Please help a Audio noob out

2

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  • heartystatue
    heartystatue Posts: 329
    edited October 2013
    ^^^^^^^ Exactly ^^^^^^^
    HT: LSI15, LSIC, LSIFX, Emo XPA-3:biggrin: Onkyo TXNR809, Sony BDP-S500, PannyDMP-BDT320, MIT S1 SC. Mit 73842dlp
    2ch: SDA-SRS 2.3 Fully modded. BAT VK500 w/batpak, BAT VK5I, Essence HDACC.
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  • MindlessCorpse
    MindlessCorpse Posts: 27
    edited October 2013
    Finally, found it, as to the bi-amping
    http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?75197-Monitor-70-bi-wiring
    the reply by Eric W. of Polk Customer Service indicates it is worth a try.
    I also found out from Denon that since the Denon AVR-E400 has Independent Power Supplies and Seperate Discreet Individual Amplifier circuits, and a bi-amp mode it can be set to run 2 amps to each of the front 2 bi-amp speakers, giving ( under full 7.1 speaker load) 180 RMS watts to each of the bi-amp speakers. (front two floorstanding speakers)
    So, according to the Professional at Polk and the technicians at Denon most of the replies here have been in error/wrong.
    Even better, due to the Denon's ability to push 180 true RMS watts to each of the front speakers that puts it at the same power range at the front two speakers as the Top of the line Pioneer Elite, and saves me about 2,500 dollars.
    And as to the advice to listen to the advice....LOL....
    I love it when a plan comes together...
    Now the only question left is pertaining to the internal speaker cabinet wiring, but that question can now be as ignored as it has been. I can crack one and find out for my self... better off that wy
    Cýa !!!
    Panasonic SMART VIERA 60" Class GT50 Series Full HD 3D Plasma HDTV/TC-P60GT50
    Pioneer Elite SC05 AVR
    2 x Polk Audio TSx550T front channels
    2 x Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II rear channels
    1 x Polk Audio CS2 center
    2 x Polk Audio PSW505 Subwoofers (under the rear Monitor 70's)
    1 x Panasonic 3-D Blu Ray Player
    Dish Networks Sat
    2 x HDTV DVRs
    XBOX 360 (MindlessCorpse)
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  • Hermitism
    Hermitism Posts: 4,276
    edited October 2013
    MindlessCorpse wrote: »
    Finally, found it, as to the bi-amping
    http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?75197-Monitor-70-bi-wiring
    the reply by Eric W. of Polk Customer Service indicates it is worth a try.
    I also found out from Denon that since the Denon AVR-E400 has Independent Power Supplies and Seperate Discreet Individual Amplifier circuits, and a bi-amp mode it can be set to run 2 amps to each of the front 2 bi-amp speakers, giving ( under full 7.1 speaker load) 180 RMS watts to each of the bi-amp speakers. (front two floorstanding speakers)
    So, according to the Professional at Polk and the technicians at Denon most of the replies here have been in error/wrong.
    Even better, due to the Denon's ability to push 180 true RMS watts to each of the front speakers that puts it at the same power range at the front two speakers as the Top of the line Pioneer Elite, and saves me about 2,500 dollars.
    And as to the advice to listen to the advice....LOL....
    I love it when a plan comes together...
    Now the only question left is pertaining to the internal speaker cabinet wiring, but that question can now be as ignored as it has been. I can crack one and find out for my self... better off that wy
    Cýa !!!

    I originally bought an entry level Denon (used) but had to return it, then I was interested in buying an entry level Yamaha. I was new to all this, and these guys steered me towards a Pioneer Elite. There isn't a day that goes by that I'm not grateful for the advise given in this forum and the willingness to help by it's members.

    If it's about the price, you can find great deals on the used market. I bought mine on Craigslist for $300 and it's been used everyday since it's purchase without a hint of problems.
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  • MindlessCorpse
    MindlessCorpse Posts: 27
    edited October 2013
    Hermitism wrote: »
    I originally bought an entry level Denon (used) but had to return it, then I was interested in buying an entry level Yamaha. I was new to all this, and these guys steered me towards a Pioneer Elite. There isn't a day that goes by that I'm not grateful for the advise given in this forum and the willingness to help by it's members.

