RTi12s powered by Denon

Skywalker

I have a couple questions, and I know there have been many threads about the new Rti12s, but I wanted to ask my question specifically:

I have a Denon 3802 reciever. I am currently looking for a new set of front speakers and I have my eye on the RTi12s. I know that it would be best to have an external amp to push the 12s, but will my 3802 alone have enough power to make these speaker perform nicely...the technicians at Crutchfield say I will have no problem at all getting awesome performance, but I would like to know what some of you think.


Kind of a two part question, I am also looking for a new dvd player because I'm just running a base-line sony. I'm looking in the ~ $1000 range max. My two main competitors at this point are the Onkyo DVSP-800 and the Denon DVD-2900. Any advice on which is better or advice on another model. I really appreciate the advice.

Denon 3802
Front L/R - RT55i biwired
Center - CSi40 biwired
Surround - R20
Rear Center - CSi30
PSW350

ninerbj

Hello Skywalker...and welcome to the forum.

We all have many differences of opinion on this sight, that is what makes it so special. We are all allowed to put in our .02 so here is mine.

The Denon is a nice warm component that I am sure will have no problems powering the RTi12's if you so choose. Of course seperates are going to sound better and give a much more open soundstage to the 12's, but you may not have that luxury at the moment.
If your taste are anything like mine, (and several others on this forum) you enjoy HT but you want the best of both worlds when it comes to music as well. A lot of us feel that way...that's why we own POLK'S!
You will always have the "what if" questions...that's part of the game we all love/hate the most about this addicting hobby. So I say GO FOR IT!

As far as the dvd player goes. You have your eye on a couple of nice players there. Again with my .02...go for the Denon. Not only does it have SACD and DVD-A capabilities, it was reviewed by some major hitters as having a wonderful picture as well.
I do not know a lot about the Onkyo, other than I have owned Onkyo products in the past and they have held up well.
I have also seen the two perform side by side, and to me, the Denon's picture quality, Sacd and dvd-a features, remote and overall build won me over.
The Denon is not the greatest sounding cd player, but I myself thought it sounded cleaner.

Whatever you choose to do remember...there will always be a critic waiting to tell you what you should have done, just remember...they are your ears, and you are the only critic that needs persuading.

Brad

Dr. Spec

1) No, it doesn't have nearly enough power. If you REALLY want the 12's, get an external amp and run 300-500 wpc.

Othewise, get the 8's and run them with a really great powered sub and get the SQ of the 12's without the headache.

In fact, the 55's are a GREAT speaker. The 350 is the weak link in your armor.

2) Get the 2900.

RVJII

Skywalker I know how you feel as I went through this same dilemma about a month ago. I am running an Onkyo that specs out about the same as the 3803. I have no doubt that if/when I upgrade to a seprate amp (Adcom most likely.) that my 12's will sound unbelievable. However, I can tell you that even running on my current setup they sound great and hit pretty darn hard...which my complaining neighbor can attest to.

The thing about getting the 12's is that they give you room to grow...not to mention a chance to feed your addiction. By getting them I have left myself plenty of room to upgrade my electronics without feeling like I'll have to turn around and upgrade the speakers.

If you do get the 12's remember that they need to break in. They sound good out of the box but once they are broken in I noticed that the mids/highs were smoother and that the bass extended lower and hit harder.


As far as the DVD, I am in the same boat as you...looking to upgrade.

dorokusai

To add to RJ, their is a Sony ES owner, running RTi12's and he is also very happy. Sony STR-DA3ES @ 110wpc.

Is it enough to make them work? Sure. Are you getting the most out of the speakers? No. It's a large speaker and is best served with individual amplification, or a much more robust AVR.

When it comes to DVD....Denon 2900.

Skywalker

Thanks fellas. Though I have not yet decided what I want to do. I appreciate the feedback.

bigsexy1

SW, I can tell you from personal experience that a 3802 wasn't enough to drive a set of 150s set to large at loud volumes (by loud, I mean master volume 00), and this was just on 2 channel music, let alone on a movie with all channels driven and the main L/R LFE included in the mix from them being set to large. It would go into shutdown protection mode from overheating. Keep in mind too that the 2 channel power rating on a 3802 is something like 128 watts per at that. The 12s should be just as hard, if not even harder to drive on a receiver than the 150s are. One good thing about the 12s though, even if set to small and high passed, they should still be great while at the same time reducing the load on the receiver, whereas the 150s were pretty much useless in that regard due to their different crosover frequencies. Somebody, I think it was Fireman99, was running either a set of 150s or 12s with an HK8000, and he said that even that wasn't really enough for them.

I would recomend a seperate power amp of no less than at least 200 watts per channel for them, and that would be the absolute bare minimum at that. As DS pointed out, at least 300 (or even more than that) would be better. In the meantime, set them to small on your 3802, and it will still be OK. Or, if you are willing to lose the 6th rear channel speaker you have, you could bi-amp the 12s with your 3802, and then you probably wouldn't even need to buy another seperate power amp for them, but you then only have 5.1 capability.

dorokusai

SW - Don't get me wrong, you are certainly best served with more power, Big is correct. You can never have enough power for a big speaker. I say never, because most people don't reach into the high wattage category.

The RTi150's seem to have a harder time being driven by low current, low wattage amplifiers. Rather, the amplifiers have a harder time driving the load of the RTI150's.

While we may have two cases of kudos for the RTi12, with low power, it still would be too early to say that its 100% ok.

dfiler

I power a 5.1 setup with a denon 3803.
Main - RT150
Center - CS400
Rear - FX500
Sub - PSW450

The 3803 has enough power to comfortably drive this setup past the point of disturbing many neighboring homes.

However, a friend with similar speakers has a much better sounding system. I guess a few hundred watts per channel from Crown separates helps a bit. Throw a few thousand dollars worth of amplification at the 150s and the sound-stage becomes completely transparent. I suspect the same is true for the 12s.