Dual Epik Empire vs Dual Hsu VTF-3 MK4

Phasewolf

My room that I use for Movies is 11x19 but is completely open to the kitchen which is also 11x19 too make things worse the kitchen is open too the rest of the house so too say that the bass sucks is being too kind. I want too fix this and the wife has said go for it. Between the 2 sets of subs I have listed both around the same price as this is about as much as I would like too spend which would work better for 75% movies and 25% music.

Also The Empire's are kind of a oddball too me can I just toss them into a corner or would that not work because of the twin drivers? I want too place them in the back of the room but I don't want phase issues so how do you set them up correct if I were too go this route.

Geoff4rfc

Having no experience with the HSU's, all I can tell you about is the Empire. I have a single. It more than fills my room which is dedicated and is 15.5 x 26. I've had it each corner, inbetween each front speaker and the center, off to the side and a few feet in front of the mains and now I have it right next to my gear almost center and so far, I really like this set up.

The main volume on the sub is set at 1/3 and EQ'd at +5, though while the family's home, I back it down to +3 or -3 depending on the movie. I have no bass trapps set up and the sub can be felt all over our 2900sq ft home from our finished basement.

MADGSF

I have never heard either but would recommend factoring in a Velodyne SMS-1. My house is similar to yours and I have no problem pressurizing it with my first gen PC Ultra. I run my front speakers full range, the sub in 20Hz mode and send the low frequencies to both the sub and fronts. FWIW If I had to replace my SVS I would probably get a new tube PC-13 Ultra.

I know adding the SMS-1 will put you over budget but for me it has taken my sub to the next level. The volume control and different curves alone are worth the price to me as it allows me to set it for music or movies all from my remote. You can also mute it for music if desired.

As far as setting them up the best advice I can give is to try them in different positions and see if you like how it sounds. I cannot put my sub in the corner as the other corner cancels it out and it sounds weak. If you have a long enough cable one method is to put the sub where you sit then crawl around the floor until you find where the bass is strongest. That is the spot to put your sub. In my case I just moved along the front wall until I found a spot where it sounded best. Whatever you decide be sure to let us know.

Phasewolf

Sweet that sounds like a lot of fun. I currently have a older velodyne f 1500 and well it just does not cut it too well. I thought that by having 2 subs I can place them in a way that makes the most of my setup and it would sound better then one sub trying too work the room by it's self.

Geoff4rfc

Even though I have p l e n t y of power with one empire, I am considering a second to place them by each of the mains. One great thing about the Epik, is that it's a sealed sub. The add says the counterbalancing cancels out vibration, but I've had my sub vibrating a "little". Placed a glass of water on top of it and played Tron Legacy with the sub at +5 and the volume at -18, that had my bar at the back of the room shaking. My sub is in my TV cabinet, no vibration transferred to the cabinet to disturb the water sitting on top of the uppshelf above the sub. This thing is impressive.

Phasewolf

Well I am going too wait for a few more posts on this before I hit the buy key but this is sounding really good and my mouth is watering now. I so want a few nice subs but I just don't want too jump the gun as this is a lot of money so taking my time is best. Keep the info flowing I am loving it and thanks for the help.

Geoff4rfc

Hey, your welcome! Taking your time is key to getting what you want right the first time. I do all kinds of research as I'm sure it seems that you do as well.

Chad from Epik is really cool with customer service. My sub had a problem go wrong with the amp a couple of months after I had it up and running, you could hear some kind of crackling noise coming from the amp. I emailed Epik, they sent out a new amp and a crimper tool with prepaid postage for return amp. Six screws on the back, two wires, snip this, crimp that, six screws back in and presto. It was an easy 5min job to swap out the amp.

I had my new amp in less than a week from the time I first emailed them. Haven't had any problems since and I've owned my empire for over a year now.

This is a big purchase, glad to see you taking your time be sure to drop a line and tell what you've decided.

Phasewolf

How about this combo. CraigSUB SS-18.1 Passive Subwoofer I can get a pair of them for $1045 and a and spend $400 for a Behringer EUROPOWER EPX4000 which will put out up to 530W Rms per channel. With shipping it will be the same price and I will have a pair of sealed 18" subs that will make my wife regret ever say the words get what ever you want..................

What do you think of that idea and issues with it?

Geoff4rfc

That sounds like one heck of an idea. You'll pi** your wife off in no time at all.

Phasewolf

Yes it may make her mad I don't know. Well have too see. One of the issues I see with using that amp is no phase control but on my avr I can flip the sub 180 but not like 90 if it was needed so I have too think about this for a wile. Anyone else want too chime in?

tommyt21

This is my dream sub it should be more than enough.
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article/test-report-hsu-research-vtf-15h-subwoofer

EndersShadow

Phasewolf wrote: »

How about this combo. CraigSUB SS-18.1 Passive Subwoofer I can get a pair of them for $1045 and a and spend $400 for a Behringer EUROPOWER EPX4000 which will put out up to 530W Rms per channel. With shipping it will be the same price and I will have a pair of sealed 18" subs that will make my wife regret ever say the words get what ever you want..................

