Rti12 Bass Frequency Response

mufsoman

Yesterday I used a Rieves test disc to run through the low end frequency ranges to determine if my rig is missing in the high bass/low mid range area. My sub cross over is set to 80 hz. I used the standard Radio Shack dbl meter. I found that I have a pretty good high point at about 63 hz, but at 100 - 140 hz, the bottom falls out with the dbl level.

So next I went into the advanced MCACC menu and changed the channel level for that frequency response. Didn't help much.

Next, I changed the sub crossover to 150 hz to see what would happen in the trouble frequency range if it was fed through the subs instead of the Rti12's. The result was a huge improvement. So that proved that its not just a room acoustic thing, but more of a speaker thing. The down side to the cross over set at 150 hz is that the rest of the sound was thin, especially the center channel.

I looked up the cross over points for the Rti12's and the subs are crossed at 120 hz. Is this just a coincidence that this is right in the middle of the problem area? What can I do to help level out this frequency range? Anyone else noticed this with their Rti's? Thanks

erniejade

Running the auto on my pioneer sc27, I flound it eq that range lower and I had to go in and tweek it all back. Try this, do you have a seperate memory bank for the sound? If so, set your crossover to 80, use a clean memory bank and outside. Of turning the sub up by ear, run the test again.

rpf65

How far away from the wall do you have the 12's?

You may simply be getting reflections from the walls, which is creating a void where you happen to be taking measurements.
I would try moving the speakers a little, and see if the reading changes. Bass is funny like that.

mufsoman

nbrowser - not sure I understand what your suggesting. I can set the sub crossover in the SC07 for 80 hz, there is no adjustment for the Rti12 crossover. The Epics have a crossover adjustment, which currently is set for 100 hz, but if the SC07 isn't sending any signals over 80 to them, does that really matter?

erniejade - I think I've tried that already, but without much success.

rpf65 - The left rti12 is approx. 2' from the front wall. The right Rti12 is right up against an angled door/wall which is the sump closet. I don't have much room to move them. I could move the left speaker back more, but then there will be large difference between the position of either speaker.

mufsoman

Here are some pics of the front speaker placement:

tonyb

If the sub is hooked up to the sub out on the receiver, you shouldn't be using the crossover on the sub. Turn that one up to the highest value. Just use the one in the receiver, set to around 80 or lower if possible....which ever your ears prefer. That right speaker against the angled wall will not sound as good as the left, not much you can do there. Make sure the speaker levels and distances are correct too. I like running them full range/large, but others like the small/80 crossover settings. To my ears, the small setting on big floorstanders makes them sound too thin. That's just me though.

mufsoman

tonyb - my subs are hooked up to the sub out and I have the crossover on the Epics already set to the highest setting, but again, if the SC07 is only sending low end signals 80 hz and below, then I assume that setting is meaningless.

I have the 12's set at small and all the distance settings are good. I could set the 12's to large and rerun the Rieves test signals to see if that make any difference.....

Geoff4rfc

Here's a try for you, set the LFE for the sub into the AVR at 120hz, set the 12's at 40hz and see how that sounds to you.

Having that speaker up close to the door like that will fatten up the bass on that side so there's not much you can do there. The 12's do like space around them but with limited space, you pretty much get what you get. Try those settings and see what you think.

rpf65

Dumb question: Have you tried leaving the door open?

May be worth a shot.

mufsoman

rpf65 - leaving the door open is not an option, between the really crappy veiw of the inside of the sump closet to safety issue and distracting pump noise.

Geoff4rfc - I'm confused with what your recommending. The SC07 crossover is set for 80hz. I have the crossover on the Epic subs set to the highest (I think 120 hz). The Rti12's don't have an adjustment for the internal crossovers. The SC07 doesn't have an adjustment for the left/right speakers either. What am I missing?

I know the right speaker placement is not ideal, but gotta live with it. I have acoustic panels behind both towers and under the TV behind the cabinet. Maybe I should take the panel off the door behind the right speaker? Deadening too much???

Geoff4rfc

mufsoman wrote: »

rpf65 - leaving the door open is not an option, between the really crappy veiw of the inside of the sump closet to safety issue and distracting pump noise.

Geoff4rfc - I'm confused with what your recommending. The SC07 crossover is set for 80hz. I have the crossover on the Epic subs set to the highest (I think 120 hz). The Rti12's don't have an adjustment for the internal crossovers. The SC07 doesn't have an adjustment for the left/right speakers either. What am I missing?

On the back of your Legends, you have two RCA in's. You should be using the white one which should be LFE. That goes to your AVR sub out. After running MCACC, can you go into your AVR settings and adjust the LFE to 120hz? And can you then go into your AVR and tweak each of the speaker settings from there? If so, bring your mains to 40hz.

By doing this, the sub is able to pick up everything from 120 and below, the 12's are able to pick up everything down to 40 which gives your sub/mains a nice blend.

mufsoman

Geoff - I'll have to check tonight, but I dont think the SC07 has crossover adjustment for individual speakers, just the LFE.

Interesting comment on using the white RCA jacks. I'll double check that tonight too. So what's the impact if its in the red? No sound or other?

Geoff4rfc

If it's in the red, you do most of the work. If it's in the white (labeled LFE), then the AVR does all the work when you run MCACC

mufsoman

Both subs are plugged into the red. But still if the AVR sub crossover is set to 80hz, the subs are only getting 80hz and below irregardless of what the sub crossover is set to, so long as its not less. So not sure what the difference is.......

Geoff4rfc

mufsoman wrote: »

Both subs are plugged into the red. But still if the AVR sub crossover is set to 80hz, the subs are only getting 80hz and below irregardless of what the sub crossover is set to, so long as its not less. So not sure what the difference is.......

When you run MCACC, doesn't it activate each speaker, then set the trim and distance for each one? Sorry, I'm not familiar with the Pio's, I run an Onkyo with Audyssey.

If it does, then you'd want to have the subs connected through the LFE connection so the AVR can set both distance and trim to them as well. Then go back into set up in the AVR and set the sub level for 120hz.

drummer86

From what I've read, the Pio's can't set individual crossovers for each speaker. Not sure why though. That would drive me crazy.