MIT Shotgun S3.3 Cable Demo/Review Round 4

Jhayman

http://web.archive.org/web/20041204021632/http://cable.tcnerd.com/whymit.asp

Transparent Audio used to make the cables for MIT.
Apparently they TA and MIT were together and Bruce Brisson went his own way..
According to Audiogon

EndersShadow

Jhayman wrote: »

so I joined only a month ago..Does that make it any less relevent?

Well given that if you read the thread you know each person has the cables for 2 weeks and your suggestiong 9 months later that I use something else for the demo, I would say it does, since I havent had these cables in my system for over 8 1/2 months

Jhayman wrote: »

So i'm guessing you spent the $3000 on cables to hear the ring jostle around..

No but I did purchase some used Kimber Kable Hero interconnects and Kimber Kable 8VS speaker wires for very good prices and am more than happy with the results.


BTW I find your post below quite ironic since this is ya know a demo thread where you can try out these cables for a low cost. You just have to put up the shipping/insurance costs and write a review.

Jhayman wrote: »

I also would like to try out some very expensive cables but sadly I'm sure that will never happen..

Jhayman

Do you really think F1nut would allow me to demo the cables..
I'm not very well liked here by some for having a I guess overzealous opinion..
BUT i would be more than Happy to demo those cables and give an HONEST review and I would apologize eat crow if needed..

Erik Tracy

Jhayman wrote: »

Do you really think F1nut would allow me to demo the cables..
I'm not very well liked here by some for having a I guess overzealous opinion..
BUT i would be more than Happy to demo those cables and give an HONEST review and I would apologize eat crow if needed..

So, the capitalized comment is meant to imply that all previous reviews have been dis-honest or mis-leading?

Jhayman

Nope just letting others know that I will not lie..Because I AM A NAYSAYER..
Sorry for the Capitals..

SDA1C

It sucks

























Having to give them back that is

Honestly. They will convert you.

ZLTFUL

I really wish he would demo them. Then we can put this whole "cables don't matter" bollocks to rest.

Jhayman

sign me up..
For the record never said speakers cables don't make a difference only PC's..
But prove me wrong and I will Bow Down Gracefully..
I'm afraid even if you agreed to let me demo them the crossborder shipping would be cost prohibitive because of taxes and duties here, I would have to pay the T's and D's on there retail cost..
Unless there is a way I don't know about..
Like you don't have to pay because it's going to be returned in two weeks, lol

treitz3

Unfortunately, the demo is only for the continental US.

Tom

EndersShadow

Jhayman wrote: »

sign me up..
For the record never said speakers cables don't make a difference only PC's..
But prove me wrong and I will Bow Down Gracefully..
I'm afraid even if you agreed to let me demo them the crossborder shipping would be cost prohibitive because of taxes and duties here, I would have to pay the T's and D's on there retail cost..
Unless there is a way I don't know about..
Like you don't have to pay because it's going to be returned in two weeks, lol

treitz3 wrote: »

Unfortunately, the demo is only for the continental US.

Tom

Yeah, I didnt realize you were in Canada. :sad:.

F1nut

Allow me to address some of the comments posted today.

Jhayman wrote:

I also would like to try out some very expensive cables but sadly I'm sure that will never happen.

MIT has a lending program, details are available on their site. They also are running a give away right now, you might want to give that a try.

Jhayman wrote:

I have to ask something what does the Network box do exactly to the cable?

You can find that info by visiting MIT's site, www.mitcables.com

Jhayman wrote:

I've seen pics on the net of them ripping one open on a $9800 cable and half the box was empty and the other half had a resistor in it, a High quality one, but one resistor, and that is changing the dynamics of the cable, kind of like adding a DSP flavor of sorts..
Oh and I read eveything so as long as it makes sense and not Hog Wash..

Jhayman wrote:

http://web.archive.org/web/200412040...com/whymit.asp

Transparent Audio used to make the cables for MIT.
Apparently they TA and MIT were together and Bruce Brisson went his own way..
According to Audiogon

The link you provided shows a Transparent cable, the one you refer to. Had you read down further you would see the MIT cable network box and the obvious differences. Let me add that the network boxes are not the only thing that makes MIT cables what they are. MIT uses very unique wiring configurations and a host of other advanced technologies.

