PDFs; I have the additional information if you decide to go this route)

Oh, and they can be rendered more aesthetically pleasing, as Bill's own implementation of them demonstrates :- )

Bilfort 604 cabinets from audioheritage by mhardy6647, on Flickr

I apologize for waxing loquacious on this topic; I love the sound of these things and I cannot resist proselytizing! :- P

rromeo923

Well I got them some time ago now. I love them. They did come with the 612C cabinets. I am using tube amp made by Dennis Had of Cary Audio fame. It is a 807 based amp strapped in triode. Gives about 10 watts. Sounds wonderful. Anyway I am considering a crossover upgrade. FYI- These are 604-8G speakers with stock crossovers. Unfortunately I will need help as I have never really soldered anything before and dont understand electronics like most of you. I met a guy at an AK meet up and he suggested instead of new crossovers I should get a minidsp. Has anyone had any experience with such an animal? Do you think it is a good idea with Altecs?