SACD SHM Japanese version of Live At The Fillmore East - mini review and question
drumminman
Posts: 3,396
Just received my copy last night and played it for the first time. The opening track, Statesboro Blues, was a little under whelming for audio quality. Sounded a bit soft and not a whole lot different from my redbook version. About mid way through the the album audio quality seemed to improve to the point where it put a smile on my face and made this $50 SACD purchase seem worth it. Compared to redbook much better imaging, better separation of instruments to the point where I heard things I had never heard before. The improvement in articulation of the bass especially during swells and complex passages was pretty stunning. It was much easier to hear Gregg's Hammond B-3 during these parts too. I never realized how much he played on some of these songs - I thought he dropped out for long sections.
Jai Johanny and Butch occupied much more specific places in the soundstage.
My question is in general do new SACD's improve with a play or two? Seems like I read this somewhere, but I can't understand why that would be.
If you like this album this version is very, very good.
Jai Johanny and Butch occupied much more specific places in the soundstage.
My question is in general do new SACD's improve with a play or two? Seems like I read this somewhere, but I can't understand why that would be.
If you like this album this version is very, very good.
"Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills/jantzen inductors, Gimpod's boards, Lg Solen SDA inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR BP's, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheet strips, interior of cabinets sealed with Loctite Power Grab, AI-1 interface with 1000VA A-L transformer
Post edited by drumminman on
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The consensus seems to be that yes, SHM SACDs improve with playing (don't hear that comment too often about straight SACDs). I have 1 SHM at present, Black Sabbath's self titled and I concur that the sonics improved with playing. I was underwhelmed with the first playing, something like you. I've heard of people that buy SHMs and set their players to 'repeat' and run it a day or so before listening. As for the science behind all this...I'm not sure if there is any. Maybe someone else can chime in with the whys and hows....
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I agree that it's hard to get the "improves with playing," but I don't discount the possibility. It seems more likely to me that there are subtle differences in the SHM-SACD that take repeated listens to pick up on.
Just like one can look at a painting and focus on different areas, discovering new details on the canvas, I imagine we can do the same with music. Picking up a SHM-SACD I may at first hear the 98% that's the same as my redbook; while repeated listening and altering my 'focus' may illuminate the differences/improvements as I focus on different sonic details.
I have but one SHM-SACD myself (Steely Dan Aja), and I can honestly say that I haven't listened closely enough to it to discern whether I perceive improvement or not.Jay
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My question is in general do new SACD's improve with a play or two? Seems like I read this somewhere, but I can't understand why that would be.
I don't understand it either, but there is definitely something to it.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I don't find that to be the case, but I do find that if I turn on my Pioneer D9/MkII and listen right away, it sounds like something is missing, but if I let it warm up for an hour or so first, everything seems to come together nicely.
Are you listening to a SACD right after turning the player on or are you waiting a bit for things to warm up?The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
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nooshinjohn wrote: »I don't find that to be the case, but I do find that if I turn on my Pioneer D9/MkII and listen right away, it sounds like something is missing, but if I let it warm up for an hour or so first, everything seems to come together nicely.
Are you listening to a SACD right after turning the player on or are you waiting a bit for things to warm up?
I played it through an Oppo 105 that is on standby 24/7. I powered up it and my tube linestage a little over an hour before playing this sacd so the tubes were nice and warm as well."Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills/jantzen inductors, Gimpod's boards, Lg Solen SDA inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR BP's, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheet strips, interior of cabinets sealed with Loctite Power Grab, AI-1 interface with 1000VA A-L transformer -
I never turn off my rigs unless there's a thunderstorm.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
nooshinjohn wrote: »I don't find that to be the case, but I do find that if I turn on my Pioneer D9/MkII and listen right away, it sounds like something is missing, but if I let it warm up for an hour or so first, everything seems to come together nicely.
Are you listening to a SACD right after turning the player on or are you waiting a bit for things to warm up?
I think what some people are saying John is that they've taken other variables into consideration like you mentioned. And that it seems only to be the SHMs doing this, for the most part, vs any other type of format.
Jesse, you leave your HT rig on as well, except for the display I assume? With amps (and I guess AVRs) do you think it's better to leave them on constantly creating a bit of heat vs the extreme cooling and heating of turning them on and off? I'm talking for longevity of the components... -
Sorry, should have been clearer. I leave the 2 channel rigs on all the time, the HT rig gets shut down when I'm done with it. Obviously, I'm not particular about the HT rig.With amps (and I guess AVRs) do you think it's better to leave them on constantly creating a bit of heat vs the extreme cooling and heating of turning them on and off? I'm talking for longevity of the components...
That can be and is argued both ways. To me warm up is real and when I go to listen I want it to sound its best right away, so on they stay.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
My power amp stays on 24/7, and the Oppo is on standby, but the linestage gets shut down due to the tubes. If we're having a bad thunderstorm I'll unplug everything, or if I'm away for several weeks."Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills/jantzen inductors, Gimpod's boards, Lg Solen SDA inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR BP's, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheet strips, interior of cabinets sealed with Loctite Power Grab, AI-1 interface with 1000VA A-L transformer
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I just got the hybrid SACD for 20 smackers at BB sounds fantastic In Memory Of Elizabeth Reed has Never Sounded Better. What's the difference in sound between the SHM vs the Hybrid?Home Theater
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Can't tell you since I don't own the version you have. Here's the one I bought: http://www.importcds.com/music/1774244/allman-brothers-band-at-fillmore-east-shm-sacd
SHM means Super High Material, which is apparently an improved kind of polycarbonate with enhanced clarity. I gave another listen to it all the way through the other night, and the SQ is really stunning. Would love to do a comparison but I think I'm done buying this album, at least until the new release with previously unreleased tracks from those shows arrives."Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills/jantzen inductors, Gimpod's boards, Lg Solen SDA inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR BP's, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheet strips, interior of cabinets sealed with Loctite Power Grab, AI-1 interface with 1000VA A-L transformer -
drumminman wrote: »Just received my copy last night and played it for the first time. The opening track, Statesboro Blues, was a little under whelming for audio quality. Sounded a bit soft and not a whole lot different from my redbook version.
I've got the Mobile Fidelity 24K cd, the 24-bit HDTracks, and a very nice LP version. All suffer from the same softness early in the recording, which improves as the album progresses. Seems that these are issues from the source recording.Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance. -
Never noticed this on LP or the redbook "The Fillmore Concerts". I'll have to revisit. On the second play Friday night it was much better from the beginning."Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills/jantzen inductors, Gimpod's boards, Lg Solen SDA inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR BP's, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheet strips, interior of cabinets sealed with Loctite Power Grab, AI-1 interface with 1000VA A-L transformer
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It's not a "wow this sounds like chit" kind of thing, but the sq definitely ticks up as the album progresses.Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.