Here's the actual history of MIT Cables, http://www.mitcables.com/history-of-mit-cables.html

Since you like to read everything and obviously haven't read this yet, http://www.mitcables.com/reference-library/articles.html

Jhayman wrote:

Do you really think F1nut would allow me to demo the cables..
I'm not very well liked here by some for having a I guess overzealous opinion..
BUT i would be more than Happy to demo those cables and give an HONEST review and I would apologize eat crow if needed..

I take it you did not read the requirements posted on the first page. Had you done so you would have seen that due to shipping issues across our borders this demo program is not available in Canada. It has nothing to do with whether I like someone or not. However, I do think you should apologize for purposely mucking up this thread.

Jhayman wrote:

sign me up..
For the record never said speakers cables don't make a difference only PC's..
But prove me wrong and I will Bow Down Gracefully..
I'm afraid even if you agreed to let me demo them the crossborder shipping would be cost prohibitive because of taxes and duties here, I would have to pay the T's and D's on there retail cost..
Unless there is a way I don't know about..
Like you don't have to pay because it's going to be returned in two weeks, lol

Please see my first and previous response.

EndersShadow

F1nut wrote: »

They also are running a give away right now, you might want to give that a try.

Link? Looked on their main page and didnt see anything...

F1nut

There is no direct link, but it is on the home page. Look for "Positive Feedback Online Giveaway"

EndersShadow

F1nut wrote: »

There is no direct link, but it is on the home page. Look for "Positive Feedback Online Giveaway"

Think its over:

Enter Positive Feedback's "I Love PFO!" contest with the chance to win
CONGRATULATIONS to Warren Kice!
1 pair of the Matrix 18 Speaker Interfaces and 2 pairs of the Matrix 6i Interconnects from MIT™ for a total of $1597!
We will cover the shipping via either UPS, FedEx, or US Postal Service (at our discretion).
MIT™ Matrix Series - Affordable technology for every audiophile

Jhayman

I apologize to eveyone in this thread..

F1nut

WTF, Photobucket has done it again. I did not move or delete the list. Since it came back on its own before, maybe it will so again.

The cables will be leaving Clipdat and going to Dabutcher in a day or so.

Amherst has not posted his review despite repeated requests from me and repeated promises to do so from him. He did mention having some health issues, so I'm cutting him some slack for now.

Clipdat

Cables have been shipped to Dabutcher! Prepare for imminent bladder release!

Clipdat

First, I'd like to thank Jesse/F1nut and Polk for the opportunity to demo these products. What a great opportunity to evaluate some high end cables in order to hear their synergy in your personal system with your favorite music!

I was commenting earlier in this thread that this might be the most modest equipment these cables would be hooked up to, and that I wasn't sure if it was worth it given the bargain basement price of my Polk TSi100 speakers (about $200/pair). That being said, I actually quite like these speakers for two channel listening, and they seem to work well in my smaller listening room. I think they're a great value, with some slight cons being stereo imaging could be better, and that they may benefit from upgraded crossovers. My Marantz CDP now has enough hours on it (about 75) that I feel it's past it's initial break-in period. I like how detailed yet neutral it is, and it seems well suited to many genres. A con might be that it doesn't sound as lively or natural as some other players with tube output stages. As a side note, I am using all stock power cables with my gear, as I haven't been able to convince myself to give upgraded power cords a try yet. (Possibly an MIT power cable demo in the future?!)

During my two weeks with the cables, I managed to log 13 hours on them with a variety of different music. One of the very first things I noticed is the bigger more three dimensional stereo image. The "sweet spot" seemed to expand and widen, so that I didn't have to be in such an exact spot to get a full well rounded sound. The second thing I noticed was the increased realism to the sound. Everything sounded cohesive and natural, especially well recorded vocals. The increase in discernible texture to strings, voices, and percussion were very evident.

Going back to the overall stereo image for a moment, I noticed more separation of instruments and improved perception of instrument placement. Everything seemed to "fall into place", for lack of a better description. Even my wife who normally rolls her eyes when I gush about high end cables or speakers got in on the fun with a few of her favorite Steely Dan tracks. I think the single most impressive comment was that it sounded like she was "hearing the song for the first time". This is huge praise coming from her considering she is all about the music and generally isn't too concerned if it's coming from an iPod dock or a car stereo.

