5.1 Speaker/receiver set up for beginner

yrh

Hello,

I just placed an order for the following speakers today. First time shopping for a home theater system so any
feedback on this configuration is greatly appreciated!

I have read from other sources that I really need a dedicated amp to run the A9 speakers, can someone tell me if
this is true? What are my options for receivers (and) amp to run these babies? Detail is appreciated since I am
new to the audio world.

Center - F/XiA6 Black
Sub - DSW PRO 660 wi Black
Front - RTiA9 Black
Rear - CSiA6 Black

Thanks!

chiptouz

yrh,

This would work nicely for you:

Emotiva UMC-200 Pre-amp $599
Emotiva XPA-5 Amplifier $999

If you have a bigger budget also pick up an XPA-2 ($899) and have the A9's run off those. Use the XPA-5 for center + surrounds. At least that is my plan. The XPA-5 now for the traditional 5.1 and two channels off my Denon. Then pick up an XPA-2 for the fronts when I get my dedicated room.

Chip

yrh

Chip,

Thank you so much for the quick reply!

Are you concerned about XPA-5's power output (200W) might not be enough for the A9? What if I go with XPR-5 with 400W per channel? Do you think that will handle it so I don't need another XPA-2?

I see that UMC-200 is is for 7.1 Home Theater - does it matter at all since my setup is a 5.1?

yrh

PolkieMan

If you not rich and you have a 14x18 room you could get this for $400.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?nm_mc=AFC-TechBargains&cm_mmc=AFC-TechBargains-_-NA-_-NA-_-NA&Item=9SIA2GA0X61187

rpf65

Welcome to Club Polk.

My advice would be to step back a little. Your going from HTIB to a whole new level here.

The first thing you really should do is go a listen to different brands of AVR's. All manufacturers sound different. For instance Yamaha, Pioneer, Denon, and Onkyo all make quality products. They all sound a little different, just as all speaker manufacturers sound different. You may think one manufacturer sounds great, and the next 3 people may think it is the worse thing ever invented by mankind. None of you a right or wrong, that's just the way it is.

Go out and listen. That's the best place to start, then ask advice on a manufacturer or 3. You'll get much better advice.

yrh

Thanks PolkieMan. The room is 22' deep and 18' wide. I have a pretty flexible budget but I don't think I am sophisticated enough to be able to tell the difference. So for the most part I want to aim at mid-range product just like these speakers.

rfg65 - thanks for the advice. I went to best buy this weekend but they don't have many on display that you can actually listen. Is there a particular store I should go to listen to brands like Emotiva?

Btw, thank you so much guys. I did not expect this many replies:) They are all very helpful!

eclypse

I second the Emotiva amps!

You wont really need more then a XPA-2 as its got a lot of power but as the saying goes you never have enough power. The only reason to go for more power is for dynamics.. the areas where the source calls for more power (peak power) like explosions in movies and cymbals in music.. ext.

With that said yeah.. if you can get you a XPR-5 and call it good for many years to come. I to would rather just buy it right the first time then to just keep feeling the need to upgrade every couple of years.

Also a pair of XPA-1 and a XPA-3 or 5 would be wanted for your center/surround speakers. Obviously just cheaper and easier to just grab the XPR-5 and be done with it.

Also note that the XPA-1 and XPR amps use a 20 amp plug but you can either just get an adapter that will go from a 20 amp to 15 amp outlet or just get a CMX-2 adapter from emotive as one would want the filter system anyways using there amps. If you need more then 2 outlets then you should get a CMX-10 and connect it to the CMX-2 as the 10 model don't have the filter crap that the 2 has.

rpf65

Unless you have a BB with a Magnolia store in it, demoing AVR's is pretty hard. I haven't been to a Walmart in 20 years, but they do sell the entry level of a few quality manufacturers, so you may get an idea there, if you can listen to them. At least I heard they are selling entry level Pioneer products.

Fry's has a few manufacturers they sell and you can listen too.

