FLAC files .. Where do you get them? .. Burn them to CD?

Turbo6TA

I am confused about FLAC files and how to use them.

I did a Google search and read about this file format. From what I read, it certainly has better audio quality than MP3, but just how do you download various songs in FLAC format so you play them on your home 2-channel audio system.

With MP3, I once could go to a website like Limewire (now shut down by the government), do a search for a particular song, and then download that song to my computer. Then just burn it to a CD disk and play it on my home 2-channel CD player or my car ... pretty easy!

Well, now this FLAC music file seems to be slowly replacing MP3 since the quality of the music is so much better ...

1. But, is there any free music sites like Limewire where you can find just about any FLAC formatted song ever recorded and just download it to your computer for later listening?

2. If not free downloads, how much do internet sites usually charge per song for FLAC music?

3. Once I have various FLAC songs on my hard drive, do I just burn them to a CD and hope my home 2-channel CD player will play them through my amp?

4. How many FLAC songs can you usually put on one standard CD?

5. Or would it be better to buy a Squeezebox and use it to play your FLAC music files you have stored on your computer through your 2-channel audio sysyem?

Again, I am reading as much as I can find on the internet about FLAC music files, but nothing I read seems to address the 5 questions I asked above.

This whole FLAC music is all new to me, as is Squeezebox ... I am clueless!

Bottom line .... Everyone tells me I can get better quality music by dumping MP3 and going with FLAC (except in my car ... I don't think my car's CD player will play FLAC music CDs)

Ron,

BlueFox

When I answered your post earlier I didn't know you were stealing music. Anyway, there are a few ways to get FLAC.

1. Buy the CD and copy the files to FLAC.
2. Go to sites and buy the FLAC files. For example, https://www.hdtracks.com/

There are other sites. Google will help.

Turbo6TA

BlueFox wrote: »

When I answered your post earlier I didn't know you were stealing music. Anyway, there are a few ways to get FLAC.

1. Buy the CD and copy the files to FLAC.
2. Go to sites and buy the FLAC files. For example, https://www.hdtracks.com/

There are other sites. Google will help.

I didn't think of it as stealing at the time, but I guess it was. Basically, Limewire was just a peer-to-peer file sharing program between individuals.

In my case, I lived in the Philippines, and Limewire was about the only way I could get the songs I liked ... certainly not in music stores on the local Filipino economy (most of them for sale where just Chinese made pirated CDs of poor quality anyway), so Limewire worked great for me being in a 3rd world country.

dragon1952

As stated about the only way is to rip CD's yourself or go to one of the hi-res sites. I don't think you're going to find anything for sale pre-converted unless it's hi-res and those run around $17.95 and up per album. As far as individual songs I believe that's all still just MP3. A media player is the best option for playback. BTW, if you burn FLAC to a CD it doesn't stay in FLAC format. I believe there's a conversion back to WAV (or whatever CD playback format you choose from your burning software)

Turbo6TA

BlueFox wrote: »

Anyway, there are a few ways to get FLAC.

1. Buy the CD and copy the files to FLAC.

If I go to the store and buy a regular music CD, is there a reason I would want to convert the music CD to a FLAC file in order to play it on my home music system?

I thought the sound quality of a music CD was much better than the same song in MP3 format. Will converting the music CD to FLAC improve the quality of the sound?

Thank's

dragon1952

FLAC is just a lossless compression. I think you are mis-understanding. It is theoretically equal to the source CD.

Turbo6TA

Ok dragon ... I am just a little confused on all this. Again, I have been in the Philippines for the last 5 years. Before I left, I had not even heard of FLAC or Squeezebox for that matter.

Now it seems like a waste of money to buy good stereo equipment if all your going to do is play ripped MP3 CDs on it ... so I am trying to learn about Squeezbox and FLAC and all these new things that obviously sound better that a CD player spinning MP3 disks playing through a 2-channel audio only system.

dragon1952

Well there are a lot of variables, but a Squeezebox type set-up connected to a really good outboard DAC can equal or surpass the quality of an even more expensive CD player as a source. Of course you need a decent PC and HD and a network (wired or wireless), but most people have that type of infrastructure already. So if you have everything in place but a quality source, the Squeezebox (or other media player) + DAC can be a less expensive alternative for the same or better quality, plus a more convenient option considering you can access your entire library with a single remote. Storing the files in FLAC vs WAV just saves some disc space without compromising sound quality. I thought I have read that FLAC is easier if you want to tag files or add album art, or whatever the terminology is. I'm not really into that aspect.

heiney9

WAV files can not at this time have ID3 information encoded in the metadata so the choice is FLAC.

