needing a phono pre

scottyboy76

Just bought a much better pre, but it does not have phono input.

Itching to get my vinyl going , Only have a technics sldd2 TT, with a decent at cart., but a better setup will be soon i hope, probably an entry level rega.

Any recommendations between 100 and 200 bucks will be greatly appreciated.

Of course, any info on what to avoid would be important.

Lastly, have been wondering how a phono pre in this range would compare to, say, denon avr3300 phono sections, just wondering if i can expect better sound even at the price range im looking at.

As always, thanks in advance.

Scott and deb

Upstatemax

I just picked up my Cambridge 640P phono stage from Audiogon for $170 shipped.

It sounds amazing compaired to my old H/K 3490 and Denon AVR-2808 built in Phono stages. quiter and much more dynamic.

steveinaz

In the budget arena, the Cambridge is tough to beat. NAD's offerings as well.

SCompRacer

I took my Nottingham Space 294 turntable to a friends place for him to demo. He has a Music Hall PA1.2 phono pre ($150), 40dB gain MM and 60dB gain MC. I was expecting an improvement over his existing table but it gave us some jaw dropping sound quality. I used both a high output and low output (0.3mV) MC cartridge. Like with most budget phono pres, loading is fixed for the MC input (100 Ohms) so you must have an MC cartridge with loading that matches the pre.

scottyboy76

Im gonna learn what all that means scomp, seriously.

I have noticed new music hall pres on ebay for around 150.

Out of curiosity, why do even cheaper avr phono sections not have the need for matching propertys and such, basically plug whatever you got in and play.

I assume its because better performance demands more specific matching, just a guess.

I thank you all for your input.

Big Dawg

Most avr phono preamps are built for MM or high output MC. No one who would use a low output MC would use the phono section of an avr.

SCompRacer

Sorry 'bout dat. Most MM (Moving Magnet) cartridges have a fixed loading of 47K Ohms an are high output (2.5 to 6.5 milli volts). MC (Moving Coil) cartridges can vary in loading and be high and low output. A loading mismatch can mean poor or no sound at all. With MM, you mostly plug and play. With MC you have to be aware of the loading and output in millivolt details. More expensive phono pres usually have adjustable loading to cover more MC cartridge choices.

The lower the cartridge output, the more gain you need, measured in dB. Some phono pres have a switch to choose between MM and MC. With low output and not much gain, the higher you have to turn the volume knob to hear the music which means you may get more distracting background noise from the phono pre with no music playing or during the quiet passages. It can also sound thin.

Anyway, I was just amazed how the thing sounded and I am particular about how my vinyl sounds. You could hear some hiss in the quiet passages with the low output (3 tenths of a millivolt output) MC cartridge, but it sure was impressive. (And my table is sold!) The higher output (2.5mV) MC cartridge required less volume on the pre amp so it was quieter in the quiet passages.

scottyboy76

Scomp, thank you so much, i was not being sarcastic, i was gonna research the terminology you used, but you were on the scene with the 411, and i truly thank you.

Little by Little im becoming literate in this field i love.

I do have one little question before narrowing my search down.

Should i be concerned about buying a phono pre that matches my tt and cart. i have now, then getting a little better setup(probably never something very expensive, thinkin entry rega and matching cart.) and running into matchup problems.

I guess im wondering if the vast majority of affordable gear will work with music hall 150 dollar pre?

Again thanks so much for patience and info,

scott and deb

SCompRacer

No worries Scott, I'm good. To me, it is easier talking face to face as I can talk faster than I can type.

If you stick with MM cartridges, it will be easy to select a phono pre. If you go with an MC cartridge in the future, then you have to watch the loading and output to make sure they will work with your phono pre. And there is nothing wrong with MM cartridges. There is quite a thread over at Audiogon discussing the differences between them (Why do we need MC when we have MM). There are also high output MC cartridges with 47K Ohm loading, so you use them on the MM input of the phono pre.

I know Cambridge makes good gear, so continue research and get the one that bests suits your needs. If you haven't already, do some google searches for best cartridges for your current or future turntable. Keeping in mind your budget, make a list of possible cartridges you may upgrade to. If any are MC, that could help you make a decision what phono pre to get.

EDIT: What AT cartridge do you have now?

scottyboy76

The audio technica is an at92e.

I know what you mean about communicating hrough a keyboard, my problem isnt speed, its the fact that many times i type the way i speak in conversation, and end up reading like a moron had typed it, whereas in person, its not quite as moronic.

But you have given me great info to start with, i will check out the audiogon discussion.

thanks