May be a place to start, even entry level AVR's will have the manufacturers signature sound. Just the high end gear usually sounds better.

eclypse

Just don't get caught up in the stated wattage for recievers! Whatever they state is really only for running a pair of speakers.. The wattages goes down as you add the other speakers. The only way to get true watts (what the state) is to run separate amps.

yrh

eclypse wrote: »

I second the Emotiva amps!

You wont really need more then a XPA-2 as its got a lot of power but as the saying goes you never have enough power. The only reason to go for more power is for dynamics.. the areas where the source calls for more power (peak power) like explosions in movies and cymbals in music.. ext.

With that said yeah.. if you can get you a XPR-5 and call it good for many years to come. I to would rather just buy it right the first time then to just keep feeling the need to upgrade every couple of years.

Also a pair of XPA-1 and a XPA-3 or 5 would be wanted for your center/surround speakers. Obviously just cheaper and easier to just grab the XPR-5 and be done with it.

Also note that the XPA-1 and XPR amps use a 20 amp plug but you can either just get an adapter that will go from a 20 amp to 15 amp outlet or just get a CMX-2 adapter from emotive as one would want the filter system anyways using there amps. If you need more then 2 outlets then you should get a CMX-10 and connect it to the CMX-2 as the 10 model don't have the filter crap that the 2 has.

Thanks. So basically CMX-2 will be able to convert 20 amp to 15 amp? I read the manufacture site but could not find anything on this.

http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/accessories/products/cmx2

Also, would Emotiva UMC-200 be a good preamp for this?

Much appreciated!

falconcry72

Congrats on the awesome speakers! Here are a few notes, based on personal experience:

1. You do not NEED an external power amplifier to drive these speakers. A beefy reciever will do the job quite nicely.

2. If you are dead-set on buying an external power amplifier right off the bat, I would not recommend Emotiva. Your RTi's are bright speakers already, and Emotiva amps are bright as well. I would go for something warmer, or more nuetral sounding. This would be something from the likes of B&K, Parasound, Rotel, Adcom etc.

3. For a pre/pro or receiver, I would recommend something that uses the industry standards for room calibration: Audessey or MCACC. This would be something from the likes of Onkyo, Integra, Denon, Marantz, Pioneer etc.


Here's what I would do:

1. Get a nice beefy reciever (with preouts just in case). Hook it up and listen for a while. Does it meet your needs? Great! You're done! Is something lacking? OK you may need an external power amplifier.

2. So, what EXACTLY is lacking? All power amplifiers sound different, so you need to decide very specifically about what you're trying to achieve here. Do you want more bass, less bass, more treble, less treble, better dynamics, more smoothness etc. If you find that the speakers sound a little too bright, go with a warm amp. If the speakers don't sound bright enough (highly doubt this will happen), then go with a bright amp like Emotiva.


Take it one step at a time and see what works for you.

yrh

Thanks falconcry72.

Would you mind elaborate what is a "beefy" receiver? (e.g. how much watt per channel?) I've read different brands pair well with different speakers. So is there a particular brand that would work better with Polk?

I am planning on using these speakers for karaoke as well, not sure if that's gonna make a whole lot of different on the type of receiver or pre/pro. Any thoughts?

falconcry72

yrh wrote: »

Thanks falconcry72.

Would you mind elaborate what is a "beefy" receiver? (e.g. how much watt per channel?) I've read different brands pair well with different speakers. So is there a particular brand that would work better with Polk?

I am planning on using these speakers for karaoke as well, not sure if that's gonna make a whole lot of different on the type of receiver or pre/pro. Any thoughts?

A Denon 4311 or Onkyo 3009 would do the trick.

cfrizz

Welcome to Club Polk Yrh! Pick a receiver that has all the bells and whistles that you want it to have and get a 5 channel 200wpc @ 8 ohms amplifier and enjoy. Or get the Emotiva UMC-200 along with the Emotiva XPA-5 and you will be all set for some time to come.

Can your speakers be run without an amp yes. However, if you want them to run to their full potential, then you are better off getting a powerful amp since the majority of receivers do not power speakers to their full potential.

Since you have no problem with total separates then getting an Emotiva prepro/amp combo is a good starting place especially brand new gear.

