Amp selection?!?!

lasdj
lasdj Posts: 16
edited June 2013 in Speakers
Hi,
I currently am looking for a new receiver for my current setup. i am coming from a onkyo rc260 and would like to upgrade and get a new amp to power my fronts. i have a full rti series.
rti8 fronts
csi5
rti6 side
and rti4 rear.
bic f12 sub

i will also be upgrading the fronts in the future as well but will keep this setup for a year or so and will want to get the lsi series. but i wanted to make sure the receiver and amp will be good for my new upgrade, if not what should you recommend for my current setup? receiver and amp?

thanks
Post edited by lasdj on
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  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,655
    edited May 2013
    A budget is helpful.

    Without knowing a budget my personal recommendation would be one of the Pioneer Elite SC AVRs.
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited May 2013
    ZLTFUL wrote: »
    A budget is helpful.

    Without knowing a budget my personal recommendation would be one of the Pioneer Elite SC AVRs.

    my budget for the receiver should be around $1200 but the lower the better. amp i hopefully dont know what to expect as my budget. maybe $400? one thing i need is that the receiver has to have 2 hdmi out because i have a tv and a projector running in my living room.

    thanks
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  • jeremymarcinko
    jeremymarcinko Posts: 3,785
    edited May 2013
    Onkyo tx-nr828 has two hdmi outs and pre amp outs can be purchased under $1200. Last years 818 available on Amazon $800. The pioneers elite sc sound could be subjectively better though. But adding an amp to either is the right path.
    Oh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant
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  • B Run
    B Run Posts: 1,888
    edited May 2013
    I'd pick up a used Pioneer Elite SC, you'll be able to find plenty within your budget.
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited May 2013
    is there any specific model of the pioneer elite sc? also regarding the onkyo the only worry i have is the hdmi output and if the quality is up to par with others like pioneer.

    also was wondering if the speaker setup is currently ok for my needs. the room is 32ft by 12ft.
    fronts: rti8
    center: csi5
    rear: rti4
    sides: rti6
    sub: bic f12
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  • D_M
    D_M Posts: 175
    edited May 2013
    Lasdj,

    Is 3D important to you? There are a lot of pre-3D AVRs that can be had on the used market. You mentioned LSIs as a future upgrade, so you should find a AVR that has pre-outs. The LSIs and most speakers benefit from external amplification.
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited May 2013
    D_M wrote: »
    Lasdj,

    Is 3D important to you? There are a lot of pre-3D AVRs that can be had on the used market. You mentioned LSIs as a future upgrade, so you should find a AVR that has pre-outs. The LSIs and most speakers benefit from external amplification.

    no 3d is not important to me at all. i dont think i have a need for it. and yes i am looking for a avr with pre outs so i can add an external amp. i would like to use my current setup w/ an amp but later on upgrade to lsi series w/o having to buy another amp.
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  • D_M
    D_M Posts: 175
    edited May 2013
    Lasdj,

    I have a Denon bias, so I'm suggesting looking for a used 4308CI. I believe any of the top of the line AVRs from the 2008 -2009 time frame could be had for under $600. I don't know what the other comparable units were from Pioneer, Sony, Harman, Onkyo, Marantz, NAD, Yamaha, etc..... If you do a little bit of leg work, they should be easy enough to track down. Just google 4308ci vs any of the other manufacturers and the comparable unit from that time should come up.
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  • AsSiMiLaTeD
    AsSiMiLaTeD Posts: 11,728
    edited May 2013
    I'll throw in another recommendation for the Pioneer SC series. They have an excellent preamp section, and those ICE amps are also powerful enough to drive most speakers so you'd be fine while saving up for an amp. And then when you do add an amp later you'll still have an excellent preamp section.
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  • Poolgod69
    Poolgod69 Posts: 184
    edited May 2013
    What about potentially saving a bit and obtaining a HDMI switch. Single video signal out to the switch for both TV and Projector. Unsure if it may save big bucks but may allow you some flexability to get the great receiver that might only have the single out.
    Marantz SR 5010
    Kenwood DR-V5070
    Polk RTi A9- Mains
    CSI A6- Center
    Elemental Designs A2-300 Subwoofer
    Panamax M4300-PM Power Conditioner

