HiFi shop listening today
hochpt21
Posts: 5,423
I was at my local HiFi shop getting a new cartridge today. Checked out some other gear while I was there. Please take my comments with a grain of salt as I am fairly new on my audio journey, but just thought I would post my thoughts. I was listening to moderately priced equipment, not the uber-high end stuff.
Speakers were B&W CM8's ($2,200/pr retail)
Electronics were NAD 326BEE integrated ($550 retail) and Rotel RA-1520 integrated ($999 retail)
I also brought in my HK 3490 for reference.
Music was Diana Krall and some African music track that the guy said was good for critical listening.
First, I was very impressed with the sound of the B&W's for the size. Only 38 inches tall, 11 inches deep and 6.5 inches wide. I had to double check that those were the speakers hooked up and not one of the bigger pairs near them. Not a large room 15x15x10, but they filled it with amazing sound. Neutral and/or natural is how I would describe them. Diana Krall's voice was very airy and real. The seemed to do everything very well. They really surprised me with the low end. Not super deep, but nice, tight bass. Mid's and highs very detailed and clean. The three electronics brought out these details somewhat differently, but overall, these were the characteristics I picked up.
My HK was up first. I know it is a good performer for it's price range, but boy I wouldn't be ashamed driving some fairly expensive speakers with it. It made the B&W's shine! It did sound a little muddled at times compared to the other units, but even the HiFi guy was impressed.
Next up was the Rotel, and to be honest, it beat the HK in some things, but not much. I wouldn't spend the extra money to upgrade. There was more detail, but the music didn't draw me in. Depth was probably the biggest thing lacking and it felt like the performance was up front. It did clean up and define the instruments better, especially during a short piano solo.
Last was the NAD. Within the first few seconds of listening, I knew I liked this unit. The soundstage depth was there, and I felt like I was right in the middle. Diana's voice felt stronger yet more airy. I could hear her short breaths in the intimate moments. Instruments were clearly defined, especially the cymballs and the egg shaker thingy. In the African track there is a primary female vocalist, and then a male vocalist who chimes in throughout the song. With the Rotel, you could hardly hear what he was singing and almost didn't seem like part of the song. With the NAD he was clear and meshed nicely with the primary vocalist.
Long story short the NAD was very impressive and made me start wondering if the 165BEE pre-amp would be a good upgrage when I move to a dedicated pre. It also reaffirmed my knowledge that my HK 3490 is a pretty good performer, and I can definitely live with it until I make that move.
Speakers were B&W CM8's ($2,200/pr retail)
Electronics were NAD 326BEE integrated ($550 retail) and Rotel RA-1520 integrated ($999 retail)
I also brought in my HK 3490 for reference.
Music was Diana Krall and some African music track that the guy said was good for critical listening.
First, I was very impressed with the sound of the B&W's for the size. Only 38 inches tall, 11 inches deep and 6.5 inches wide. I had to double check that those were the speakers hooked up and not one of the bigger pairs near them. Not a large room 15x15x10, but they filled it with amazing sound. Neutral and/or natural is how I would describe them. Diana Krall's voice was very airy and real. The seemed to do everything very well. They really surprised me with the low end. Not super deep, but nice, tight bass. Mid's and highs very detailed and clean. The three electronics brought out these details somewhat differently, but overall, these were the characteristics I picked up.
My HK was up first. I know it is a good performer for it's price range, but boy I wouldn't be ashamed driving some fairly expensive speakers with it. It made the B&W's shine! It did sound a little muddled at times compared to the other units, but even the HiFi guy was impressed.
Next up was the Rotel, and to be honest, it beat the HK in some things, but not much. I wouldn't spend the extra money to upgrade. There was more detail, but the music didn't draw me in. Depth was probably the biggest thing lacking and it felt like the performance was up front. It did clean up and define the instruments better, especially during a short piano solo.
