Help! Did my power cable blow his tubes?

AudioTruth
AudioTruth Posts: 55
edited September 2012 in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
I sent my DIY power cable to someone, it has worked perfectly for months in my system. He plugged it into his tube amp and the aftermarket fuse blew in his $10,000 amp. He switched to his old power cable and his tubes blew, and another fuse. The fuses and tubes are worth $641, and he wants me to pay for them. Because he hasn't had any problems for 3 years, until switching the power cord to mine.

Is it possible that a power cable can do this?
Post edited by AudioTruth on
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  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    edited September 2012
    Nobody knows. Obviously that problem cannot be determined on a forum. On the other hand, it would seem possible a bad power cable could fry whatever it is plugged into, and a DIY cable is a strong contender to be defective, depending on the quality of its build.
    Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes

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    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
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  • dracoskeeper
    dracoskeeper Posts: 142
    edited September 2012
    IF!!!! I had an amp that cost ten G's I would not plug in a DIY cable without first verifying polarity... You should check for continuity between each leg (for shorts) and bend the IEC connector around while doing this. You don't say how the cable is made? How it works since you got it returned? If there was a short or reversed polarity this could cause the fuse to blow, but that is to protect his amp. I'm guessing, but I'd say a tube went and took out other components with it. Pictures would help, of both the cable and amp.
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited September 2012
    reversed polarity


    Funny sh$t! right there!
    Components could care less which is neutral and hot.
    Ever see a polarized aftermarket male plug?

    LOL!
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited September 2012
    Edit!:cheesygrin:
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,747
    edited September 2012
    I honestly do not see how the power cable would have blown the amplifier if he has used it all this time with no issues. The only thing I can think of is if the cable you made is not capable of supplying sufficient amerage that the tube amplifier needs.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited September 2012
    Either the story is BS (why would someone come here to make this their first post) or he dislodged something when he moved the amp to switch out the power cables.
    DKG999
    HT System: LSi9, LSiCx2, LSiFX, LSi7, SVS 20-39 PC+, B&K 507.s2 AVR, B&K Ref 125.2, Tripplite LCR-2400, Cambridge 650BD, Signal Cable PC/SC, BJC IC, Samsung 55" LED

    Music System: Magnepan 1.6QR, SVS SB12+, ARC pre, Parasound HCA1500 vertically bi-amped, Jolida CDP, Pro-Ject RM5.1SE TT, Pro-Ject TubeBox SE phono pre, SBT, PS Audio DLIII DAC
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    VR3 wrote: »
    I honestly do not see how the power cable would have blown the amplifier if he has used it all this time with no issues. The only thing I can think of is if the cable you made is not capable of supplying sufficient amerage that the tube amplifier needs.
    The wiring I use is CE certified and 15awg thick, it is enough to supply sufficient amperage. Standard cables are thinner than this.
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  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,447
    edited September 2012
    AudioTruth wrote: »
    The wiring I use is CE certified and 15awg thick, it is enough to supply sufficient amperage. Standard cables are thinner than this.

    Sounds great for a cheap CDP, but not for a tube amp...
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    nooshinjohn wrote: »
    Sounds great for a cheap CDP, but not for a tube amp...
    Do you mean that his tube amp blew because the cable was too thin? I have been using the cable for my gaming computer for many months without any problems. His tube amp is rated 2 x 100 watts?

    Here are the specs for his tube amp:
    Specifications





    Amplifier


    Ayon Triton III





    Class of Operation


    Triode* or Pentode mode, Class-A*




    Tube Complement


    8 x KT88




    Load Impedance


    4 & 8 Ohms




    Bandwidth


    8Hz-70kHz




    Output Power:Pentode mode KT88


    2 x 100 W




    Output Power:Triode mode KT88


    2 x 60 W




    Frequency Response


    10 Hz - 60 kHz




    Input Impedance at 1 kHz


    100 KΩ




    Input sensitivity (full power)


    1V




    NFB


    0dB




    Remote Control


    Yes




    Inputs


    3 x Line IN, 1 x XLR IN, 1 x Direct IN,




    Outputs


    1 x Pre Out




    Dimensions (WxDxH) cm


    51x42x25 cm




    Weight


    45 kg
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  • Outfitter03
    Outfitter03 Posts: 563
    edited September 2012
    AudioTruth wrote: »
    Do you mean that his tube amp blew because the cable was too thin? I have been using the cable for my gaming computer for many months without any problems. His tube amp is rated 2 x 100 watts?

    Here are the specs for his tube amp:

    A tube amp is a very different piece of equipment than a gaming computer. Does your gaming computer weigh 45 kg like the tube amp? The tube amp output power rating is very different than the input current required.
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    Outfitter03 wrote: »
    A tube amp is a very different piece of equipment than a gaming computer. Does your gaming computer weigh 45 kg like the tube amp? The tube amp output power rating is very different than the input current required.
    How much input current did the tube amp require?
    I live in Europe where AC cables can be thin because the power is drawn through both the live and neutral conductors. In USA where he lives, the power is drawn from only the live conductor.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,747
    edited September 2012
    12 awg minimum per conductor, IMO
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    VR3 wrote: »
    12 awg minimum per conductor, IMO
    When I bought a 500 watt power amp, it came with a 18 awg stock cable. What gauge size do tube amps come with?
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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited September 2012
    I could see a diy power cable wired wrong and cause an issue.