    Working on updating my set up :rolleyes:
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited May 2013
    Poolgod69 wrote: »
    What about potentially saving a bit and obtaining a HDMI switch. Single video signal out to the switch for both TV and Projector. Unsure if it may save big bucks but may allow you some flexability to get the great receiver that might only have the single out.

    i currently have a good switch however the connection sometimes goes off and rather have a receiver w/ 2 output.
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited May 2013
    AsSiMiLaTeD wrote: »
    I'll throw in another recommendation for the Pioneer SC series. They have an excellent preamp section, and those ICE amps are also powerful enough to drive most speakers so you'd be fine while saving up for an amp. And then when you do add an amp later you'll still have an excellent preamp section.

    i was leaning toward pioneer sc series but didnt know how the ice amp is in terms of quality if i should just an external amp.
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited May 2013
    D_M wrote: »
    Lasdj,

    I have a Denon bias, so I'm suggesting looking for a used 4308CI. I believe any of the top of the line AVRs from the 2008 -2009 time frame could be had for under $600. I don't know what the other comparable units were from Pioneer, Sony, Harman, Onkyo, Marantz, NAD, Yamaha, etc..... If you do a little bit of leg work, they should be easy enough to track down. Just google 4308ci vs any of the other manufacturers and the comparable unit from that time should come up.

    oh that helps alot. i will do some research and come back for more questions. so the 4308ci is a good avr then. i will start with that and see what comes up. thanks
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  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,655
    edited May 2013
    The ICE/D amps in the SC Pioneers are trending towards being the new "gold standard" if you will in AVRs.
    There are AVRs out there that match their output at 2 channels driven but not many can match their claim of maintaining the power levels as speakers are added.
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited June 2013
    thanks, i think i done alot of research and for now i will go w/ the elite sc-67. now i need to get 2 subs. currently i have the f12 however i want something better since my room is pretty big. any suggestion on sub? room is 32x15. i will hold up on an amp for now to see if its truley needed.

    trying to pick up the sc-67, if anyone knows wheres the best place to get it, it'll be appreciated.

    thanks everyone
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  • tiberius1023
    tiberius1023 Posts: 9
    edited June 2013
    What's your budget for the subs?
    AV Receiver Reviews
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited June 2013
    right now i dont want to spend more than $1k on the sub. i would like one that would fill the room and be compliment for my rti system and possibly an upgrade down the road.
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  • theshawn
    theshawn Posts: 70
    edited June 2013
    I'd suggest looking at Onkyo's Integra line too for nice bang for the buck on used receivers with pre-outs, 12v triggers, hdmi, etc.
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  • drummer86
    drummer86 Posts: 441
    edited June 2013
    Marantz SR7005 is well under your $1200 budget from Accessories4Less. Should meet your requirements. I wouldn't wait on upgrading the sub. I think you'll notice a HUGE improvement in that area by adding a high-quality sub from HSU, SVS, or Rhythmik. The audio dealer I purchased my speakers from has a stock room full of broken Integras and Onkyos right now which is all the information I need about the quality of their recent products... just my .02
    Display: LG 47" LCD | AVR: Marantz SR5005 | BD: Panasonic BDT-210 | CD/SACD: Oppo 980 |
    Amps: Rotel RB-990bx | Marantz MA-500 | Speakers: Totem Mite : Totem Mite-C : RC60i | Sub: HSU VTF-2 MKIV

    HK AVR635 | Polk R30 | Sony DVD/SACD Player
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  • obieone
    obieone Posts: 5,077
    edited June 2013
    Another vote for the Pioneer SC's. As for subs, Hsu, SVS, DefTech, Paradigm, Polk all should have something in your price range that will fill the need.
    I refuse to argue with idiots, because people can't tell the DIFFERENCE!
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited June 2013
    ok so i ended up getting the sc67 for 1200 new. so waiting to pick it up later tonight and will install tmr. would the sound be ok for now w/ the f12? or should i really go and get a sub since the bass will be much lower?
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  • jeremymarcinko
    jeremymarcinko Posts: 3,785
    edited June 2013
    You be the judge, there are certainly "better" subs. But if you like the way it sounds, no need to spend anymore for now. That bic gets great reviews.
    Congrats on the the receiver! Very nice.
    Oh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant
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  • bondslex
    bondslex Posts: 109
    edited June 2013
    Listen to your ears!
    LSI 15
    LSI C
    LSI FX
    80 fx ls for atmos
    Velodyne SPL-10
    Marantz 7012
    Panasonic 9000
    JVC 420
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited June 2013
    well i finally hooked it up and calibrated my speakers, i do have a few questions,