    If it's about the price, you can find great deals on the used market. I bought mine on Craigslist for $300 and it's been used everyday since it's purchase without a hint of problems.
    .
    Now, That is worthy input. I am not sure it is a price issue but price does dictate most things. Also, for efficiency most anyone would look for the best return on investment.
    Also, (and this has not been previously mentioned) once this setup is up and running, when the new TV is purchased for the living room, the öld" tv will be moved to the basement along with the sound that is setup with it. So, I don't mind that it is not the 'Best' system in the country, just as long as it is satisfactory for me and mine to use in a second entertainment area/basement. The present TV by the way is a 2012 Panasonic GT50 60 inch Plasma. The new TV (when it comes) will most likely be another Samsung series 8 Plasma 60 inch (the old one was taken out by a lightning strike).
    I actually do not remember mentioning anywhere in these posts that I am looking for the best, but have given examples as to what I am presently putting together and any tips on hook up's, tweaks or placement issues would have been helpful, also, such guidance as maybe trying craigslist ... I did not do that, but probably will now. I might find a deal and go ahead and pick it up.
    So far here most have replied with criticism and judgemental remarks on how all I am doing is the wrong way... for instance, a remark like "why do you think you need so much power? the speakers you have are a light load" while another post in this forum states the M 70's come alive at around 300 watts... 300 watts a speaker is no 'Light load " unless one is accustomed to setting up Arena sized concert systems.
    Another person replied on how the Denon AVR-E400 is an entry level receiver (according to Denon it is mid-level). The remark in itself bothers me in no way, but it does let me know the person making it is not only Judgemental, but inaccurate in his assessment. And this lets me also know to read his information... in that light. That person also stated that bi-amping is useless and a waste. This makes one wonder why Polk makes bi-amp speakers, and AVR manufacturers make units that are bi-amp capable? Even if the AVR has independent power supplies coupled to individual discreet amplifiers. Maybe that person is just not up to date on present equipment and the various abilities they have ?
    Another has stated how buying an amp without pre-amp outs was a mistake, but most stand alone Amp's I know of will also accept line level input. But at least that person did mention well known facts regarding speaker cable. Still Accurate and helpful though.
    Yet another has replied by asking why I use a question mark at the end of a question. I still don't understand that one, or how it was supposed to be helpful or even pertinent.
    Then there is a reply that states it is not possible to bi-amp with a AVR, you need a separate amplifier. ... But the Denon has individual discreet amps internal powered by separate power sources. On this, I am not pushing Denon AVR as being the best in fact I am not even rating any of them. But, the Denon is a unit that has been designed to handle various needs.
    I asked if anyone was familiar with the internal speaker wiring of the M 70 speaker, and was responded to with 'Dont worry about that' My question was not if I should or should not worry about it. Another unhelpful negative reply.
    I was invited to join this forum to ask questions, by a prompt at the Polk Audio page while registering equipment.
    Nope, I am not asking anyones opinion on what I have chosen to purchase. Dont even care about them. I am unconcerned over which piece of equipment is entry level or which piece might bring me to professional level God like status in the eyes of others. Just informed useful information on what I am hooking up.
    Panasonic SMART VIERA 60" Class GT50 Series Full HD 3D Plasma HDTV/TC-P60GT50
    Pioneer Elite SC05 AVR
    2 x Polk Audio TSx550T front channels
    2 x Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II rear channels
    1 x Polk Audio CS2 center
    2 x Polk Audio PSW505 Subwoofers (under the rear Monitor 70's)
    1 x Panasonic 3-D Blu Ray Player
    Dish Networks Sat
    2 x HDTV DVRs
    XBOX 360 (MindlessCorpse)
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2013
    MindlessCorpse wrote: »
    Now the only question left is pertaining to the internal speaker cabinet wiring, but that question can now be as ignored as it has been. I can crack one and find out for my self... better off that wy
    Cýa !!!

    Not sure what is your problem but save yourself a trouble and do what you want. If you asked questions but not listening to answers, what's the point of asking in the first place?

    I think it's better off that way too.

    Ciao!
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • MindlessCorpse
    MindlessCorpse Posts: 27
    edited October 2013
    megasat16 wrote: »
    Not sure what is your problem but save yourself a trouble and do what you want. If you asked questions but not listening to answers, what's the point of asking in the first place?