Dragon, if aren't really into tagging how do you know what file you are listening to? How do search and choose a file? I think you are "into it" more than you think, even if it's by default of your ripping program. At some point you had to make those choices (settings) when ripping the FLAC file. Plus if you use any of the programs, have the cover art is a bonus, IMO.

H9

tonyb

Turbo6TA wrote: »

Ok dragon ... I am just a little confused on all this. Again, I have been in the Philippines for the last 5 years. Before I left, I had not even heard of FLAC or Squeezebox for that matter.

Now it seems like a waste of money to buy good stereo equipment if all your going to do is play ripped MP3 CDs on it ... so I am trying to learn about Squeezbox and FLAC and all these new things that obviously sound better that a CD player spinning MP3 disks playing through a 2-channel audio only system.

Turbo,
There are many formats you can use other than MP3. Most common are Flac, Wav, and Apple lossless. Apple's lossless, if you want to start out easy, is available on any Itunes preloaded on just about any computer these days. Before you download a cd on your computer, you open Itunes, go to the settings and pick apple lossless, turn on error correction and put a cd in the tray. You can also delete any songs from cd's you don't like and never listen to. Saves space that way too. Just a few clicks of a mouse can get you lossless files on your computer, it's that simple.

There are many ways of going about this, some better than others. Using ITUNES off the bat is the easiest way to get started for beginners and offers good sound quality to boot over MP3's. Downloading flac files onto a cd may work, may not. Some cdp's or bdp's are funky about it. Keep asking questions my friend, I know this can get diluted in your head with all the info being thrown at you. Take your time until you understand it all before deciding on your path.

maximillian

If you have an iPod and use iTunes you can also use Apple's lossless format: ALAC. You can rip a CD to ALAC with iTunes software. I think iTunes also sells ALAC files too, but they probably cost more than $1. This is why I think $1 mp3's are a rip-off. You can buy the CD that comes with a case, artwork, and physical media that has better sound than mp3's often for less money.

iPod's do not support FLAC by default. I believe the Squeezebox supports ALAC. Decide on the format based on how you are going to be playing the files.

tonyb

Plus once downloaded in apple lossless, you can click the mouse and convert back to mp3 for portable devices that won't support a lossless format. Everything becomes a mouse click away, instead of swapping outdated gear all the time.

If you have a laptop, you probably are using windows. You already have Itunes. Then just load a cd into the tray and try downloading a file in lossless from any cd you have. Make settings first before putting the cd into the tray. Once you do that and understand how it works, everything else is a piece of cake.

rooftop59

Sometimes you folks just don't read :razz:: I think the point here is that he CAN'T GET CDs in the Philippines (other than a very small selection or ripped pirated copies). My cousins are from the Philippines, and in a underdeveloped country such as this the only real viable option is downloading.

So unfortunately the answer is pretty simple: either import cds and rip them as advised above (probably very expensive), download from a site like hdtracks.com (also very expensive), or stick with mp3s for now.

The only other option I can think of is to send a friend or relative in the states money to buy cds and rip them for you, then upload them to a cloud server that you share. You could then download and rip them or stream them to something like a squeezebox.

Good luck!

steveinaz

Yep, www.hdtracks.com would be the way to go.

maximillian

Rooftop... In another thread he said he "returned to the US from the Philippines". Maybe he was referring to the distant past and now he's in the Philippines again? Either way, he has some connections to the US so he should be able to get CD's (his location is Philippines and Florida).

rooftop59

If that is the case that he is in the US, then this thread is pretty ludicrous (as are many here :cheesygrin:)

To the OP: if you are in the US, why aren't you just buying cds??? Amazon, ebay, secondspin, even the devil herself wally world sells em.

BlueFox

rooftop59 wrote: »

Sometimes you folks just don't read

I agree. :rolleyes:

sucks2beme

Or visiting garage sales. 25 cents to a $1 a piece, you can then load them up on your music system.
Hard to beat the price and you're legal to boot!

rooftop59

oh and of course goodwill. The pickins can be slim be if you are starting a collection you'll definitely find something that suits your taste.

dragon1952

heiney9 wrote: »

WAV files can not at this time have ID3 information encoded in the metadata so the choice is FLAC.

Dragon, if aren't really into tagging how do you know what file you are listening to? How do search and choose a file? I think you are "into it" more than you think, even if it's by default of your ripping program. At some point you had to make those choices (settings) when ripping the FLAC file. Plus if you use any of the programs, have the cover art is a bonus, IMO.