BTW, the FxiA-6 are your surround speakers & the CsiA-6 is your center speaker.

chiptouz

yrh wrote: »

Chip,

Thank you so much for the quick reply!

Are you concerned about XPA-5's power output (200W) might not be enough for the A9? What if I go with XPR-5 with 400W per channel? Do you think that will handle it so I don't need another XPA-2?

I see that UMC-200 is is for 7.1 Home Theater - does it matter at all since my setup is a 5.1?

yrh

Yrh,

Two hundred is still low for the A9's for they love as much power as you send them, but will drive those A9's well. That is why people on these forums state that they are power hungry. At 200w/channel this amp is going to have about double any good av receiver will put out when you are driving 5 channels. For example my Denon states 130w/channel but when you are driving 5 channels it is about 118 w/channel. Even less at 7.1 at 113 w/channel. If you can afford the XPR-5 definitely get it. Those A9's will love the 400 w/channel.

The good thing about any av receiver or pre amp is that you can run 5.1, 6.1, 7.1, 9.1, and sometimes 11.1. It all depends on what you want to do. If you only want to run a 5.1 system so be it. The other two channels will be there for the future. If you have no intention to ever upgrade then you are good. If you have plans for future upgrade to 9.1 or 11.1 (or .2 if you want to add another sub) then you should probably look elsewhere for a pre-amp. Now when it comes to av receivers some can be used as a pre-amp as long as the one you purchase has pre-amp outputs. Most lower cost receivers do not have pre-amp outputs.

But agree with another poster that states that you really need to look around. I have been playing the HT game for a while and have had Sony, Sony ES and now Denon equipment. All have been step up models for me, so I understand what he is saying. I was once in the realm of never wanting to go seperates, but when you start getting better equipment and want to do different things for me it makes sense. So if I was to get a new av receiver, for what I want it for, it would be more expensive than buying the Emotiva equipment and probably not be as powerfull. I just see going the pre-amp and amplifier route as allowing me to have more options moving forward. That is why I recommended it for you.

Chip

yrh

Chip - thanks for the detailed explanation!

Now I see the two options and they both make a lot of sense.

Say if I am getting a 9.2 AV Receiver like falconcry72 suggested, do you guys think I can bi-amp (just learned this term today!) the two floor speaks to take up 2 channels for more power? Can this be done easily?

chiptouz

yrh wrote: »

Thanks falconcry72.

Would you mind elaborate what is a "beefy" receiver? (e.g. how much watt per channel?) I've read different brands pair well with different speakers. So is there a particular brand that would work better with Polk?

I am planning on using these speakers for karaoke as well, not sure if that's gonna make a whole lot of different on the type of receiver or pre/pro. Any thoughts?

Yrh,

By beefy I think falconcry72 means more power. The top end Denon AVR-4520ci retails for $2500. It has stated 150w/channel. But I am not sure what the true output is with all channels driven. It seems like a very nice av receiver and would be the one I bought to replace the one I have if I decided to stay with an av receiver. It would also be about $900 more expensive that the emotive setup I mentioned before.

Now about Emotiva, there is sort of a war going on here about if Emotiva is good compared to other more well known non-internet only sales companies. I am not associated with Emotiva nor do I own any of their products yet, but you will pay way more for a B&K, Parasound, Rotel, Adcom etc. amplifier for the same specs. Some will say they can hear a difference, some will not. Like I said it is a battle right now. But for me, I am going to give them a chance. 30 day demo + free shipping on a 90 lbs package.

I hope I help and not muddy the waters for you.

Chip

chiptouz

yrh wrote: »

Chip - thanks for the detailed explanation!

Now I see the two options and they both make a lot of sense.

Say if I am getting a 9.2 AV Receiver like falconcry72 suggested, do you guys think I can bi-amp (just learned this term today!) the two floor speaks to take up 2 channels for more power? Can this be done easily?

I was once in the same boat as you are. Once you do some research and read the posts here you will probably come to the same conclusion as I did. It isn't worth it and doesn't really add anything to the sound. Again, it is one of those items that causes a lot of debate in these forums. Just don't get them discussing cables....That leads nowhere.

yrh

chiptouz wrote: »

I was once in the same boat as you are. Once you do some research and read the posts here you will probably come to the same conclusion as I did. It isn't worth it and doesn't really add anything to the sound. Again, it is one of those items that causes a lot of debate in these forums. Just don't get them discussing cables....That leads nowhere.

