RT800i to large? CS245i small or large?

hrs

Since everyone was so helpful with my other question, I may as well ask this one! So before these 800i's I had some big Pioneer 3-ways that had a giant 12" woofer but could not do great bass (There was no Internet to teach bigger is not always better in 1991! Well, there was, but listservs can only do so much). Anyway, I had them set to small so the sub would do the bass. Now with the 800i's it seems that set to large the treble and midrange sound clearer while the bass sounds good but slightly less impact and rumble. It is tighter, though. Set to small the sub overwhelms the bass and it sounds like before. Vocals are clearer when set to large which makes no sense since now the drivers are having to make lower tones as well as the higher ones, but my wife and I seem to notice so it can't just be me. I know we are all supposed to do what sounds best to us, but I just like a lot of bass and she does not so I am curious what other people think works for them (guests probably will not be as into pictures falling off the wall as I am).

As far as the 245i, I do not notice any real difference large or small. There does not seem to be any more bass in the voices, so I guess I will leave it to large since that theoretically takes more load off the subwoofer, which is pretty low quality to be doing voices (KLH 10").

Alright, I am done babbling for now. What do you set your speakers at?

ntculenuff

i like a pretty even sound stage strong highs, solid mids and a good booming sub. i do tend to lean a little heavy in the sub area,just a little, can't help it i like to be inside the explosion. i too like to watch my pictures fall off the wall, but my wife, she will complain a little. so, i have the older rt10's (tweet & 1 6.5) and the cs350-ls (tweet & 4 4.5's) i set those all to large. i am running 2 subs i have a definitive 10 connected to my L&R mains crossed over at about 125hz and the gain just shy of 3 o'clock my definitive 12 is connected to the lfe out crossed over around 75-80hz w/the gain just pass 1 o'clock. i have found that this set up works grrrrrreat, having a 2nd sub pick up the low mid has made a tremendous difference. my wife seems a little happpier about the sound now to when she notices a diff things are good, the mid sub just seemed to fill the room up and allowed me to turn the gain down on the low sub. and if it does get a little to bassy i turn down the sub volume a tad. this rarely happens now we have trained her ears to enjoy and enjoy and enjoy

you could set your 800's to large and maybe turn the gain on your sub up, those 800's are there to work let them, you could even adjust the cross over on the sub until you find the sweet spot for your taste.
me personally i would go with large setting and adjust the sub

and remember once you make the wife happy, while she is out the boys will play..CRANK IT UP and enjoy

i watch my movies much louder w/o my wife than with

schumach

I have my fronts set to large (RT1000p) and my center set to small (CS400i). I noticed that the center was crisper when set to small. I have my subs connected to the line levels of the front speakers. With this I turned off the sub in the receiver and I found that it sounded smoother. I have sense tried this with RT35i's as fronts and just a sub and I found that it was easier to create a more balanced sound then having the sub connected to the LFE port. By using the frequency and power level on the sub I could set the bass where it worked for my friend and his wife. The wife part is sometimes the more important factor. This is just another idea to try. Good luck and enjoy the system.

TrappedUnder Ice

My 2000i's set to large..cs400i to small and my 800i's surround large... sounds great. I have tried my 400 at large..and did not care for it at all...

besides.. it what sounds good to you..there is no perfect formula.. if there was...Micah would be selling it under the table ~

Aaron

If you think the RT800's sound better when set to large, but don't think you're getting enough bass this is what I would try. (I'm assuming this is a home theater system since you mention a center channel. )

Make these changes to your receiver's setup:
- subwoofer = OFF (or none)
- mains (L & R) = LARGE
- center = SMALL

Now, with this configuration all the bass (< 90Hz.) from speakers set to SMALL and and the LFE channel will be redirected to your mains. The last thing to do is hook your subwoofer to the mains (L & R) preouts. With this setup the sub will be helping the RT800 reproduce all that bass from SMALL speakers and the LFE channel. This setup also works well for stereo listening.