H9

I guess that's not what I meant then. I don't have all the terminology down :^ )

dragon1952

rooftop59 wrote: »

If that is the case that he is in the US, then this thread is pretty ludicrous (as are many here :cheesygrin:)

To the OP: if you are in the US, why aren't you just buying cds??? Amazon, ebay, secondspin, even the devil herself wally world sells em.

I think one of his issues is that he thought FLAC was some new format that was better than CD, so he was asking for clarification on that (read post #5). Also, some people just want individual songs, hence the reason mp3 downloads are so popular with the non-audiophile crowd. It was a very logical question to ask if they had a similar service that offered the songs in FLAC vs mp3. So far they've just offered this on the hi-res album downloads (as far as I know). And the attraction isn't because it's FLAC, it's because it is hi-res. FLAC is just used as the lossless compression to make the download smaller and without sacrificing quality (and that explanation is meant for the OP). I'm sure the reason FLAC isn't offered for the masses vs mp3 is that there is not enough demand for it. Most people that want to download music want small file sizes and something they can play on anything. FLAC is just used with the home audiophiles who want to rip music to a media server to save disk space without compromising quality (and also for what heiney mentioned in post #9).

Turbo6TA

dragon1952 wrote: »

I think one of his issues is that he thought FLAC was some new format that was better than CD, so he was asking for clarification on that (read post #5).

Also, some people just want individual songs, hence the reason mp3 downloads are so popular with the non-audiophile crowd. It was a very logical question to ask if they had a similar service that offered the songs in FLAC vs mp3. So far they've just offered this on the hi-res album downloads (as far as I know). And the attraction isn't because it's FLAC, it's because it is hi-res. FLAC is just used as the lossless compression to make the download smaller and without sacrificing quality (and that explanation is meant for the OP).

I'm sure the reason FLAC isn't offered for the masses vs mp3 is that there is not enough demand for it. Most people that want to download music want small file sizes and something they can play on anything. FLAC is just used with the home audiophiles who want to rip music to a media server to save disk space without compromising quality (and also for what heiney mentioned in post #9).

That's exactly what i am questioning ...

I used to live in the Philippines, so the only way I could get the songs I wanted was to download them on Limewire on MP3 format, and then burn them to CD to play on my 2-channel home audio system and also in my car's CD player.

But now, I am back living in the US (Florida), so I can get everything the rest of you folks can get. I just want to buy a new budget to mid-priced 2-channel audio system so I have music to listen to while I am sitting in my house. So, I just thought I would buy a CD player, an integrated amp and a set of front floor-standers and a set of rear bookshelf speakers to make up my modest 2-channel audio system. Again, this audio system has nothing to do with home theator or watching movies on the TV.

So, now I learn about things that we never had 6 years ago when I moved to the Philippines ... Stuff like FLAC music (which sounds better than MP3 songs) and some box called a "Squeezebox". I don't have a clue as to what any of it is ... but if any of it will make my 2-channel audio system sound better than a self-burned MP3 CD consisting of 1960s era rock & roll songs, I am wiling to learn what I need to buy in order to make the sound better.

That's about all I can say ...

txcoastal1

Ok You have a computer with downloaded music? Yes or no
If you do you can stream this music to your pre/AVR as a source (like a CD player with all your music in one location like Itunes/ or media library)
This streaming device like the "Squeezebox," "Sonos" etc....
or you can take your pc and add a DAC (Digital-to-analog converter) and source this to your pre/AVR

FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec) is a format of ripping CD's or a download format just like MP3 but in a lossless compression so you don't loose quality: other lossless formats include (apple lossless, WAV lossless etc)....don't try to convert MP3 to lossless 'cause the data has already been compressed and lost

This info is explained on wikipedia and other google sources

Hope this helps and can get you started

Turbo6TA

Yes, I have a laptop in my house connected to cable internet. The only music I have on my hard drive is MP3 oldies songs I have previously downloaded from limewire (before they were shut down).

I am willing to buy one of those Squeezebox units and a WiFi modem if that's what I need. I am also willing to subscribe to some kind of internet music service such as Pandora .. as long as it sounds better than the XM Radio I had many years ago.

The CD payer and the integrated amp that I am thinking of buying already has a built-in DAC, so I don't think I need to buy a separate DAC.

rooftop59

Ok well that sounds great but your best option is still used CDs through a decent cdp. Although a squeezebox can sound as good or better than a cdp, that's when coupled with a good dac. Find a good used marantz or denon DVD 2910 with a quality integrated like a used nad and some quality speakers and it good to go!

rooftop59

I listen to pandora thru my squeezebox sometimes and it's fun but not exactly high quality. Again, unless convenience is what ur after, CDs are the best option.

txcoastal1

Turbo6TA wrote: »

The CD payer and the integrated amp that I am thinking of buying already has a built-in DAC, so I don't think I need to buy a separate DAC.