Thanks for sharing. I thought I never had to worry about learning technical knowledge after I finished my professional exams, but with our first house I feel I need to catch up on so many things! So glad polk created this forum cz otherwise I would be so lost!

Now all I need is the order confirmation so I will have more momentum to continue my research...

tigertom1965

You are stating that your center is the F/XiA6 and your rear is the CSIA6. Either you have them mixed up or you goofed somewhere as the F/XiA6 is a surround speaker Dipole/Bipole speaker and the CSiA6 is a center channel speaker.
If you are a newbie I am asking why did you go with the RTiA9 speakers for the fronts instead of the RTiA7 speakers? Did you go with the best because that is what someone told you to do or did you actually listen to them in the store or somewhere else? Personally I would have gotten the RTiA7 speakers and gotten two subs for that room size to help balance the bass. Also understand I am a newbie as well but as a newbie I wouldn't have blown the budget right away. Now you need to spend hundreds more until they will work like they were intended. I am planning on going the upgrade route and won't blow the budget on a single set of speakers. I would rather get something more budget conscious and listen to them in the room and figured out what is lacking and upgrade from there.
I also understand that your budget might be much greater than mine as I have only gotten RTiA3 for the fronts and found they are not enough speaker for me at my lower listening volumes I use. Don't get me wrong they sound good but not better than my 10 year old Onkyo 5.1 set up. I also got the CSiA6 center. My plan is a new sub and either a larger front, maybe the RTiA7, or the FXiA4 or 6 for the rear, Or both and make it a 7.1 setup. Now if I can figure out some other room setup as my TV and setup is in the far left corner of the room next to a picture window.
I do have 1 question about the A9s though. If you got a 400 watt/channel amp will they still sound great when you are listening to them at low volumes so you don't wake the family? Or do they just need all that wattage to sound as loud as your other speakers do at a lower volume level? i.e. they just need more wattage to drive all the speakers in the housing. I really don't know enough about them so that is why I am asking.

falconcry72

tigertom1965 wrote: »

You are stating that your center is the F/XiA6 and your rear is the CSIA6. Either you have them mixed up or you goofed somewhere as the F/XiA6 is a surround speaker Dipole/Bipole speaker and the CSiA6 is a center channel speaker.
If you are a newbie I am asking why did you go with the RTiA9 speakers for the fronts instead of the RTiA7 speakers? Did you go with the best because that is what someone told you to do or did you actually listen to them in the store or somewhere else? Personally I would have gotten the RTiA7 speakers and gotten two subs for that room size to help balance the bass. Also understand I am a newbie as well but as a newbie I wouldn't have blown the budget right away. Now you need to spend hundreds more until they will work like they were intended. I am planning on going the upgrade route and won't blow the budget on a single set of speakers. I would rather get something more budget conscious and listen to them in the room and figured out what is lacking and upgrade from there.
I also understand that your budget might be much greater than mine as I have only gotten RTiA3 for the fronts and found they are not enough speaker for me at my lower listening volumes I use. Don't get me wrong they sound good but not better than my 10 year old Onkyo 5.1 set up. I also got the CSiA6 center. My plan is a new sub and either a larger front, maybe the RTiA7, or the FXiA4 or 6 for the rear, Or both and make it a 7.1 setup. Now if I can figure out some other room setup as my TV and setup is in the far left corner of the room next to a picture window.
I do have 1 question about the A9s though. If you got a 400 watt/channel amp will they still sound great when you are listening to them at low volumes so you don't wake the family? Or do they just need all that wattage to sound as loud as your other speakers do at a lower volume level? i.e. they just need more wattage to drive all the speakers in the housing. I really don't know enough about them so that is why I am asking.

You have contributed absolutely nothing to the OP with this rant. If you have a specific question about your setup, feel free to start a new thread. If your opinion is that the OP "did it wrong", that is now noted. Thanks.

