I am soooo Frustrated!!!

cincycat13

... with my bank...

This is audio related in that I have not purchased a lot of great gear that was available in November or December as I have been trying to close on a house. And I will have a bedroom in this house for my quiet space and gear.

short version. I got under contract 11/12 and completed my loan application on 11/14. This is a conventional 15 year fixed rate mortgage with full documentation and credit scores well above 720. I did not get my Good Faith Estimate until 12/2. I should have had this 3 business days after my application. But my broker says...don't worry...no problems closing by 12/27. Get down to the wire and the broker says...just waiting for the "clear to close" from the lender. Waited for a week for this...get to closing date...and I get a revised truth in lending form with a rate change... ON THE CLOSING DATE. I had taken the day off... NO close.

Spend all day on the phone and the broker leaves work early before I can get there. No one to help on Saturday.

Today I get a truth in lending PLUS a new Good Faith Estimate with the original rate...BUT over $2000 added for points buy down...

Now I am having to take Monday off as well to be in the bank in the Morning. Plus I am sure the closing date will slide more and I am technically out of contract on the property...

thanks for letting me vent so I can approach the bank manager in peace...

Erik Tracy

Sounds par for the course - lenders and underwriters always spring **** on you on the last second mandating that YOU spend YOUR time to fix/close/sign.

Been there myself. I hate lenders.

cmy330go

Don't know that there is anything much more annoying than dealing with banks and lenders. I've come to the conclusion that most of the people in those professions (using that term loosely) must be trying to screw up, because there is no way they could possibly be making that many actual 'mistakes'.

Hope everything get's worked out for you.

tonyb

Who says those are mistakes ? A broker is just that, a broker. The actual lender is a different story. Brokers are there to sell you and sometimes leave out some details...on purpose. Lenders on the other hand have to deal with constant changing scenarios, regulations, risks involved. They usually need time to give an actual quote for rates and closing costs. The free money days in the mortgage business are over guys. Everything is under the microscope. Brokers btw are always adding fee's/points to the back end, that's how they make their money. You don't think your using their services for free do you ? Dealing with a bank directly can cut down on the fee's and red tape especially if you use their approved tittle companies too.

Property transactions are now simply a boat filled of fee's/taxes. Crazy as it is, they know your simply gonna pay it. You have the movers lined up, kids schools transferred, maybe even a house your in has sold and you need to move on a certain date. Bottom line is they know when they have you over a barrel.

TNHNDYMAN

^ all that is true and par for the course, but for a company that on the surface believes in customer service they should at least have put some KY lube in all parties stockings. I mean for pete's sake it was the holidays and all.

tonyb

Believe me, your not alone in feeling like they should at least buy you a drink before asking you to bend over. Next to lawyers, I hate banks/brokers and the whole mortgage industry in general. Both are legalized crooks imho, while professing to protect you from the illegal crooks.

For what it's worth, excessive greed knows no holiday my friend.

cincycat13

Thanks for the support and stories. In this case, my bank where I do business is the "broker" as they are not currently loaning in house and they have sourced the lender. This is also a less than 80% loan to values situation so that is not an issue either. This is exactly the type of situation the 2010 law overhaul was supposed to prevent so it should be a fun day. I just need to remember that this is business and law...not an emotion thing.

Mike Reeter

Good luck in your meetings today, my wife and I have bought and sold several homes over the years, it can be a very frustrating process at times. You are right about the "emotional thing" cool heads will prevail.

badchad

I'd get a new broker.

In my opinion, this is EXACTLY the reason you got a broker in the first place: To deal with all the paperwork in an efficient manner and get you a good rate. If you wanted to, you could solicit multiple offers from numerous banks and credit unions, but that takes time and effort, so you got a broker. This is their job, and they should be doing it correctly.

If you continue with the same broker, get up their rear end. If he/she said "3 business days" on 11/14, you should have been on it well before 12/2. My recollection is a bit hazy since I bought 4 years ago, but my I think I remember my broker giving me good faith estimates the same day.

tonyb

The "points" are in reality a buy down of the interest rate you'll pay. The more points, the lower the rate. You want to pay no points, then expect to pay a higher rate over the life of the loan. Simple in theory, but many don't explain it well enough to the consumer. Instead they tell you over the phone they can get you x rate on your mortgage, then when the final closing documents show up you realize your paying points. Then it's a hassle for everyone to change all the documentation if you want to haggle over it and your left with no time to look elsewhere. Either way, you pay up front, or over time. Points are tax deductible along with the interest rate but I would imagine over the life of a 30 year mortgage you'll pay more for that half a percent higher interest rate if you choose to take that route.

I always specifically ask about points when shopping mortgages. Some will tell you upfront, others may hide that fact as long as they can until your committed and locked in.

Brokers, depending on state laws too, get paid by the banks x amount to bring them loans. The extra points is gravy to a broker...but try and find one that doesn't charge points. There are some but few and far between.

Your broker is being a bit unscrupulous in his process.

sucks2beme

This is why you get pre-approved BEFORE looking for a house.
You know what you can afford, lock the interest rate, and any points involved.
Most banks dropped staff like crazy since 2008. And the recent surge in
buying combined with the Holidays means delays.
They don't do anything with the paperwork for weeks. all the real work
happens in the last week before closing. So when that critical person
takes a couple of days off, everything comes to a complete halt.
Everyone getting a loan lately seems to be having trouble getting
to closing. A co-worker of mine told me his horror story.
Total FUBAR.
Hang in there and good luck. Home buying is never easy unless you have CASH.

deronb1

cincycat13 wrote: »

Thanks for the support and stories. In this case, my bank where I do business is the "broker" as they are not currently loaning in house and they have sourced the lender. This is also a less than 80% loan to values situation so that is not an issue either. This is exactly the type of situation the 2010 law overhaul was supposed to prevent so it should be a fun day. I just need to remember that this is business and law...not an emotion thing.

