Pro-amp for DIY passive subs, or other suggestions

EndersShadow

Ok... so before we get started I have one request. Keep the scope of this conversation on amp suggestions (pro or regular) to be used for driving subwoofers. I have no plans to use a pro amp to drive my mains, or surrounds, nor do I want to get into a HT v Pro amp debate. I believe that a pro amp will work fine in the confines of a sub amp, but would not use it elsewhere. If the thread goes off topic, I will ask that it be closed rather than watch a flame war take place.

So now back to what I need help with.

I am planning on building 2 DIY subwoofers. I am building them with the help of another friend off a different forum as I lack the skills needed to build them. I am looking at using 2 of the Stereo Integrity D4 woofers wired into a 2 ohm load. Each box will be a 6 cubic foot ported box with 2 4" ports.

Currently I am planning on using a Behringer iNuke 3000 DSP amp to drive these speakers. Mainly because it can give me 1k per channel (actually measured not just spec'd) @ 2 ohms. This gives me all the umph I need. The speakers are rated for 600 watts, but I have it on good authority from people actually using this exact setup that it will work with no problems. WinISD also backs up my calculations. The iNuke DSP model offers some software built into the amp to allow me to EQ it so I can use its 8 band PEQ to help even out my corrected room response taken from REW.

In addition the fan in the iNuke can be switched with a 80mm 12v Noctua fan which drastically reduces the noise level of the amp. I also have seen additional heat-sinks put on some of the fins to keep it even more cool. In addition the plan is to add dynamt to the fan shroud (to give it more weight) and also as many places on the chassis as I can get it.

As it stands now here is how WinISD is projecting my sub will measure...









I am just wanting to know if anyone knows of another amp out there (pro or not) that will give me the kind of power I am looking for. My price point is around 270 which is what the iNuke goes for new...

ALSATIAN in USA

you need a DEQ2496 and ONLY use PEQ to boost (low pass filter) at plus 6db, 12db/oct at 27HZ. and (high pass filter) at around 80HZ to cut!... This setup make my sub sounding like a Bulgar yogurt, it's expensive but necessary.

ALSATIAN in USA

at 27HZ the PEQ show the 6db boost at around 17,19HZ.... see graphic on LED...If you boost at 31HZ (Peak around 22 HZ), the sound is like a DJ Woofer... At 27HZ, you feel more than heard! like a true sub with "earthquake" feeling!... Lot of month to adjust my setup. The D class amps are better than class H for ultra low frequency. I have 2 EP-2500 (sometime I use my EV-CP2200) and I need frankly my DEQ2596.

zingo

The Crown XLS1500 I have for sale will do 775w into each 2ohm woofer; it can also drive a 4 ohm load bridged at 1500w. It has a lot of crossover and other options built-in, but does not have EQ. I am hesitant about Behringer's quality and longevity, but I've also always been a Harman fan.

Fun project!

EndersShadow

zingo wrote: »

The Crown XLS1500 I have for sale will do 775w into each 2ohm woofer; it can also drive a 4 ohm load bridged at 1500w. It has a lot of crossover and other options built-in, but does not have EQ. I am hesitant about Behringer's quality and longevity, but I've also always been a Harman fan.

Fun project!

Thanks! I saw your amp and looked at it for a bit but its just more than I wanted to spend, and more importantly its got a fan which I wanted to avoid if at all possible.

This is where I am at and pretty well dialed in at.

Single 15" Stereo Integrity D2 woofer (wired for a 4 ohm load). Dayton SA-1000 providing up to 950 watts. Downfiring Martycube. MiniDSP to help me dial it all in.

Wife just wont do duals, even if I make one an endtable, so just going to dive into one.

The Dayton 18" 460-HO models about the same as the Stereo Integrity but costs about 60 bucks more... so saving a few there. Once you add in the MiniDSP I am actually spending a bit MORE, but I think the MiniDSP is going to do a better job of helping me dial in the room response (especially since I am borrowing a UMIK-1 mic to be able to autoamatically load corrections into the MiniDSP based on REW graphs).

pitdogg2

zingo wrote: »

I am hesitant about Behringer's quality and longevity.Fun project!

Now where have I heard that before Oh yea now I remember....

EndersShadow

pitdogg2 wrote: »

Now where have I heard that before Oh yea now I remember....

Tell your buddy I am hoping to go with a Dayton SA1000 over the iNuke. Just means I have to add a standard MiniDSP for sure, and get 2 nice IC's to do it as well.

codyc1ark

EndersShadow wrote: »

Wife just wont do duals, even if I make one an endtable, so just going to dive into one.

Get rid of the wife? :eek::cheesygrin::eek:

halo71

ALSATIAN in USA wrote: »

... This setup make my sub sounding like a Bulgar yogurt, it's expensive but necessary.

So what exactly does this mean?

EndersShadow

codyc1ark wrote: »

Get rid of the wife? :eek::cheesygrin::eek:

HA! you'sa funny guy....

One sub is all I am going to get as of now. Hopefully if I finish it right and can get skye on board (in a year or two) I can pull it off . Long term goals, long term goals...

