monitor 12 vs rta12

soundfreak1

How do they stack up to each other? What is the main diff. Between them other than 2 extra drivers?

dorokusai

There's no comparison. The MON12, in traditional definition is a bloated, inaccurate loudspeaker with no real redeeming quality. Its a party speaker.

The RTA12, the robot or R2D2, is a true RTA and an excellent loudspeaker. Great bass response, midrange and depending on the tweeter array, pretty accurate for its age with a warm tone.

soundfreak1

Doro, that's a very good description of what I find so appealing about the 12b and c . Very accurate and still maintaining a warmth that I've not heard in other speakers. Most speakers I've listened to give one or the other but not both, at least to the degree I find in the 12b's and c's. Thanks for the incite.

Joe08867

doro hit it square on the head. Mon12's are the Cerwin Vega of Polk Speakers. Bloated and boomy,

soundfreak1

Thanks I will pass on the 12's even at a low price. Just not for me. The b' and c's are remarkable speakers and do ruin one to just about everything else. I will say that that the 5jr's I just aquired ( for a bedroom sys.) Are the best sounding bookshelfs I've heard. They have the warmth I like and when I can around to putting the new caps in ( clairity sa.) They show great promise for what they are beeing used for. Polk has done some very fine work in a lot of there offerin
gs, I'm surrprized how low the pricepoint is to buy them. They sure seem to be one of the best bang for the buck for my ears and budget. And the support from polk is amazing. Must be a great co. To work for!

heiney9

soundfreak1 wrote: »

Thanks I will pass on the 12's even at a low price. Just not for me. The b' and c's are remarkable speakers and do ruin one to just about everything else. I will say that that the 5jr's I just aquired ( for a bedroom sys.) Are the best sounding bookshelfs I've heard. They have the warmth I like and when I can around to putting the new caps in ( clairity sa.) They show great promise for what they are beeing used for. Polk has done some very fine work in a lot of there offerin
gs, I'm surrprized how low the pricepoint is to buy them. They sure seem to be one of the best bang for the buck for my ears and budget. And the support from polk is amazing. Must be a great co. To work for!

I have a 2nd go around with a pair of 5B's in my office rig. Back in 1985 they were my first "real" speaker and I eventually upgraded to RTA11T's. I bought a used pair of 5B's about 4 years ago from a local Polkie, refreshed the x-over and put in RD0's, Larry's rings and I enjoy the hell out of them with a low powered tube integrated. I currently have a pair of much smaller RT25i's and RTi38's and while the RT25i's have a midrange to die for (may be even better than the 5B's) they obviously don't have the lower registers covered at all. The RTi38's are decent, but they seem to have an artificial quality to the lower mid bass and upper bass that I find quite distracting.

In a nutshell neither of those unseat the 5B's as they are a complete speaker that are very nice and natural to listen to. I will add some better caps to the RTi series to see if I can get them to perform better, but so far there is no contest the 5B's are the more cohesive, more natural sounding speaker.

So I'm not surprised how much you like your 5jr's

H9

soundfreak1

I agree h9, currently using Rt28 in HT sys. Which they do fine for that but not for music. As I don't use the HT sys. For music they are fine. The 5 Jr are hooked up to a vintage (1993 or so ) HK pa2200 SS amp and they are really mice on that rig. Not criticle listening but I find myself playing them more and more. Just very nice sound. I use the 12b's and c's with a parasound hca1200 and a dared sl2000 pre for criticle listening. Hard to beat that combo for less tthan 4 times the money. I have found the tube/SS combo works really nice with the rta's. But those little 5jr's do surrprize me with the bass. Can't wait to put the new caps in and see what they do than. Clairity sa caps, new terminators, wire,binding posts and risistors. Just got to figure how to get the caps in as they are the size of d cell batteries.they are bigger than the PCB's. Got to get a bigger hammer to make them fit,( LOL ).

heiney9

I am using Clarity PX in my 5B's. Don't forget to get some Mills non-inductive resistors as well. PX series make 250v caps which are a lot smaller and easier to find space for.

H9

soundfreak1

Yes the size is a pain but I already have the sa caps, so a learning process. First mod job so lesson learned. But I figured I could use a 2nd PCB for the new caps and risistor and use jumpers to connect it to the original PCB. Unless there is a better way. I was just looking at the small diff. On price between the px and the sa but didn't think about the size. Lessen learned! Worst case sernario is mounting the 2nd PCB to the back of the inside of the enclosier. Do have a ? I have read about people using sound barrier behind the driver to reduce internal reflections but won't this reduce the bass from the passive.

dorokusai

The MON5 series is fantastic and an often overlooked model.

KentFj

Very interesting , few years back I remember everyone saying the M12's were better then the SDA2's that I was in love with ... the last 2 years or so I have collected a few more polks . Still love my SDA2's I bought sda1b and magnets shifted one two mw6509 so can't rate them yet.

