Direct firing surround sound speakers or Dipole/Bipole speakers for my setup?

PolishDude

I just picked up a set of RTi A5s, I already know I want the CSi A6 center, now for the surrounds, I am doing a 5.1 maybe a 5.2 surround sound, I can get the RTi A3 for 275 shipped which are direct firing bookshelf speakers or the FXi A6 for $340 shipped which are dipole/bipole speakers. My HT will be in my living room that is 13' by 25' rectangle however the couch that I will be using as my surround sound "center" will be about 9 feet from the TV and front mains. The area behind the couch will be a sitting area that also opens up to the kitchen. For my purposes will the FXi A6 benefit me or will the rear firing portion of the speakers get lost in the remaining 14 feet to the back wall, not to mention, the open up to the kitchen on one of the walls. I am able to place the RTi A3 speakers directly to the left and right of the seating position and can put them the 2 feet or so above the seating position as recommended, the FXi A6 I would have to put about 4 feet above the seating position. I can also put the FXi A6s on the back wall but at that point the speakers will be 14 feet behind the seating position or even further than my mains will be to the seating position. Will my Pioneer Elite SC-63 be able to fix that? Which speakers should I go with and where should I place them?

B Run

You could always try the Fxi4's if the 6's are too big, I always prefer bipole for surrounds but either one would work fine. My old living room setup was the same way, I had Fxi's directly beside the listening position and the back did fire towards my kitchen but it sounded just fine.

PolishDude

The wall is only 10.5 so it won't even fit the FXi A4, well I can make it fit but it will be resting on the trim of the door and window and not the wall, just not suring how that will look

rpf65

I would suggest you go with the Fx speakers. Weather the speakers are set to di or bipole, they will still work as designed. In other words they really don't need a wall help to sound correctly. Actually, sound waves bouncing off walls is something that should be avoided. As far as placement goes, there are ceiling mounts available. RTI A3's are limited to stands and large shelves. I guess you could hang them on a wall, but they are really large and heavy speakers.

badchad

PolishDude wrote: »

The wall is only 10.5 so it won't even fit the FXi A4, well I can make it fit but it will be resting on the trim of the door and window and not the wall, just not suring how that will look

An omnimount might help. It'll also let you direct the speaker after mounting, and move it a few inches off the wall.

PolishDude

What omnimount would work? Aren't FXi A6 pretty heavy and the 20 lb mount appears to be out of stock

PolishDude

Well just scored a CSI A6 and FXI A6s for $455 shipped so definitely getting those, now it just depends on if I put them on the back wall or high up on the on the sides, would the back wall create more of a immersed sound experience for the whole room?

Geoff4rfc

PolishDude wrote: »

Well just scored a CSI A6 and FXI A6s for $455 shipped so definitely getting those, now it just depends on if I put them on the back wall or high up on the on the sides, would the back wall create more of a immersed sound experience for the whole room?

Very nicely done!!! If you could, give both positions a try. But I'd say yes, the rear wall should work great. At one time, I had one on the side wall, the other on the back wall. The FX's are so versatile, they didn't know the difference and performed great.

The thing I've noticed with my Fx's, you can do just about anything with them and they continue to shine as "the" perfect surround speaker.

PolishDude

awesome, why am I now looking at RTI A3 or RTI A1 for doing a 7.1? lol I cant stop!

Geoff4rfc

Ummm, you were just showed the rabbit hole, no one made you jump in :cheesygrin:

badchad

PolishDude wrote: »

What omnimount would work? Aren't FXi A6 pretty heavy and the 20 lb mount appears to be out of stock

Yes, the 20lb omnimount (20.0W). I got mine off ebay. They have held both the FXiA6 and Rti4's quite well. No issues at all.