ALSATIAN in USA

HALO, clean sub-bass and no crap awfull bass frequency above 80HZ!.... if you use also the graphic parametric equalizer, you have almost nothing under 20-18HZ, that's why I use only the PEQ with 3 filter ...1 low pass to boost by 6db-27HZ, and 2 high pass with the same 12db/oct at 100hz (make 24db/oct)

WLDock

Keep in mind that the Dayton measured about 580 watts at 4 Ohms: http://www.avsforum.com/t/855865/measuring-amplifiers/570#post_13714349
However, these subs are only rated to 600 watts so I would not worry too much with a ported alignment... should still have great output and get down and dirty. A ported 15 is nothing to sneeze at!

EndersShadow

WLDock wrote: »

Keep in mind that the Dayton measured about 580 watts at 4 Ohms: http://www.avsforum.com/t/855865/measuring-amplifiers/570#post_13714349

First just as a FYI the model you linked to is the older model of that Dayton amp, the HPSA1000-R. The model I am looking at is the SA1000. This is the newest version of that amp. I have read where they were more "realistic" in their ratings on this amp and also made some changes so it produces numbers closer to what it should.

That said, the SPL difference between 540 watts and 1000 watts isnt nearly as big as you think... that and at some point we forget that the circuit feeding your amp(s) can only give out so much power so you can probably hit that wall before the amp runs out of juice (unless you have a dedicated line, but I dont). Considering I have 2 dedicated amps (not including the dayton) plus about 10 other pieces of gear on that line

In addition, WinISD cant account for room gain which you can normally get 3db's of min depending on the frequency. And given that I am coming from 96db's at 20 hz to what looks to measure ~110+ db @ 20 hz, I am sure I wont be missing anything.....

WLDock wrote: »

However, these subs are only rated to 600 watts so I would not worry too much with a ported alignment... should still have great output and get down and dirty. A ported 15 is nothing to sneeze at!

Yup, they are only rated for 600 watts and at around 850 they exceed Xmas and thats a bad thing. If I had gone with say the Dayton drivers they have a tighter cone and as such need more wattage to travel as far as the Stereo Integrity. (see below quote from data-bass testing on the 18" model of this driver)

They recommend 600w and no more for this driver. The very compliant suspension results in little power being needed to move the driver to full stroke. SI's recommendations for this woofer make sense in light of this and the driver will not make much use of more than 5 or 600w of power without getting into trouble.

Trust me, this has all been gone over in WinISD MANY times and at the end of the day its just a couple db's and not worth sweating that much over. I get enough over my old sub that its cutting hairs.

Oh and I also found that the driver rating of 600 watts is not the actual thermal load the coil can handle, but the actual wattage at which you will start to hit have mechanical issues (see quote)

Stereo Integrity confirms that the power rating for this driver is based on the mechanical overload not what the coil will handle thermally.

unc2701

How about a D-sonic M3-600... But for $360:

They just use Abletec modules that you can buy here:
http://www.profusionplc.com/pro/gex/pcatdtl0?ipartno=ALC1000-1300
$325 for one; add $5 for the hook up kit and about $30 for shipping.

Agree with your use of the MiniDSP and IIRC, REW has a correction curve for the rat shack DSP meter, so look into that if you have one.

EndersShadow

unc2701 wrote: »

How about a D-sonic M3-600... But for $360:

They just use Abletec modules that you can buy here:
http://www.profusionplc.com/pro/gex/pcatdtl0?ipartno=ALC1000-1300
$325 for one; add $5 for the hook up kit and about $30 for shipping.

Agree with your use of the MiniDSP and IIRC, REW has a correction curve for the rat shack DSP meter, so look into that if you have one.

Thanks for the heads up as those do look a bit intriguing, but the Dayton's I am looking at are both used and under 300 shipped to my door. Also the kit you linked to doesnt have a gain knob which I think I would want.

Also admittedly I am a bit DIY dumb, so I could see myself messing this up a bunch since it looks like you need to do some crimping/soldering and still provide an external powersupply, etc...

You are correct in that REW has a correction for the Rat Shack SPL meter (which I have), but I am a bit lazy, and have tried REW on my laptop to no avail so far (dont have the right ports :frown:)....

So am borrowing (and then likely buying) a UMIK-1 USB mic which is totally plug and play. You download the correction file and plug the mic into your USB port and are good to go.

unc2701

Yeah, the Dayton wins on ease of use, price and probably ready availability (I imagine shipping isn't too fast from the UK).

On the other hand, if you get the itch once this thing is dialed in, the new class of digital amps (Hypex, Icepower, Abletec) really are well suited to subwoofer duty and you're not sacrificing any SQ. As for the DIY, it's not too bad- you do have to crimp, but the power supply is on-board. You just have to hook up an IEC plug to get it 115v AC.

EndersShadow

unc2701 wrote: »

Yeah, the Dayton wins on ease of use, price and probably ready availability (I imagine shipping isn't too fast from the UK).

On the other hand, if you get the itch once this thing is dialed in, the new class of digital amps (Hypex, Icepower, Abletec) really are well suited to subwoofer duty and you're not sacrificing any SQ. As for the DIY, it's not too bad- you do have to crimp, but the power supply is on-board. You just have to hook up an IEC plug to get it 115v AC.

Gotcha, I didnt see anywhere in that kit where a IEC plug would go (the power connector looked more like a computer piece). I may keep this in mind but again since the max I can use before I physically start hurting the woofer is 600 watts I believe the Dayton should provide that too me...

Now maybe I need to build a small little sealed 8" dual opposed sub for my office system that uses something like this ....

I also am not against playing with building some small little monoblocks for my RTA 11TL's off some of those digital amps. I think the Pass Burning Amps are pretty cool to play with and would love to build one of those as well.