What do you think of that idea and issues with it?

This is what I was planning on going with except I was going to go with the QSC GX5 amplifier. Craig from Craigsub said it would work well with his subs as well.

Phasewolf

That sounds like a great idea for sure. I read up on that amp and it looks nice and I can get it locally which is a plus. Do you think 500 watts per channel is what you would need or for a little more coin you can get the gx7

EndersShadow

Phasewolf wrote: »

That sounds like a great idea for sure. I read up on that amp and it looks nice and I can get it locally which is a plus. Do you think 500 watts per channel is what you would need or for a little more coin you can get the gx7

According to Craig (the owner of Chase Home Theater) he recommends 500 wpc, so the GX5 fits the bill perfect. The parts express guys like it better than the Dayton they sell.

I figure if the owner recommends this amp (and there are some guys on the Chase Home Theater forum running it) I would go with it myself.

ONLY thing the Behringer's have are teh built in EQ, but personally I would want an receiver with Audyseey XT or XT32 which would make that not needed.

Here is a direct quote from Craig I got via PM on AVSFORUM

You really want something that does 1000 watts RMS and 2000 on short term peaks for the pair, or 500 watts RMS and 1000 per driver. The Behringer is a solid unit for this, and the fan swap out takes care of the noise issue.

You might also look into Marathon amps, too. Another option that the guys at Parts Express like is the QSC GX-5.

Phasewolf

Well I am going too pickup a Behringe iNuke NU6000DSP sure it is overkill but I want a lot of overhead and it will drive a pair of subs really nice. I doubt its common ground otherwise I would hook it up too the sda are 2.3's and see bow it sounds sense they make a 4 channel one too.

Phasewolf

Well I went crazy and ordered 2 of the CraigSUB SS-18.1 which is a sealed and the Behringe iNuke NU6000DSP Too power them and I am sure in my app it will do really nicely. The amp will provide 1500 watts peak tho I do not trust that rating at all. I would bet it would do 800 watts Rms all day long and I don't plan on pushing them quite that hard.

I also like being able too use the dsp too tune the subs too work best for my room and wile I will dont plan on bumping anything up I will be knocking down the peaks so I can have a flatter response with in + or - 3db

I hope they will be here with in the week and when I get them setup correctly I will post a new Thread with pics and a review but not before I get some time too break them in....... :evil:

EndersShadow

Phasewolf wrote: »

Well I went crazy and ordered 2 of the CraigSUB SS-18.1 which is a sealed and the Behringe iNuke NU6000DSP Too power them and I am sure in my app it will do really nicely. The amp will provide 1500 watts peak tho I do not trust that rating at all. I would bet it would do 800 watts Rms all day long and I don't plan on pushing them quite that hard.

I also like being able too use the dsp too tune the subs too work best for my room and wile I will dont plan on bumping anything up I will be knocking down the peaks so I can have a flatter response with in + or - 3db

I hope they will be here with in the week and when I get them setup correctly I will post a new Thread with pics and a review but not before I get some time too break them in....... :evil:

Cool. Looking forward to it. Craig is a great guy and was very nice when corresponding with me even though I didnt purchase anything from him. You should have a great experience with them I hope!

Geoff4rfc

Phasewolf wrote: »

Well I went crazy and ordered 2 of the CraigSUB SS-18.1 which is a sealed and the Behringe iNuke NU6000DSP Too power them and I am sure in my app it will do really nicely.

You live in an apartment? Well, I guess at first you'll get plenty looks from your neighbors. Then the door knocks will come, then the "Excuse me sir, we are responding to a call by several of your neighbors, you're coming with us".

Phasewolf

No I have a house. I would blow the walls out of a apartment and I hate noise that I am not the cause.

I can't wait too hear how they will sound and how well I can get them setup up.

Geoff4rfc

Phasewolf wrote: »

I am sure in my app it will do really nicely.

Ahhh, you must have been referring to "app"lication.

Phasewolf

Well the amp got too my house today and the subs should are going too ship today so I hope too be able too play with them by next week.

Phasewolf

Well the subs have been setup for sometime now and they do sound great. Nice tight bass good punch during movies. I am still working on breaking them in and sense it will take around 200 hours it will be a wile for sure.

I am waiting until I get them broken in completely until I do final location or setup the dsp. I am going to build room treatments first before I look for the best place. With my room gain I get fairly flat output from 14hz to at least 80hz tho I have a good 10db dip from 42 to 51 Hz That I hope bass traps will help.

mole'

Geoff4rfc wrote: »

Even though I have p l e n t y of power with one empire, I am considering a second to place them by each of the mains. One great thing about the Epik, is that it's a sealed sub. The add says the counterbalancing cancels out vibration, but I've had my sub vibrating a "little". Placed a glass of water on top of it and played Tron Legacy with the sub at +5 and the volume at -18, that had my bar at the back of the room shaking. My sub is in my TV cabinet, no vibration transferred to the cabinet to disturb the water sitting on top of the uppshelf above the sub. This thing is impressive.

good to know