    1) the option for speaker setup is 7.1 w/ front bi-amped. i didnt bi-amp the fronts is that ok since the sc-67 only gave it as that option? or should i do the 7.1 w/ 2 zone, i only plan on having the 7.1.

    2) the bic f12 do i place the option to prologic or receiver 5.1, 6.1, 7.1? right now it sounds pretty low for the sub. not sure because maybe my onkyo rc-260 was so low power i heard more the sub and since the sc-67 can power the speaker better its sounding lower since the speaker are more louder?

    3) i accidentally selected thx certified speaker, should i re-calibrate again w/ the correct settings?

    4) should the crossover be 60 or 80?

    5) when i view from my tv for roku, the screen will display the volumn when i change it however when i watch through my projector (hdmi out 2) it doesnt have the setting. is there a way to have the volume display on the screen for hdmi out 2?

    thanks again
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  • theshawn
    theshawn Posts: 70
    edited June 2013
    Congrats on the Elite purchase that's a sweet one. I have no knowledge of that brand though so no help there.

    Considering your current front speakers I think 80 on the crossover will sound better.

    A little confused by wording on #2 but I think the extra power is probably bringing more low end out of your fronts/center etc.

    #3 I would re-calibrate if it were me. THX certified speakers are designed a bit different I believe and if yours is not THX certified then it may send signals to the speaker it can't handle as intended? Maybe some else can support of refute this opinion.

    Good luck with the new setup.
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  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,655
    edited June 2013
    #5...Make sure that overscan/screen size is correct for the projector. If it is not, it could be displaying the volume outside of what the projector is displaying. Not sure what projector you have so I can't really give you direction beyond that. I would however compare the same picture on both displays and see if this is the case. If not, then I'm not sure.
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
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  • lasdj
    lasdj Posts: 16
    edited June 2013
    So I finally I got a few of my questions answered, for the OSD display, it will only display from HDMI OUT 1 and not 2 which I guess is ok. I switch to my my TV as 2 and my projector as HDMI Out 1.

    Yeah I think theshawn is right, I am hearing more low ends on my front speakers so that's maybe why my sub doesnt sound like it did when it was hooked up to the onkyo rc-260 I had previously.

    I have another question, I will re-calibrate my speakers again and unselect THX, but now the receiver I moved back against the wall and the setup mic will not reach:

    1) Can I use a 3.5mm extenstion to connect to the mic to reach the avr ok? Does it have to be mono or stereo?
    2) I checked my BIC F12 speaker setting on the AVR and saw it was setup as -5.0db is that right or should it be lower like -3.0db or close to 0 as possible?

    thanks again
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  • theshawn
    theshawn Posts: 70
    edited June 2013
    lasdj wrote: »
    ....
    2) I checked my BIC F12 speaker setting on the AVR and saw it was setup as -5.0db is that right or should it be lower like -3.0db or close to 0 as possible?

    thanks again

    I don't have any knowledge of the extension issue but the sub setting is subjective to your personal taste. At -5.0db it's obviously set too reduce the subs influence but if you like it then leave it there. Only thing to do is experiment with that setting until you find the setup you like.

    To me the calibration thing would be a starting point and I'd tweak it as necessary for my own listening preferences. Just because the calibration set it there doesn't mean the calibration gods have spoken and changing it means you are doing something wrong.

    I'd say play a section of a movie you like to have a reference point at the current -5.0db, then reset it to -3 or 0 then even +1, +3 or +5 and replay the same section to see it you like another setting better.

    my .02 anyway
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