No you don't

but let us know what CD player and integrated you are purchasing so if you have issues with integration we can help...FYI the squeeze box is a source that can plug into your integrated so you can stream your music from your PC to your integrated wirelessly through your network router...neat gadget

dragon1952

Turbo6TA wrote: »

Yes, I have a laptop in my house connected to cable internet. The only music I have on my hard drive is MP3 oldies songs I have previously downloaded from limewire (before they were shut down).

I am willing to buy one of those Squeezebox units and a WiFi modem if that's what I need. I am also willing to subscribe to some kind of internet music service such as Pandora .. as long as it sounds better than the XM Radio I had many years ago.

The CD payer and the integrated amp that I am thinking of buying already has a built-in DAC, so I don't think I need to buy a separate DAC.

If you go the Squeezebox route you could use it's own internal DAC and just connect it to your integrated using the analog inputs and you wouldn't even need a CD player unless , for some reason, you wanted to play the physical CD. The Squeezebox to a better quality external standalone DAC is the preferred audiophile route. Squeezebox connected to DAC via digital cable and then DAC out to integrated using analog. The DAC built in to a CD player isn't going to do you much good for a Squeezebox unless the CDP has a 'digital input' (which most don't). If you want to go network connected Squeezebox I would just try it first using it's own built-in DAC and see if that sounds satisfactory (which to many it does). If not then you can think about upgrading to a better DAC, which would then depend on the quality of the rest of the system as to whether or not the difference would be worth the cost. Either way, you don't need a CD player to enjoy CD quality music.

Turbo6TA

As far as the equipment I wanted to buy ... I initially was going to purchase an Onkyo A-9070 integrated amp as soon as it is available for sale in the US. Now I find out from Onkyo that this amp will only be available for sale in Europe, so I now am thinking of a different approach:


Onkyo TX-8050 Network Stereo Reciever

Internet Radio and Music Streaming Service Connectivity (vTuner, Last.fm, SIRIUS XM Internet Radio, Mediafly, Pandora, Slacker, Napster, Rhapsody)

2 x 80 w/ch @ 8 ohm (20Hz-20kHz, 0.08% THD, FTC)

THD
0.08 % (20hz-20kHz, Half power)

Frequency Response
5 Hz-100 kHz (+ 1 dB, -3 dB)

Wide Range Amplifier Technology (WRAT)

Discrete Amplifier Design w/ Massive EI Transformer

Direct Digital (USB) connection of iPod / iPhone

Compatible with UWF-1 Wireless LAN Adapter (via USB)

Pre-out (For connecting to a power amplifier)

Zone2 pre-out

Subwoofer pre-out

Universal Port for Onkyo Peripheral Devices

Phono and CDP Input


Since this reciever has only 80 w/channel @ 8 ohms, I am thinking of buying a separate Onkyo power amp and connecting it to this reciever.

I may be wrong, but I think that if I bought this reciever, it would basically do the same thing as the Squeezebox, so I would not have to additionally buy the Squeezebox too ? ?

LINK: http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-8050&class=Receiver&p=i





____________________________________________________


Onkyo M-282 Power Amplifier

Here is the power amp I was thinking about using:


Power Output
2 x 100 w/ch @ 8 ohm

THD
0.08 % at rated power

IM Distortion Rated Power
0.08 % at rated power

Damping Factor
100 at 8 ohms

Frequency Response
10 Hz to 100 kHz: ?1 dB

Signal-to-Noise Ratio
110 dB (IHF A, 0.5 V input)

LINK: http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=M-282&class=Amplifier&p=i

txcoastal1

You could use the DLNA network for your PC music

Just curious what speakers are you trying to run....just trying to figure out why the amp? You already have 80watts in the receiver, the additional 20 amps from the 282 is not much gain

Turbo6TA

txcoastal .... I have been thinking, and your right .. The additional 20 amps is not much of a gain.

Additionally, I am posting a photo of the rear of the M-282 power amp. You will notice that this 100 w/ch amp only has speaker wire posts for 2 speakers. So, since I want to use both front floorstanders and rear bookshelf speakers, I am thinking about buying 2 of these power amps (1 amp powering the fronts, and 1 amp powering the rear speakers).

That would double the power (100 w/ch @ 8 ohms into the fronts, and another 100 w/ch @ 8 ohms into the rears) ..... Good idea?

Here is the back panel of the Onkyo M-282 power amp:



___________________________________________

I was planning on using a pair of Polk RTi A7 floorstanders for the fronts and a pair of Polk RTi A3 for the rears (mounted on 30" stands).