    Speakers
    Carver Amazing Fronts
    CS400i Center
    RT800i's Rears
    Sub Paradigm Servo 15

    Electronics
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 pre-amp
    Parasound Halo A23
    Pioneer 84TXSi AVR
    Pioneer 79Avi DVD
    Sony CX400 CD changer
    Panasonic 42-PX60U Plasma
    WMC Win7 32bit HD DVR


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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,653
    edited September 2012
    AudioTruth wrote: »
    I live in Europe where AC cables can be thin because the power is drawn through both the live and neutral conductors. In USA where he lives, the power is drawn from only the live conductor.

    A power cord with European terminations will not work in the USA unless the terminations are changed or adapters used, so who did what?
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • codyc1ark
    codyc1ark Posts: 2,532
    edited September 2012
    If your in Europe and he's stateside I see this as a non issue. Cut all ties and hide in the ghettos of Amsterdam, hookers, dogs and heroine will be your best friends. Good luck.
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  • sucks2beme
    sucks2beme Posts: 5,602
    edited September 2012
    pepster wrote: »
    Funny sh$t! right there!
    Components could care less which is neutral and hot.
    Ever see a polarized aftermarket male plug?

    LOL!

    Not if there are other problems inside the amp. Lets say there's a shiner on the white wire to ground.
    Under normal operation, still ok. But a reversal, things will get ugly with 110vac.
    But given the updates since the original post, something strange is afoot.
    "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    F1nut wrote: »
    A power cord with European terminations will not work in the USA unless the terminations are changed or adapters used, so who did what?
    I use US style plugs in my system with US power strip. I have been using US power cables since I started this hobby with balanced 3-phase power. So I'm able to use thinner conductors both because the voltage is twice as high and because of 3-phase power where the load is shared between the conductors.
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    I'm not certain about the balanced power anymore. I was told my audiophile AC regenerator makes balanced power. But from another site I found that balanced power uses 5 conductors, and it's only used for stoves and motors here in Sweden.
    My PS Audio P300 Power Plant has only the standard 3 pin IEC input and 3 conductor output, did they lie to me about it being balanced power?
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    VR3 wrote: »
    12 awg minimum per conductor, IMO
    I found something in wikipedia, it says that 14 awg can handle 20-25 amps of current. Doesn't this mean that the tube amp should have a 20 amp input instead of the standard 15 amp IEC?
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,780
    edited September 2012
    AudioTruth wrote: »
    I found something in wikipedia, it says that 14 awg can handle 20-25 amps of current. Doesn't this mean that the tube amp should have a 20 amp input instead of the standard 15 amp IEC?

    15 ga should easily be able to handle 14 - 15 amps, I doubt the tube amp draws more than that. Whatever the problem is, it's not the size of the wire. Fuses blow when too much current runs through them, not when there isn't enough.
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  • polkfarmboy
    polkfarmboy Posts: 5,703
    edited September 2012
    Tell the buyer of the cable that it is not your fault and be done with it
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    15 ga should easily be able to handle 14 - 15 amps, I doubt the tube amp draws more than that. Whatever the problem is, it's not the size of the wire. Fuses blow when too much current runs through them, not when there isn't enough.
    Ok good, I thought it was strange too that the fuse would blow when not getting enough power.
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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited September 2012
    Is this your first diy power cable you have ever done? It can be very important where the Hot / Neutral / Ground is placed to the equipment, if you know for sure this is the case and is correct having smaller or large gauge of wire isn't going to blow any fuse. IMHO

    Speakers
    Carver Amazing Fronts
    CS400i Center
    RT800i's Rears
    Sub Paradigm Servo 15

    Electronics
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 pre-amp
    Parasound Halo A23
    Pioneer 84TXSi AVR
    Pioneer 79Avi DVD
    Sony CX400 CD changer
    Panasonic 42-PX60U Plasma
    WMC Win7 32bit HD DVR


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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    disneyjoe7 wrote: »
    Is this your first diy power cable you have ever done? It can be very important where the Hot / Neutral / Ground is placed to the equipment, if you know for sure this is the case and is correct having smaller or large gauge of wire isn't going to blow any fuse. IMHO
    I have built DIY cables for a decade so I have lots of experience. I have known how to re-terminate the cable properly for a decade, I always triple check everything many times, and also in the end before finally closing the plug. I'm never sloppy with my job, I always take my time. I never had any problems until now when his fuse and tubes blew. I said it's not possible, but he keeps insisting it was my fault. Now I doubt myself.
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  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    edited September 2012
    The cable probably worked at first, but with all the shipping and bending it very easily could have ended up with some, or all, of the conductors shorted together. Who knows what the construction quality was like.
    Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
    Three 20 amp circuits.
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,780
    edited September 2012
    BlueFox wrote: »
    The cable probably worked at first, but with all the shipping and bending it very easily could have ended up with some, or all, of the conductors shorted together. Who knows what the construction quality was like.

    If the conductors were shorted together, it would have tripped a breaker instantly. The only way to tell for sure, is to get the cable back, and check it.
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  • AudioTruth
    AudioTruth Posts: 55
    edited September 2012
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    If the conductors were shorted together, it would have tripped a breaker instantly. The only way to tell for sure, is to get the cable back, and check it.
    I have asked the cable back, but no response yet.
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  • leroyjr1
    leroyjr1 Posts: 8,785
    edited September 2012
    got any pictures of your cables?

    thanks
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  • codyc1ark
    codyc1ark Posts: 2,532
    edited September 2012
    leroyjr1 wrote: »
    got any pictures of your cables?

    thanks

    Hm, I was going to ask that earlier.
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