Last was the NAD. Within the first few seconds of listening, I knew I liked this unit. The soundstage depth was there, and I felt like I was right in the middle. Diana's voice felt stronger yet more airy. I could hear her short breaths in the intimate moments. Instruments were clearly defined, especially the cymballs and the egg shaker thingy. In the African track there is a primary female vocalist, and then a male vocalist who chimes in throughout the song. With the Rotel, you could hardly hear what he was singing and almost didn't seem like part of the song. With the NAD he was clear and meshed nicely with the primary vocalist.
Long story short the NAD was very impressive and made me start wondering if the 165BEE pre-amp would be a good upgrage when I move to a dedicated pre. It also reaffirmed my knowledge that my HK 3490 is a pretty good performer, and I can definitely live with it until I make that move.
2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A
Post edited by hochpt21 on
Comments
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Thanks for sharing your story, sounds like an enjoyable experience! I like that you brought in your own amp/avr for comparison purposes, very smart.
I had a pretty good time when I went to my local shop and listened to some equipment. In general they were OK with me trying out whatever music, but I did get a few interesting comments, even though the stuff I brought in to listen to was totally tame compared to some of the music I usually listen to. (drum n bass for example). I believe one of the comments was a somewhat snarky/snide "oh, this is an interesting recording" said in response to pseudo dnb track I put on.
I had a similar experience to yours where I listened to a NAD C316BEE driving a pair of KEF R300s, even though the speakers are of very high quality, I could still hear what the NAD was doing to drive them and I liked it so much I had to take one home with me.
Nice that your HK holds it's own against some of the big names, nice piece of gear! -
I was a little disappointed they didn't have ANY dedicated pre's for me to listen to. It's an awesome shop and the owner is super hands-on, but they don't have a ton of stuff to check out. Mostly integrateds. Either way, I'm just trying to get my ears on as much gear as I can to learn more about this hobby.2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A
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It's always a good idea to get ears-on experience. I've been a part of this hobby for a long time, and I still get a thrill when I hear something really good.
I want to hear the NAD preamp also. -
I love B&W speakers
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I hate B&W speakersPolitical Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I hate B&W speakers
I know that, and I'm not saying that I do or don't like the brand. I was just impressed with what I heard. Keeping in mind that I havn't heard many mid/high end speakers at all.2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A -
I've got a friend with some very expensive B&W speakers. He spent a lot more than $2200. He likes my modded SDA's better than his B&W's.Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.
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I've got a friend with some very expensive B&W speakers. He spent a lot more than $2200. He likes my modded SDA's better than his B&W's.
Well get him on board! -
I've got a friend with some very expensive B&W speakers. He spent a lot more than $2200. He likes my modded SDA's better than his B&W's.
I have not yet heard the SDA's and that is something that I need to do!2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A -
It's an awesome shop and the owner is super hands-on, but they don't have a ton of stuff to check out.
Too bad they didn't have a wider assortment of equipment to peruse, but it sounds like the owner is a nice guy. At the place I went to, I actually watched the owner leave at one point and as he did, he glanced over to my friend and I as we were demoing the equipment and then smirked/rolled his eyes. Nice way to treat a potential customer, eh? I mean it's true I can't afford most of the stuff in the shop, but I did leave with a $400 NAD.
It's just unfortunate that these shops can be so judgmental of age/appearance and perceived income level. -
Short of selling your "first born" for some tubes. NAD is an excellent price to performance piece. You can spend a lot more and get a lot worse sound!
Enjoy!
B&W will sound "detailed" with almost "any" amp. They are generally "forward" and "bright" and "edgy"; you will hear a lot, maybe "more" than you, or rather "I" would want to hear as it never seems natural to me. So I would imagine that even an HK receiver would sound almost as good as most other things powering those. They have a very "consistent" sound. Don't seem to be affected as much by amplification as "other" speakers. IMO.
Like F1nut. I'm not a fan. But a lot of guys here like them. Especially our resident AV man!
cnhCurrently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!
Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
[sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash] -
Where abouts did you go?
The last time I heard B&W they were set up with a McIntosh setup at Suess Eletronics and just didn't have that "wow" experience. It was a pair of 802's. I've heard them before and it was the same thing for me. I didn't mind their bookshelfs but I'm not a bookshelf guy.
NAD is nice, I use one in the bedroom and love it. Drives everything easily and for 50 watts/channel can sure kick if I want it to. -
University Audio in Madison.
Keep in mind that I havn't heard a huge selection of mid/high level speakers. I think what impressed me most was the sound from that size speaker. They are a lot smaller than my 15's. I'm not backing off my initial reaction because I could have sat there all day...but I'm definitely not saying they are the best speakers of all time.2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A -
University Audio in Madison.
Keep in mind that I havn't heard a huge selection of mid/high level speakers. I think what impressed me most was the sound from that size speaker. They are a lot smaller than my 15's. I'm not backing off my initial reaction because I could have sat there all day...but I'm definitely not saying they are the best speakers of all time.
Really? I was planning on trying to stop by maybe Thursday or Friday this week as I'm in Madison all week long.
Do you know what else they had on demo? They used to have a nice two channel room with some Paradigm S8's wonder if they got anything new in since then. -
They do have a nice 2-channel room with some high end stuff.
Speakers are mostly B&W and Paradigm. They had a pair of 800 series diamonds that I heard last time I was there.
NAD, Rotel and Anthem stuff.
They had a lot of McIntosh stuff as well. I don't remember that last time. Looked pretty cool. Kind of a vintage style, but with bright blue modern meters.
I think they had a pair of used totems.
Hope you swing by. You probably know what to look for more than I would. Let me know if you do.2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A -
I heard a set of B&w's hooked up to a MAC 275 tube amp about 5 years ago.
Sounded very good. I also heard them on Classe'. Good, but the 275 added the magic."The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson -
I hate B&W speakers
I agree mostly to this statement. As I posted before I found the CM8's very detailed, however they also sounded thin with a narrow sound stage. I felt no warmth from them on t he lower registers. I know this will sound crazy but I would not trade my A7's for a pair even if it was straight across.
Now the PM-1's were a whole other storyLiving Room
Fronts: RTi A7's
Center: Csi A6 VR3 "Fortress Plus"
Front Heights: Rti A1
Surrounds: Rti A3
Sub: HSU VTF-2 MK4 Damn this is a good SUB
Pioneer Pioneer Elite: SC-35-> Emotiva XPA-3
TV: Lg LW6500 55" Passive 3D
Blu-Ray Panasonic BD 210
XboX 360 Slim/Kinect
Acoustimac red suede panels -
Short of selling your "first born" for some tubes. NAD is an excellent price to performance piece. You can spend a lot more and get a lot worse sound!
Enjoy!
B&W will sound "detailed" with almost "any" amp. They are generally "forward" and "bright" and "edgy"; you will hear a lot, maybe "more" than you, or rather "I" would want to hear as it never seems natural to me. So I would imagine that even an HK receiver would sound almost as good as most other things powering those. They have a very "consistent" sound. Don't seem to be affected as much by amplification as "other" speakers. IMO.
Like F1nut. I'm not a fan. But a lot of guys here like them. Especially our resident AV man!
cnh
I'm with these guys (FWIW) - the B&Ws are edgy to a fault relative to my ears and tastes.
I prefer sweet and smooth. -
The HK is a very nice reasonably priced receiver. I have the 3480 and feel it performs quite well
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Music was Diana Krall and some African music track that the guy said was good for critical listening.
Hello, hochpt21. With regards to the African track...Hugh Masekela's Stimila perhaps? [The coal train song]
Tom~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~ -
Nice to have HiFi Shops to stop in and listen to. There are none in Sioux Falls, SD. I enjoed the days when we had them. Now it is pawn shops and suring the net for me.