    I think it's better off that way too.

    Ciao!

    another fail
    Panasonic SMART VIERA 60" Class GT50 Series Full HD 3D Plasma HDTV/TC-P60GT50
    Pioneer Elite SC05 AVR
    2 x Polk Audio TSx550T front channels
    2 x Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II rear channels
    1 x Polk Audio CS2 center
    2 x Polk Audio PSW505 Subwoofers (under the rear Monitor 70's)
    1 x Panasonic 3-D Blu Ray Player
    Dish Networks Sat
    2 x HDTV DVRs
    XBOX 360 (MindlessCorpse)
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2013
    MindlessCorpse wrote: »
    another fail

    I agree but can't be worse than you!

    Speaking about fail, do you understand you should start a new thread and not hijack someone else thread with different questions?
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • Hermitism
    Hermitism Posts: 4,276
    edited October 2013
    Don't mistake the comments as criticism. There are different ways of doing things. Some people buy equipment, and over a short period of time realize that they need to upgrade. These guys are trying to show you the best way to do it, the first time. A lot of the people here buy used equipment. Instead of buying new, you can spend the same amount of money on the used market and get a system that will make you happy for many years. With the exception of my TV and PSW125, everything was purchased used in my setup. They are just giving you options. In the end, it's up to you to decide. Everything that was suggested to me, whether it was selecting equipment or making improvements to something I already had, has yielded positive results for me. I trust their opinions. And you don't always get the same opinions...but they are all good choices in the end. I'd rather learn from other people mistakes, than make them myself.
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,734
    edited October 2013
    Here's an excellent article about what bi-amping is and is not, http://sound.westhost.com/bi-amp.htm

    The Denon weights 20.7 pounds, the Elite SC series weigh twice that. Hell, the power supply for my main 2 channel amp weighs over 40 lbs. alone.

    Whoever told you your Denon has a power supply for each amp channel is mistaken. Yes, it has discrete amp channels, but they still share one power supply.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • drummer86
    drummer86 Posts: 441
    edited October 2013
    F1nut wrote: »
    Whoever told you your Denon has a power supply for each amp channel is mistaken. Yes, it has discrete amp channels, but they still share one power supply.

    Glad you found a delicate way to say this. I was struggling over that one.
    Display: LG 47" LCD | AVR: Marantz SR5005 | BD: Panasonic BDT-210 | CD/SACD: Oppo 980 |
    Amps: Rotel RB-990bx | Marantz MA-500 | Speakers: Totem Mite : Totem Mite-C : RC60i | Sub: HSU VTF-2 MKIV

    HK AVR635 | Polk R30 | Sony DVD/SACD Player
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  • polk500
    polk500 Posts: 1,171
    edited October 2013
    Mindless why are you on this forum anyway? The people who answer your questions are giveing you solid advise but all you want to do is pick it apart and offend so why ask questions if your not willing to listen.

    I for one an thankfull that I have a place where I can read and ask questions from other who have been there done that. I've yet to receive bad advise.

    Roger
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  • B Run
    B Run Posts: 1,888
    edited October 2013
    Everyone here gave you great advice, and you chose to ignore it. In the long run it's no sweat off our backs but there's a reason almost everyone here runs Pioneer Elites with Polk, its from personal experience. I tried the same thing, my Denon clipped and fried my tweeter, didn't have near the power of the Pionner no matter what they claim. That Denon weighs 18lbs, no preouts, no removable power cord and they claim 185wpc??? If you look closer it's only rated at 90watts from 20hz-20khz at .08% distortion. If you try to "bi-amp" you're simply robbing power from other channels, it's not actually gaining power. With 7 channels driven you'd be lucky to get 50 watts tops, where as the Elite actually sticks to it's rated specs. You'll find out the hard way instead of the easy way, we were just trying to save you some headache.
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  • drummer86
    drummer86 Posts: 441
    edited October 2013
    As someone who's moved almost entirely away from Polk speakers (though the lsim 703s are tempting) I will always come to this forum first when I need advice because the people here really do know what they're talking about and always go out of their way to help. The advice is always good and the best part about it is... if you don't agree you don't have to take it!
    Display: LG 47" LCD | AVR: Marantz SR5005 | BD: Panasonic BDT-210 | CD/SACD: Oppo 980 |
    Amps: Rotel RB-990bx | Marantz MA-500 | Speakers: Totem Mite : Totem Mite-C : RC60i | Sub: HSU VTF-2 MKIV