I picked up set of 10's 12's and 7's bought the 12s to see if better then sda2 .. nope they are not . but to my apparently not good ears, I like them better then the 10's matter of fact I think they sound great. I like the SDA effect better is the only reason.
I did replace the tweeters on the 12s one was blown replaced with Polk recommended. I am always amazed how well they sound ... I would say the the 10 are a lot boomier and thankfully none of them sound like cerwin vega's ....
and of course love the 7's ... so guess it just goes to show you we all have our opinions ...

I am very pleased with all my Polks and will continue to collect them ..

I find it best to listen and make my own judgments ...

I also have a set of original Carver ALS .. some people don't think they sound great either ...

anyone have a couple of MW6509 laying around

dorokusai

I'd love to see those comments found and linked because I've been here since 2003. Whomever said that needs to be slapped and everything is saved so it didn't go anywhere.

Why would the MON12, the dog of the line, be better than an often overlooked gem of the SDA lineup?

gdb

FWIW....which RTA version is generally considered the best in class ? Is $150 a good price for rta8tls in great cosmetic & working condition ? I assume 2 RDO-198s will be suggested right off the bat.

heiney9

dorokusai wrote: »

I'd love to see those comments found and linked because I've been here since 2003. Whomever said that needs to be slapped and everything is saved so it didn't go anywhere.

Why would the MON12, the dog of the line, be better than an often overlooked gem of the SDA lineup?

Yes, please show us the links.........it's not true now and it wasn't true then. The RTA12 will smoke the Monitor 12 in every area. In fact every Monitor in the Monitor line would be a better, more musical choice than the M12's.

heiney9

gdb wrote: »

FWIW....which RTA version is generally considered the best in class ? Is $150 a good price for rta8tls in great cosmetic & working condition ? I assume 2 RDO-198s will be suggested right off the bat.

RTA stands for Real Time Alignment as in the drivers and x-overs are optimized to present the signal so all the frequencies reach your ears at about the same time. Of course in theory that's great, in reality you have some uncontrollable factors such as room reflections. The R.T.A. 12 is the only speaker in the RTA line that is Real Time Aligned.

The RTA8, RTA11 and RTA15 use some other principles like a D'Appolito Array to give much better dispersion, but aren't truely time aligned.

Time Alignment
In a multiple driver loudspeaker system, it is important that the time delay inherent in each driver and its associated crossover network be the same to preserve accurate transient (see WFTD archive transient) response. In other words, the high frequencies and low frequencies much reach the listener's ear at the same time. A system which meets this criterion is said to be "time aligned." One way to accomplish this is to place the tweeter further away from the listener than the woofer, and this is done in many speaker systems. Another way is to design the crossover network to add a suitable delay to the high frequency signal before it gets to the driver.

The phrase "time alignment" is also sometimes used in reference to adding delay to one or more microphones in a situation where more than one mic is being used on an instrument, and the mics are at different distances from the instrument. A good example of this is orchestral recording where several mics are employed at various distances to accurately capture the sound of the orchestra in the hall. The microphones closer to the orchestra are sometimes delayed to be more in "time" with microphones placed out in the hall.

So the answer is the RTA12 if you are looking for accuracy in the time domain. I am very partial to the RTA11's, but each has a slightly different presentation.

H9

gdb

Thanks!

dorokusai

I'm with H9 and glad to see someone else finally got the RTA12 build and why it stands out in the line. I've been preaching this for years in regards to that model. You can get a poor mans RTA by using a stand, ala the factory MON5-10 Polkstand but it's just not the same.

GBD - I wouldn't pay $150 for an RTA8T unless it was in perfect condition. That's not to say its not worth it, just an opinion. I've owned a few pairs so that's also a factor.

halo71

I'd still like to try out a pair of M12's. And I would rather see them playing at the party instead of them ugly orange ringed woofers. lol

gdb

dorokusai wrote: »

I'm with H9 and glad to see someone else finally got the RTA12 build and why it stands out in the line. I've been preaching this for years in regards to that model. You can get a poor mans RTA by using a stand, ala the factory MON5-10 Polkstand but it's just not the same.

GBD - I wouldn't pay $150 for an RTA8T unless it was in perfect condition. That's not to say its not worth it, just an opinion. I've owned a few pairs so that's also a factor.

Gotcha, so the "Grails" are the 12s, I shall seek them, then. (RTA-12s)

drumminman

gdb wrote: »

Gotcha, so the "Grails" are the 12s, I shall seek them, then. (RTA-12s)

I'm a RTA 12C owner, bought 'em new in '84. Loved 'em then; they replaced some ADS speakers. They did everything well. Moved on to something else for years, but I couldn't get rid of them.

Joined here about a year ago and, after getting caught up on my reading :cheesygrin: decided to bring 'em back. With new, better Xover caps and resistors, + a few other things. They now sound better than they did when new. Using them as the front L-R mains in a HT system occasionally used for music. They love power - being fed by a Carver TFM 42. If you can find a pair in decent shape grab 'em!

Some great mod threads on the board, too.