Toward the end of my time with the cables, I quickly realized that they were becoming transparent. I had forgotten they were in my system because they were simply doing exactly what they should - nothing more and nothing less. Obviously these would be a great choice when planning out a listening room, albeit with a somewhat high initial investment. However, an investment that is definitely worth it in my opinion. Of course it just depends on how much relaxation and joy you achieve from unadulterated musical enjoyment.

I have some other observations and questions I will touch on now in regards to the cables and their performance. I noticed they have less bass than my Audioquest cables. Why is this? Are the Audioquest cables adding bass or are the MITs taking bass away? I should note at this time that I always utilize the "tone defeat" button on my NAD which makes the signal completely bypass the front panel bass and treble knobs.

The MIT cables seemed to perform better at higher volumes. I generally listen to things at what I'm sure some would consider a bit on the quiet side (anywhere from 65-75db), but I noticed that as I turned the volume up the MITs really shined. Is there a technical reason for why they would sound better with more current passing through them?

I noticed some harshness on cymbals in certain recordings. Is this because the cables are more revealing and showing the limitations of the Redbook format? Lastly, I found the high end to be very non-fatiguing, so I feel they would be well suited for speakers that are a bit "bright".

Which brings me back to what I first said regarding synergy with other equipment in your setup. This demo program is essential to see if these will work well with your particular taste in equipment. Thanks again for this opportunity and I encourage anyone who is on the fence about whether or not cables make a difference to sign up for this demo!

engtaz

Very nice review.
Thanks

Drenis

Did you adjust the impedance switch on the cables?

Clipdat

I had them set at Low (5-50) to match the input impedance rating of my NAD.

Mike Reeter

Hey Drew, Good review. The S3.3's can be a game changer, thanks for your input!

Clipdat

Thanks Mike! :cheesygrin:

F1nut

Since the list hasn't come back in the first post......

brgman

So how many on the list above invested in the MIT cables after they had a test run?

agfrost

I have not. Would like to someday!

Needing 12 or 15 foot speaker cables isn't helpful to the financial pinch so I'll probably focus on my mortgage and 2 boys' college funds for the next several years. It's doubtful I'll have too much time for critical listening until I get those rascals off to school anyway!

brgman

agfrost wrote: »

I have not. Would like to someday!

Needing 12 or 15 foot speaker cables isn't helpful to the financial pinch so I'll probably focus on my mortgage and 2 boys' college funds for the next several years. It's doubtful I'll have too much time for critical listening until I get those rascals off to school anyway!

I feel your pain.We are in the college picking mode right now ourselves.shocking what it costs.I think we should put him down as an American Indian since he's got a shred in him,lol.Hell it worked for that DB in Massachusetts.
Luckily i got my cables before this all started.

Lost240

Great write up. Thanks!

blueboxer wrote: »

First, let me apologize for using a fairly modest system to test out these cables, which may be disproportionately expensive for the system I am currently running. I tried to get a Wyred4Sound DAC and STI1000 in time for the review, but that did not work out. However, I think the DAC, preamp, and speakers involved are sufficient to be able to hear a difference if one is indeed present when switching cables. Secondly, I will admit to leaning slightly to the naysayers of speaker cable philosophy in the sense that thru the assorted cables I have used historically, I don’t recall ever having a watershed moment or miraculous breakthrough in performance. However, an opportunity to try some very highly regarded and fairly expensive cables via this demo could not and should not be passed. Thus, here we go…

Equipment:
iNova integrated (Sabre DAC, ipod dock, tube preamp, and stereo amp)
Pioneer Elite SC-35 (used with Wadia dock as well as ipod directly connected)
Polk LSi15
Def Tech Mythos ST
Wadia i170 transport (used with Pioneer Elite SC-35 only)

Listening Room:
20x20 room
Speakers were approximately 8 ft apart, 3 ft from wall
Listening position was approximately 6 ft. from speakers

Speaker Cables Used in Demo:
Monster XP cable with monster nanners.
MIT EXP1 cables with MIT nanners.
MIT Shotgun S3.3 with MIT nanners.