    HK AVR635 | Polk R30 | Sony DVD/SACD Player
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  • Zoomzilla
    Zoomzilla Posts: 76
    edited October 2013
    Interesting thread. I am thankful for all the advice I have been given on here. I thought I was doing well with my Onkyo AVRs until I tried the Pioneer Elite. Not all watts are created equal. That's all I will say
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  • B Run
    B Run Posts: 1,888
    edited October 2013
    I went from an Onkyo 3008 which is not a shabby AVR by any means, my SC35 sounded way better and didn't break in the first few months. There's a reason they're recommended so often.
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  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    edited October 2013
    DSkip wrote: »
    At least your name is fitting. You have to be mindless to be as ignorant and defiant as you are.


    Sorry, was that a fail?

    Nope. It's a PASS. You need to have multiple question marks in the middle of your sentence to fail.
    Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
    Three 20 amp circuits.
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,002
    edited October 2013
    I believe an old saying comes to mind.....You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

    Another guy who reads junk on the internet to validate the answers he wants to hear. Typical.....
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,734
    edited October 2013
    Anyone else think mindless and jestered are the same person? I mean, the odds of 2 people being like that are astronomical.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • MindlessCorpse
    MindlessCorpse Posts: 27
    edited November 2013
    reading here is what it must be what it is like when a group of old men sit around a table in a closed room and laugh at each others farts
    Panasonic SMART VIERA 60" Class GT50 Series Full HD 3D Plasma HDTV/TC-P60GT50
    Pioneer Elite SC05 AVR
    2 x Polk Audio TSx550T front channels
    2 x Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II rear channels
    1 x Polk Audio CS2 center
    2 x Polk Audio PSW505 Subwoofers (under the rear Monitor 70's)
    1 x Panasonic 3-D Blu Ray Player
    Dish Networks Sat
    2 x HDTV DVRs
    XBOX 360 (MindlessCorpse)
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,002
    edited November 2013
    MindlessCorpse wrote: »
    reading here is what it must be what it is like when a group of old men sit around a table in a closed room and laugh at each others farts

    Don't try that at home my good man, leave the farts to the professionals.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • Nightfall
    Nightfall Posts: 10,086
    edited November 2013
    F1nut wrote: »
    Here's an excellent article about what bi-amping is and is not, http://sound.westhost.com/bi-amp.htm

    The Denon weights 20.7 pounds, the Elite SC series weigh twice that. Hell, the power supply for my main 2 channel amp weighs over 40 lbs. alone.

    Whoever told you your Denon has a power supply for each amp channel is mistaken. Yes, it has discrete amp channels, but they still share one power supply.
    I see you have chosen to ignore this post. Your name is indeed fitting.
    afterburnt wrote: »
    They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.

    Village Idiot of Club Polk
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  • MindlessCorpse
    MindlessCorpse Posts: 27
    edited November 2013
    LOL... you are the one watching a phillips 46" LED
    Panasonic SMART VIERA 60" Class GT50 Series Full HD 3D Plasma HDTV/TC-P60GT50
    Pioneer Elite SC05 AVR
    2 x Polk Audio TSx550T front channels
    2 x Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II rear channels
    1 x Polk Audio CS2 center
    2 x Polk Audio PSW505 Subwoofers (under the rear Monitor 70's)
    1 x Panasonic 3-D Blu Ray Player
    Dish Networks Sat
    2 x HDTV DVRs
    XBOX 360 (MindlessCorpse)
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  • drummer86
    drummer86 Posts: 441
    edited November 2013
    Mindless, what is your main objective with these posts? In your best case scenario, what is the outcome of comments like the above? I teach middle school all week. I'd like a break from this kind of childish behavior on the weekends please.
    Display: LG 47" LCD | AVR: Marantz SR5005 | BD: Panasonic BDT-210 | CD/SACD: Oppo 980 |
    Amps: Rotel RB-990bx | Marantz MA-500 | Speakers: Totem Mite : Totem Mite-C : RC60i | Sub: HSU VTF-2 MKIV

