DSD CD vs DSD SACD?

skrol
skrol Posts: 3,387
edited September 2013 in Music & Movies
I am a little confused. I thought that DSD was a form of SACD. However, I have a Telarc copy of Vivaldi's Four Seasons on CD (non-SACD) which indicates that it is DSD and a copy that is SACD DSD of the same disc.

http://www.amazon.com/Four-Seasons-Martin-Pearlman/dp/B001LOR3L8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1378445534&sr=8-1&keywords=vivaldi+four+seasons+SAcd

Apparently there are non-SACD DSD discs?

Stan
Stan

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Marantz SR7010, Polk: RTA11TL (RDO198-1, XO and Damping Upgrades), S4, CS250, PSW110 , Marantz UD5005, Pioneer PL-530, Panasonic TC-P42S60

Other stuff:
Denon: DRA-835R, AVR-888, DCD-660, DRM-700A, DRR-780; Polk: S8, Monitor 5A, 5B, TSi100, RM7, PSW10 (DXi104 upgrade); Pioneer: CT-6R; Onkyo CP-1046F; Ortofon OM5E, Marantz: PM5004, CD5004, CDR-615; Parasound C/PT-600, HCA-800ii, Sony CDP-650ESD, Technics SA 5070, B&W DM601
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Comments

  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    edited September 2013
    The one you linked is an SACD. There is no such thing as a DSD CD since the CD spec does not use DSD for encoding. There are becoming available for download DSD files. However, I don't think it is possible to burn these onto a CD and then play them back on an SACD player, but that is just a guess.

    It is possible the music was recorded by DSD, but if so it is converted to CD format for sale as a CD. Think of the CD as the MP3 version of the DSD file.
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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,509
    edited September 2013
    DSD-CD means it was recorded from a DSD master but the high sample rate is dithered down to 44.1 kHz 16 bit PCM to be compliant with redbook players. A real or native DSD recording is gonna sound better. DSD is 1-bit with a sampling rate of 2.8224 MHz, or 64 times that of a CD.
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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,509
    edited September 2013
    Just a FYI for those who may not know…

    SACD stand for Super Audio Compact Disc and is a proprietary disc format developed by Sony in the late 90's. DSD (Direct Stream Digital) is an open format that does not require licensing for selling or playing back the files.


    Some interesting reading at DSD Guide.

    http://dsd-guide.com/

    http://dsd-guide.com/technical-documents

    Blue Coast and others offer DSD downloads in DFF format.

    http://bluecoastrecords.com/tags/dsd-downloads

    A simple file explanation from DSD Guide faq.

    "DSD or Direct Stream Digital is a one bit recording format. DSF and DFF are 'kinds' of audio files that are delivered as downloads or read by software for playback.

    DSF has the ability to hold metadata and DFF doesn't, however, some players (Foobar) only read DFF files.

    In PCM recording, DSF and DFF would be similar to having .wav and .aiff files which are both PCM"


    Many DAC chips can decode native DSD but the input is not always provided. Some DIY’ers have modded their CD/SACD players to export native DSD off SACD’s to their DIY DAC’s or via DFF from their 'puties hard drive. ;)

    My bad, forgot....

    http://www.sa-cd.net/forum
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
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  • skrol
    skrol Posts: 3,387
    edited September 2013
    Wow, that is some good into. Thanks
    Stan

    Main 2ch:
    Polk LSi15 (DB840 upgrade), Parasound: P/LD-1100, HCA-1000A; Denon: DVD-2910, DRM-800A; Benchmark DAC1, Monster HTS3600-MKII, Grado SR-225i; Technics SL-J2, Parasound PPH-100.

    HT:
    Marantz SR7010, Polk: RTA11TL (RDO198-1, XO and Damping Upgrades), S4, CS250, PSW110 , Marantz UD5005, Pioneer PL-530, Panasonic TC-P42S60

    Other stuff:
    Denon: DRA-835R, AVR-888, DCD-660, DRM-700A, DRR-780; Polk: S8, Monitor 5A, 5B, TSi100, RM7, PSW10 (DXi104 upgrade); Pioneer: CT-6R; Onkyo CP-1046F; Ortofon OM5E, Marantz: PM5004, CD5004, CDR-615; Parasound C/PT-600, HCA-800ii, Sony CDP-650ESD, Technics SA 5070, B&W DM601
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  • CoolJazz
    CoolJazz Posts: 570
    edited September 2013
    You can also add Acoustic Sounds to the list for DSD downloads....

    http://store.acousticsounds.com/superhirez

    CJ
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    More amazing Internet Science Pink Panther wisdom..."My DAC has since been upgraded from Mark Levinson to Topping."
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  • Danny Tse
    Danny Tse Posts: 5,206
    edited September 2013
    SCompRacer wrote: »
    DSD-CD means it was recorded from a DSD master but the high sample rate is dithered down to 44.1 kHz 16 bit PCM to be compliant with redbook players. A real or native DSD recording is gonna sound better. DSD is 1-bit with a sampling rate of 2.8224 MHz, or 64 times that of a CD.

    On a Telarc CD that has been DSD-mastered, it will still display the DSD logo. However, there are other DSD-mastered CDs, like those of Elvis from Sony, that don't.

    DSD was originally developed by Sony to archive master tapes in a digital format. When Sony figured that it can re-sell the music again to the consumers, it developed SACD. The rest, as it goes, is history.
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  • gumbay13
    gumbay13 Posts: 360
    edited September 2013
    SCompRacer wrote: »
    Just a FYI for those who may not know…

    SACD stand for Super Audio Compact Disc and is a proprietary disc format developed by Sony in the late 90's. DSD (Direct Stream Digital) is an open format that does not require licensing for selling or playing back the files.


    Some interesting reading at DSD Guide.

    http://dsd-guide.com/

    http://dsd-guide.com/technical-documents

    Blue Coast and others offer DSD downloads in DFF format.

    http://bluecoastrecords.com/tags/dsd-downloads

    A simple file explanation from DSD Guide faq.

    "DSD or Direct Stream Digital is a one bit recording format. DSF and DFF are 'kinds' of audio files that are delivered as downloads or read by software for playback.

    DSF has the ability to hold metadata and DFF doesn't, however, some players (Foobar) only read DFF files.

    In PCM recording, DSF and DFF would be similar to having .wav and .aiff files which are both PCM"


    Many DAC chips can decode native DSD but the input is not always provided. Some DIY’ers have modded their CD/SACD players to export native DSD off SACD’s to their DIY DAC’s or via DFF from their 'puties hard drive. ;)

    My bad, forgot....

    http://www.sa-cd.net/forum

    Thanks for the info and clarification.
    I was a bit confused about this format myself.
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  • zane77
    zane77 Posts: 1,696
    edited September 2013
    SCompRacer, thanks for the info and the links!
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  • GlennDog
    GlennDog Posts: 3,121
    edited September 2013
    zane77 wrote: »
    SCompRacer, thanks for the info and the links!

    Ditto on that. Thanks Rich!!

    G
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