an ignorant convo about DACs

sponger

Of course I've always known that some source units sound better than others, but I never really thought about why. I chalked it up to "build quality" and that was about it.

When I upgraded from an entry level Denon to the one I have now, the difference was so obvious and noticeable that I spent an additional moment pondering the reasons. I said to myself, "It must be the DACs."

I was having a conversation with a friend the other day and I said to him, "If you're thinking of getting a new avr, think about the DACs if you're prioritizing sound quality over features." He goes, "I'm sure that technology has come so far that it shouldn't be an issue." I said, "No way, it's about the DACs, and technological advancement has nothing to do with it."

So help me out here. I read the wiki page on DACs and it made no mention of the evolution of said component. Have DACs evolved so that an entry level DAC of today is comparable to the high-end DAC of yesterday? Or is it still about craftsmanship and little else?

Thank you.

BlueFox

sponger wrote: »

When I upgraded from an entry level Denon to the one I have now, the difference was so obvious and noticeable that I spent an additional moment pondering the reasons. I said to myself, "It must be the DACs."

Maybe it was a little hit of everything, better power supply, better components, more power, etc.

tonyb

Dacs alone do not determine the final sound. Build quality, design, and the ever important analog output stage. Even among seperate dacs, the dac chip alone doesn't determine the final sound.

unc2701

tonyb wrote: »

Dacs alone do not determine the final sound. Build quality, design, and the ever important analog output stage. Even among seperate dacs, the dac chip alone doesn't determine the final sound.

This. A lot of the digital stage features that were in the older top-end DACs are now frequently found in run-of-the-mill DAC chips, but a crappy analog stage, noisy power supply, etc, can ruin that. So you were both right in a sense.

falconcry72

sponger wrote: »

...Have DACs evolved so that an entry level DAC of today is comparable to the high-end DAC of yesterday?...

No way. External, stand-alone DACs will almost always trump a receiver's internal DAC's, and a great DAC from 20 years ago will beat a new entry-level DAC all day everyday and twice on Sunday. The analog stage is as critical to the final sound, if not MORE cristical, than the chip. Based on my comparisons, the analog stage is more important.

One of the best sounding DACs I've come across is a Parasound DAC that's 14 years old. Blew away the Benchmark DAC-1 and Musical Fidelity M-1 DAC, which are new, and neither is entry level.

The advantage to newer DACs is the increasing compatibility with hi-res formats, which the old Parasound can't do; however, I'll take a redbook 44.1 through that Parasound over a 24x192 through a new entry level DAC all day. It may not be as resolving, but the dynamics, weight, separation, and realness more than make up for it.

steveinaz

tonyb wrote: »

Dacs alone do not determine the final sound. Build quality, design, and the ever important analog output stage. Even among seperate dacs, the dac chip alone doesn't determine the final sound.

Exactly. Better DAC's have better analog output stages---and at the end of the day, the analog out rules.

DAC's are a "sum of the parts" deal. You can have the best DAC chips available--but if they're tied to a sub-par (inexpensive) analog output section, it's all for not. This is why I discourage the use of dime-a-dozen DAC's; if you're gonna go external DAC, do it right.