    HK AVR635 | Polk R30 | Sony DVD/SACD Player
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  • MindlessCorpse
    MindlessCorpse Posts: 27
    edited November 2013
    wasnt me who started the derogatory condescending attitudes and remarks. And what with the remarks posted, I would appear to be remaining mostly civil.
    What is the point of Your remark ?
    Panasonic SMART VIERA 60" Class GT50 Series Full HD 3D Plasma HDTV/TC-P60GT50
    Pioneer Elite SC05 AVR
    2 x Polk Audio TSx550T front channels
    2 x Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II rear channels
    1 x Polk Audio CS2 center
    2 x Polk Audio PSW505 Subwoofers (under the rear Monitor 70's)
    1 x Panasonic 3-D Blu Ray Player
    Dish Networks Sat
    2 x HDTV DVRs
    XBOX 360 (MindlessCorpse)
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  • drummer86
    drummer86 Posts: 441
    edited November 2013
    MindlessCorpse wrote: »
    wasnt me who started the derogatory condescending attitudes and remarks. And what with the remarks posted, I would appear to be remaining mostly civil.
    What is the point of Your remark ?

    "He started it."

    It's at this point I usually look at my students and say "Which one of you is going to choose to be the bigger person?"

    Don't attack me for trying to bring some sense to this senselessness.
    Display: LG 47" LCD | AVR: Marantz SR5005 | BD: Panasonic BDT-210 | CD/SACD: Oppo 980 |
    Amps: Rotel RB-990bx | Marantz MA-500 | Speakers: Totem Mite : Totem Mite-C : RC60i | Sub: HSU VTF-2 MKIV

    HK AVR635 | Polk R30 | Sony DVD/SACD Player
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,734
    edited November 2013
    MindlessCorpse wrote: »
    It was me who started the derogatory condescending attitudes and remarks. And what with the remarks posted, I would appear to be a vile....small, small troll.

    ....
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    edited November 2013
    He took an almost 2 week break, and then returned with a weak attempt of flatulent humor. That has to be a classic definition of a troll.
    Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
    Three 20 amp circuits.
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  • Nightfall
    Nightfall Posts: 10,086
    edited November 2013
    MindlessCorpse wrote: »
    LOL... you are the one watching a phillips 46" LED
    I bought what fits my budget and I happen to enjoy my TV.

    Sorry to have offended you.
    afterburnt wrote: »
    They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.

    Village Idiot of Club Polk
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  • MindlessCorpse
    MindlessCorpse Posts: 27
    edited November 2013
    Nightfall wrote: »
    I bought what fits my budget and I happen to enjoy my TV.

    Sorry to have offended you.
    So did I.
    And, as now on thinking on it, You have not been one of the few who are antagonistic in this, so I do Apologize for the unnecessary comment. I guess that a few have made me to be a bit defensive. Again,
    My Apologies Nightfall
    Panasonic SMART VIERA 60" Class GT50 Series Full HD 3D Plasma HDTV/TC-P60GT50
    Pioneer Elite SC05 AVR
    2 x Polk Audio TSx550T front channels
    2 x Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II rear channels
    1 x Polk Audio CS2 center
    2 x Polk Audio PSW505 Subwoofers (under the rear Monitor 70's)
    1 x Panasonic 3-D Blu Ray Player
    Dish Networks Sat
    2 x HDTV DVRs
    XBOX 360 (MindlessCorpse)
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  • Nightfall
    Nightfall Posts: 10,086
    edited November 2013
    It just seems like you are ignoring information and advice from people that have been in this hobby a long time and have owned a ton of equipment trading up on the way to some very high end setups. One of our members fabricated their own midwoofer gasket rings (ToolFan66), one is building an amp with the help of Bob Carver (nooshinjohn), and I'm sure there are more equally impressive things that I don't know because I haven't been here that long. I'm sure they know what they're talking about, why would so many different people be invested in steering you wrong?

    Anyhow, I could have been nicer in my first post. My apology stands. You'll either do some research, including testing things and hearing them for yourself, and you'll stick around or you'll go to a certain AVR forum where everyone believes anything to do with the word audiophile is snake oil.
    afterburnt wrote: »
    They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.

    Village Idiot of Club Polk
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