Again, not the most impressive system, but I really am looking for a simplified system after dealing with components in the past and all the various interconnects that go along with it. It was a battle of finding the perfect combinations and resisting the urge to try another one of the myriad combinations of cables and components. I have thoroughly enjoyed the lack of a need to store and fumble with CD’s and everything else and after the Wyred4Sound upgrade I will probably call it fin. Apologize for that tangent.

My listening material was a playlist of some of my favorite songs as well as those that I always enjoy listening for that extra detail, decay, or emotion that another piece of the puzzle may add. The list is as follows:

John Mayer- Gravity
Anouk- Lost
Aaron Robinson- The Elephant
Warren Zevon- Keep Me in Your Heart
Adele- Don’t You Remember

And then a few hours of mixes of Jack Johnson, B.O.B., Morgan Paige, etc… for non-critical listening.

Methodology:
I spent the first week of casual listening to help burn in the relatively new cables. Never really looking or taking notes. After the first week I would spend about 45 min. listening to each of the above referenced cables and then switching to another cable. At this point I was listening for subtle differences and preferences, which there definitely were. I took turns listening to the cables via the iNova and also the wadia and SC-35. On the last weekend I set aside time with the better half to really just sit down and listen to only the playlist as it ran thru one set of speaker cables at a time, and then did so again and again to really ensure that there was consistency in my thoughts and preferences. This process was completed for both sets of speakers listed above, but in the end I elected to spend all this listening time on the iNova.

Results:
In order of performance and preference:

1. S3.3
2. EXP
3. Monster

S3.3 Pros-
Build quality is substantial
Nanners and all connections yield solid hookups
Sound is very detailed, with great separation of vocals and instruments
Bass is solid and there was a reduction in the boominess (especially with the LSi15’s)
The sound was neutral to me, which is a good thing IMO

S3.3 Negatives-
Cost for some
The cables are substantial so tight fits and angles could be an issue for some
They will make you doubt your current cables

Conclusion:
The Shotgun S3.3 were consistently my favorite cable, by a great difference in reference to the monster cables and less so with the other MIT cables. Returning to the monster cables always seemed to produce a veiled or muffled sound, however a couple friends who were present during the time actually preferred this sound and thought the bass seemed louder (to me it was boomier). Going to the MIT cables always seemed to produce more separation and detail with the S3.3 adding that extra level of rightness. Interestingly, the improvements seemed to be more marked and obvious with the Polks than with the Def Techs. I was actually hoping the S3.3 would add a touch of warmth to the Mythos, but I didn’t detect any.

However, the MIT’s definitely improved the overall presentation of all of the music and songs. Was the improvement proportional to the cost difference? No, but there is always the law of diminishing return, and it definitely plays a part in this example as well. Would I recommend spending the difference? Absolutely, so long as your finances permit it, I would purchase a pair or at least a used pair. Could you live with a lower line of MIT’s such as the EXP lineup or perhaps an equal Audioquest, Cardas, etc. offering? Again, my answer would be absolutely, but we could also all live with driving a Honda Civic as well.

I know that this doesn’t necessarily offer any clear conclusion, but most things in life aren’t. I will say that I am no longer a naysayer of cables, but still conscious of the law of diminishing return that would have to be associated with them. That rate of diminishment would also probably defer and not be as steep with a system that was more proportional to these cables. Personally, I will be looking on for a pair of these cables to keep as my own. Could I live without them? Yes, but why should anyone live without something that they enjoy and find worthwhile.

Dabutcher

Review of MIT speaker cables and interconnects: First I would like to start off by saying thank you to Jesse. It was very nice of him to set this up for me. after hooking everything up and learning all about locking interconnects on the fly I sat down for some listening. To me ,my system sounds great as is. With Monster cable speaker wires and Signal cable interconnects.So this is hard to say any thing major for a change. i am a NOOB at all this anyway.Maybe in ten years of making my system better piece by piece I can define any differences better? This MIT set up seems to make any backgrounnd noise dissapear. Speakers seemed to expand to a widder sound field . I am not going to lie and say something in the paperwork that came with this set up or something I read posted elsewhere. Overall I was pleased with the results. I will upgrade speaker cables with some used MIT 750 MH style upgrades,but nothing like this. Thanks again Jesse for the honor of this demo. Darryl

F1nut

Round 4 of the MIT Shotgun S3.3 Demo/Review is now closed.

Thanks to all who took part, to MIT and Polk Audio for making this possible.