Aaron

hrs

You mean by sending the main through the sub and letting its crossover do the separation of the bass? I thought of that but figured the crossover on a $100 subwoofer was probably worse than the one in a $200 Pioneer VSX-D498 (although no doubt many will tell me that is also a piece of crap - but it is my piece of crap and they probably don't have that sweet Carver tube amp either!). Most people seem to believe that the sub should be in line between the receiver and the speakers, but these are probably people with quality subwoofers.

schumach

Look on the back of your receiver. You should have your front speaker connections and front L&R preouts. Connect your 800's to the regular speaker connections and the sub to the preouts. Make sure that the sub is set to off. This will give you the effect that Aaron has described. This is how I've got my system setup.

Aaron

Schumach's got it right. I personally don't believe in using speaker-level connections for a subwoofer unless that's the only option. Line-level (RCA interconnects) should provide the best signal. So, connect the subwoofer via the RCA pre-outs on for the L & R channels on the back of your receiver. Let us know how you make out!

Aaron

ntculenuff

I will have to agree with schumach and Aaron. I dont like speaker level connections either too muddy
wy mid sub is connected to the main pre outs also, this method works really well.
having a sub connected this way really ties in your sub with your front stage

hrs

Unfortunately, my receiver only has center and sub preouts, no fronts. After messing around, I have decided that even with the sub turned all the way up, the fronts don't have the same thump that I want, so I have put all five speakers to small and left the sub at a middle volume range with the receiver outputting everything below 100Hz to the sub and the sub's crossover all the way up (since it should only be getting 100Hz and below). Playing Great Gate of Kiev is much more satisfying with the sub doing more work. Thanks for all the suggestions, maybe with a better receiver I could have tried some other things. Stupid requirement to pay for things you want!

ntculenuff

sorry to hear that about your receiver, but now you can look forward to buy a new one down the road. all that realyy matters is that you are enjoying what you have and constantly playing because playing is fun

juice21

i am crippled bye both a weak reciever and sub. the last two components left of my initial home theater ina box. i own the kenwood vsx-309 that has a LFE out paired with the kenwood sub that came with the system with only an LFE in. i have a cs400i, rt800i's, rt 35i's & rt25i's for the rest of the sound. these are definitely out playing my POS sub. i want an SVS sub, but since i just got the 800/35/25's, and it's the time of the year to spend on others:D , it will be a little while till the SVS is in my budget. just for your info. i have the center set to small, the fronts set to large, and the sub set to yes (this is using the LFE input to the sub)... i do find that the 800's are doing alot of the bass work, but the sub can still get some of the lower frequencies that the 800's aren't/can't reach... i don't know if wny of of this is helpful in trying to get the optimum out of your set-up, but like you, i need a new reciever and a new sub...

damn this hobby!!!

newsman

Why are you guys saying that using speaker outs is not optimal, my thoughts are quite opposite - and while I haven't tried to use line outs here are my thoughts: First off, by using speaker outs and the sub, you are offloading bass that mains (in my case 800i) simply can't produce. This way you also remove the tax of producing deep bass and allow for 800i to produce more natural midrange. The rest of the speakers will work exactly as they would with line out setup - all the bass will be filtered out to the sub. That's what I have. BTW is it me or when I set my rears (500f/x) to large they begin to sound fuller and not as thin?

newsman

bump

(sorry want to know people opinions)

rskarvan

I have my PSW650 hooked up via rca's to both my LFE output and my L & R output.

This way, all sound from the small speakers goes to the sub via the LFE route. Also, the full signal from the L&R goes to the sub and can be tweaked via the sub cross-over settings.

I have a hybrid system. I have a preamp and amp that provide stereo sound direct from the dvd player. The pre-amp has a pass-thru mode for when i want to supply sound from the receiver (Denon 3801). I off-load the power handling of the mains from the Denon (underpowered for this task) and I utilize the Denon's internal amps to drive the center and four surround speakers.

When I listen to music, the Denon receiver stays off.
When I want to watch tv, I switch the preamp to pass-thru and turn the Denon receiver on. It really is the best of both worlds.
Someday, I may be able to afford 5 more amps and a processer.
But, until then, the Denon receiver provides this utility.

Coming up with this configuration took a lot of effort.
The seperate pre-amp really helped (balanced XLR outputs).
The noise floor dropped a bunch when I stopped powering the 250wpc amp from the Denon receiver. Its just not really suited to do this task cleanly (no balanced outputs).