Let me guess 5/3rd? Nice back yard! Did you stay in the Cincy area?

Jhayman

Wow such hassles obtaining mortgages in the USA..
Is that specific to each state?
Is it because most of your banks are privately owned?
What are these points you guys talk about?
Down here we just goto bank you are currently with and get pre approved for whatever amount they offer you, you pay the land transfer taxes, lawyers fees and boom your in your new home..hassle free
I don't know of anyone in the last ten years having an issue using a broker, maybe our laws are very different regarding what they can and can't do..

ViperZ

Jhayman wrote: »

Wow such hassles obtaining mortgages in the USA..
Is that specific to each state?
Is it because most of your banks are privately owned?
What are these points you guys talk about?
Down here we just goto bank you are currently with and get pre approved for whatever amount they offer you, you pay the land transfer taxes, lawyers fees and boom your in your new home..hassle free
I don't know of anyone in the last ten years having an issue using a broker, maybe our laws are very different regarding what they can and can't do..

It all depends on the bank and on the people you are dealing with, definitely not just a US thing. I am having huge troubles with TD bank right now because the way their rep butchered opening my self-directed RESP account, and now TD WaterHouse cannot open the account on time this year, etc etc.

cincycat13

Well that was 2 hours of fun. I did have a Good Faith Estimate dated 12/2 quoting 3.5% with no points which was Par for my loan on that date. On my date of closing (12/27) they tried to send me another Truth in Lending form Stating 3.75%... and then I got a good faith estimate yesterday stating 3.5% but added $2237.20 in points. The broker tried to tell me he couldn't lock the rate until the appraisal was done. But he could not answer then why I had a completed good faith estimate.

The bank is eating the points money from their origination fee. Now I need to get the house back under contract in writing.

Jhayman

Holy Crap = Headache
To me it seems they are just trying to get you into a higher locked in rate by feeding you crap at last minute..hoping you won't notice the .25 increase..

sucks2beme

Normally the house contract isn't much of an issue unless there were backup contracts in cash.
They want it sold, and you are close to done.

sucks2beme

I did a house re-finance through a different bank about 15 years ago.
A year after that the old bank sent me a bill for $5k. They still had tittle(deed?), so
I had to pay the $5k. I hate the banking system. They do what they want.
You either pay up, or else. Who knew that after a year the bank could do that.
I was told it often takes 4-6 months for the paperwork to transfer between banks.
So the reality is anyone could billed by any bank for any transaction after the fact.
They screw up, they get to bill you for it.

billbillw

I must be somewhat lucky. Three mortgage closings with the same Broker. Nothing ever this bad. There were some slight delays, but nothing like this. No unexpected fees either. Maybe it helps that the Broker is the older brother of one of my best friends.

sucks2beme

The person brokering the refinance was one of my wife's friends.
They were generating paperwork while I was waiting to sign stuff.
Never again. If it's not ready when I walk in, deal's off.
The bank that had the mortgage was the issue. They
were in no hurry to get the deal done, or be correct.
My goal is to finish paying it off soon. Did I mention
I hate all banks? The current guys call/email/mail stuff for refinance all the time.
I don't even pretend to be nice anymore.

zingo

When we went to close, there was an additional $2k in closing cost above the good faith estimate. I asked them what they deal was, and they said it's only an estimate, which left us to either accept the extra fees, or walk away from a great house in a competitive market. We closed because it wasn't loosing the house over, but felt screwed at the same time...

I feel your pain.

deronb1

VA loans are the best. Everything is full disclosure and have to adhere to stringent guidelines. It doesn't go to the table unless everything is checked and checked again. There is no ambiguity or surprises.

cincycat13

zingo wrote: »

When we went to close, there was an additional $2k in closing cost above the good faith estimate. I asked them what they deal was, 'and they said it's only an estimate, which left us to either accept the extra fees, or walk away from a great house in a competitive market. We closed because it wasn't loosing the house over, but felt screwed at the same time...

I feel your pain.

That is what the legal revisions that were done by HUD to revamp the loan industry in 2010 after the financial crisis were designed to eliminate. Luring customers to closing with teaser costs then slamming them at a point of no return or risk losing the purchase. The GFE is a binding contract that has certain sections with 0% tolerance to change. If you closed after 2010 you may want to re-visit. My broker's eyes looked like quarters when I pulled out the electronic GFE I had saved from 12/2 and I explained that I knew it was more than "just an estimate".

actually now scheduled to close at 2pm tomorrow which is a holiday....hmmmm...

oldrocker

Either file a complaint with your state attorney general office, they will investigate it and if any laws were broken, they will find it and do their due diligence and depending on the data, will take action "to what level who knows" as all states vary.

Or if you know a "credible" loan officer you trust, take the paperwork to them and have them review "should take 5 minutes" of their time, with your high credit score you are the type of "borrower" all lenders want to have.

As you know I'm sure, federal lending laws do have mandates.

However, when the lending institution goes thru it's anual audits, the regulators should find the paper trail. Be advise all states are different.. Good Luck!!!