Welcome to CP by the way! :biggrin:

yrh

tigertom1965 wrote: »

You are stating that your center is the F/XiA6 and your rear is the CSIA6. Either you have them mixed up or you goofed somewhere as the F/XiA6 is a surround speaker Dipole/Bipole speaker and the CSiA6 is a center channel speaker.
If you are a newbie I am asking why did you go with the RTiA9 speakers for the fronts instead of the RTiA7 speakers? Did you go with the best because that is what someone told you to do or did you actually listen to them in the store or somewhere else? Personally I would have gotten the RTiA7 speakers and gotten two subs for that room size to help balance the bass. Also understand I am a newbie as well but as a newbie I wouldn't have blown the budget right away. Now you need to spend hundreds more until they will work like they were intended. I am planning on going the upgrade route and won't blow the budget on a single set of speakers. I would rather get something more budget conscious and listen to them in the room and figured out what is lacking and upgrade from there.
I also understand that your budget might be much greater than mine as I have only gotten RTiA3 for the fronts and found they are not enough speaker for me at my lower listening volumes I use. Don't get me wrong they sound good but not better than my 10 year old Onkyo 5.1 set up. I also got the CSiA6 center. My plan is a new sub and either a larger front, maybe the RTiA7, or the FXiA4 or 6 for the rear, Or both and make it a 7.1 setup. Now if I can figure out some other room setup as my TV and setup is in the far left corner of the room next to a picture window.
I do have 1 question about the A9s though. If you got a 400 watt/channel amp will they still sound great when you are listening to them at low volumes so you don't wake the family? Or do they just need all that wattage to sound as loud as your other speakers do at a lower volume level? i.e. they just need more wattage to drive all the speakers in the housing. I really don't know enough about them so that is why I am asking.

You are right that I got them mixed up:)

Basically I had no idea how to set up the 5.1 speaker system so I just copied what others have configured. Hopefully it will work out for me! I do not really listen to loud music but I love singing. What I notice with less powerful speaker is that sometimes your voice would break up and this is why I went with the A9. Probabaly an overkill cz I'm sure the A3 or A5 would do the job. I just don't want to build up a lot of hype and end up disappointed so I went with the best. From what I read on this forum so far I am not regretting!

rpf65

yrh wrote: »

You are right that I got them mixed up:)

Basically I had no idea how to set up the 5.1 speaker system so I just copied what others have configured. Hopefully it will work out for me! I do not really listen to loud music but I love singing. What I notice with less powerful speaker is that sometimes your voice would break up and this is why I went with the A9. Probabaly an overkill cz I'm sure the A3 or A5 would do the job. I just don't want to build up a lot of hype and end up disappointed so I went with the best. From what I read on this forum so far I am not regretting!

Although it may have been that your speakers were a little under sized for the room, most of the time it's the AVR/receiver/amp that is the issue. Your A9's for instance need a lot of power to preform the way they were designed too. You can forget that 50-500 watt rating. That lower end rating will make coherent sound come out of them, but they won't sound all that good. Demoed the A9's powered by 125 watt AVR, and they were not a very good sounding speaker, the A5's sounded better.

Most of the time when it sounds like static, or some such distortion it will be that your speakers are under-powered, providing evry thing is connected/working properly. Even at low volumes, underpowered speakers will sound distorted, or at least not produce a clean sound. That's why everybody recommends an amp with those speakers. You can get a top of the line Pioneer, Onkyo, Denon, or take your pick, and it may actually be fine on 2 channel audio. When you add those other 3 speakers, the sound will start degrading pretty quickly.

The most dangerous thing you can do to those speakers is under power. Lack of power kills far more speakers than too much power.

yrh

thx rpf65, I am inclined to go with XPR-5.

Do you guys think Emotiva will have a sale soon? The rep told me the next sale will be Nov/Dec but I don't think I wanna wait that long. Guess with these pre/amp the price is pretty stable right?

chiptouz

Yrh,

Emotiva just ended their summer sale. I think they had the XPR-5 for $1699. That amp will last you a long time and you will be amazed by the way your a9's sound. That is definitely a good one for the money.

Chip