Improper ground affecting sda sweetspot and soundstage?

motorstereo

Here's a strange one. I picked up former member Hearing Impaired's 1.2tl's over the winter. Joe was a great help to me in getting them set up properly but still something was missing. My sweetspot was much smaller than he described and the soundstage really wasn't all that great either. I heard Lazarus's 1.2tl's set up so I knew what these guys were capable of.

Now I've had a ground loop hum that I've been chasing for a while. A power conditioner didn't help and the installation of another copper ground rod didn't either. The only way I could get rid of the hum was to use a cheater plug on the conditioner. Finally the hum got rather audible and I ran a line from the other side of my 220 line. Once I did this the hum dissapeared without the use of a cheater plug and the 1.2's really really came to life. For the first time I'm hearing the wide and deep soundstage that they throw and I can walk around a bit and still be in the sweetspot. Before if I tried that I'd lose that wide soundstage. To say that I'm amazed at the difference is an understatement. I've made several different mods over the years that haven't equaled the humless line.

Question is why would the use of a cheater plug have such a profound effect on the sda's signature sound?

drumminman

The only way I could get rid of the hum was to use a cheater plug on the conditioner. Finally the hum got rather audible and I ran a line from the other side of my 220 line. Once I did this the hum dissapeared without the use of a cheater plug and the 1.2's really really came to life. For the first time I'm hearing the wide and deep soundstage that they throw and I can walk around a bit and still be in the sweetspot. Before if I tried that I'd lose that wide soundstage. To say that I'm amazed at the difference is an understatement. I've made several different mods over the years that haven't equaled the humless line.

That's very interesting. I have lots of experience with tweaks that reduce grunge riding on the AC, so grounding issues could very well affect the imaging. The AI-1 has an effect on the path to ground though I don't have the knowledge to explain exactly what it does.

I know that when I installed my first A1 with my common ground amp, the improvement in soundstage and clarity, which I had not thought lacking, was easily noticeable.

Hopefully others - Darqueknight - will chime in.

motorstereo

Honestly at first I thought I was imagining the improved sound. But it's been a while now and I know there's a huge difference. The hum wasn't volume related and I could only hear it when I was close to the speakers and no music was playing. I knew it was there and even though it wasn't audible while the music was playing it still bugged me. I'm thinking the cheater plug on the power conditoner is what squashed the sound. I just can't understand why and especially to the degree that it did.

Schurkey

Put the cheater plug back on, see if the soundstage collapses.

I'm betting on faulty wiring from the original phase of your 220 wall box. The problem wasn't the cheater plug, it's the copper (or the connections) between the 220 input to your circuit breaker panel and the wall outlet you were plugged into. Probably the wiring from the circuit breaker to the wall outlet. Installing fresh wiring from the other phase of the 220 bypassed the wiring problem.

But I've been wrong before; and I'm not an electrician.

What happens when you plug one of those $7 wall-outlet fault finders into that outlet?

http://www.amazon.com/Gardner-Bender-GFI-3501-Outlet-Tester/dp/B00170KUPC/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1351104403&sr=8-4&keywords=Wall+outlet+fault

Truth is, I've always wondered if having some audio components connected to one phase, and the others connected to the opposite phase could cause problems. The opposite of that--having a bunch of power-hungry amps all plugged into the SAME phase could cause voltage droop when they're all asking for current at the same time. I ran six dedicated circuit breakers each connected to ~25--30 feet of 10-gauge wire into separate outlets to power my system, but I did set up the circuit breakers so some draw from one phase, and others draw from the other phase.

motorstereo

I'll give that a shot of using the cheater plug on the new line and see what happens then at least I'll know. That plug looks like a good addition to the tool box for pretty short money. Thanks for the link

motorstereo

Well my new outlet tester came in today and I tested the line that was giving me the hum problems. The tester shows that everything is wired correctly so I can cross that off the list. I haven't tried adding the cheater plug again but I'm betting now that this is the culprit since the line checks out. I'm thinking rather than play around with that cheater plug I'll just keep in mind to never use one again anywhere near those 1.2s. I'm still amazed at how much it changed the sound for the better and I'm kicking myself now for not trying a little harder years ago to get to the bottom of the problem rather than take the easy way out. Live and learn