PolishDude

My receiver is a 7.2, how much would I truly benefit from putting a couple RTi A1 as rear surrounds or surrounds and the FXi A6s as rear surrounds, none of my friends have a solid 5.1 set up, yet alone a 7.1

badchad

My understanding is that usually direct firing speakers are usually recommended for "rear surrounds" while dipole/bipole are the norm for "side" surrounds. Since you already have the receiver, you could start with 5.1, then move to 7.1 (or 7.2) later on. In my personal experience, I found moving to 7.1 to be subtle, and frankly, not very noticeable.

I'm a very insensitive listener though, and have read numerous opinions in stark contrast to mine.

As a sidenote, the reason I went with some used, older, RTi4's as rear surrounds is because I got a pair dirt cheap (under $100). It made the switch to 7.1 a non-issue, since it cost almost nothing.

PolishDude

Considering I have not ever really heard a good surround sound, I don't even know if I will be able to notice the difference either. I was planning on either using the 7 channels to create a 7.1 or 7.2 or a 5.1 and using the remaining 2 channels as a Zone B on my porch but honestly not sure how often I would use that

PolishDude

BTW this is the room I am working with, obviously not drawn to scale on MS Paint haha



The green couch closest to the "TV" or in the middle of the room will be the one the HT will focus around, the other one will be in the back but would still like for it to enjoy some audio. Right now I will have RTi A5 at the front, I think I decided to put the FXi A6 at the sides, aka position 2 and now am thinking about just doing it all while I can easily wire it and getting RTi A1 or A3 for the rear. The gray thing is door to the patio, the blue is windows. The bar opens up into the kitchen and the hallway also is open to the kitchen and entry way. Not sure if I should spend the extra $220 on RTi A1 or $255-$280 on A3. Or maybe I should get some RTi A3 for the front up high to do the 7.1 that way? Obviously I am all over the place haha

badchad

Just, an FYI for future planning, I use www.floorplanner.com for layouts. It's free.

Personally, would NOT mount the rear surrounds at position 1, since they're way to far back. I'd suggest either hanging the speakers from the ceiling, or in ceiling speakers.

Speaker wire is cheap. Were I you, I'd buy a bunch of wire, run it everywhere I THOUGHT I might need it in the future, then just tack it to a wall stud or something. If you never use it, so be it. The wire can just stay in wall and out of sight. When I got my system wired, I wish I had run wire for "presence" surrounds (9.1).

I'm sure others more knowledgeable than I can chime in.

rpf65

Looking at your room lay out, I would recommend that you stay with a 5.1 configuration. I think that would work best, but if you really want a 7.x configuration, either in ceiling or FXI A4's mounted to the ceiling would be the better options. Sometimes less is better, and I think that applies in your particular situation.

PolishDude

Okay I appreciate the feedback, I will just use the extra channels for the outside or maybe bi amp the A5s

Geoff4rfc

badchad wrote: »

My understanding is that usually direct firing speakers are usually recommended for "rear surrounds" while dipole/bipole are the norm for "side" surrounds.

I could be wrong, but I believe the OP is planning the FX's for "surround" is flexible to mounting to either the side or the rear, in which case, the study Polk has on bi/dipole explains the benefit of both.

http://www.polkaudio.com/polk-university/technology/bipole-dipole-surround-sound-control

PolishDude wrote: »

Considering I have not ever really heard a good surround sound, I don't even know if I will be able to notice the difference either.

I can tell you this from experience; I've used M30's, M40's and amped M70's in surround, the FXiA6 BA-LOW's them all away in performance. You are IMO, starting with the best!!

PolishDude wrote: »

Okay I appreciate the feedback, I will just use the extra channels for the outside or maybe bi amp the A5s

Also IMO not to waste your time bi amping from your AVR, as much as every member has wanted that to be an easy upgrade, it really isn't.

zane77

Geoff has it right, go with this.

PolishDude

Okay no Bi-amping, will just save the channel for outdoor speakers or something

PolishDude

I will mess around with the floor planner app but took a couple pics of my living room for better visuals. Pardon the mess, was also checking if I should keep my Elite 60 inch TV or get a 65" Samsung F7100





btw got my FXi A6s and the CSi A6s and they are both HUGE