PSW110 good enough?

polkfan38

I am looking at a new sub and see the PSW110 for a good price. I also notice its lower extension as only being in the mid to upper 30 Hz range. If you have say, Monitor 50s or Monitor 60s for mains, is this sub going to help that much? I would like to stay in the Polk line but I also realize the "better" ones are out of my price range.

Tbone289

Two channel? Home theater? What will you be powering your mains with?

polkfan38

I am currently in the process of totally redoing my "HT". Either Monitor 50s or Monitor 60s for L/R, A CS2 for the center and Monitor 40s for sides in a 5.0 set up. The .1 has been several cheap or hand me down subs over the years but, I would like to get a new one. Use wise, I would put it at 70% movies/TV and 30% music. I am not a "bass head" by any means but, some nice lower octave action would be nice. The room is not very large at 12 X18 but only about 2/3 of it is actually used for the "theater". I also never go past 5 on a scale of 1-10 for volume. Maybe 6 if the sound track is good! A denon 2312 by the way should be here tomorrow!

polkfan38

I am going to pass on the PSW110 and search for a PSW505 as the price is sometimes very close.

Thomasjclark45

I would recomend passing on the the PSW110 as well, here is a link for the PSW505 on ebay for 299.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Polk-Audio-PSW505-Subwoofer-/320763778318?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item4aaf02d50e
Also Newegg is running a special on the Monitor 60's II right now. $99.00 each. I would recomend the Monitor 60's over the 50's. I had the 50's as my mains for a while and they were great. I found the 70's on sale at newegg.com for $300 for the pair, and I could not past them up and moved the 50's to the rear. At $200 for the pair the 60's II are great do not let this deal pass you up. I almost lost the deal on the 70's as they sold out, but when I was about to buy refurb ones from polk I found newegg had gotton more in. Polk does offer refurbs on ebay at a good discount.
Polk Refurbs on ebay.
RTI8 - $399.00 pr.
Monitor 70's - $335.00 pr.
Monitor 60's - $252.00 pr.
Monitor 50's - $161.00 pr.
The refurbs are the older series and newegg is selling the II series. As far as I can tell there is no performance difference, but I think the II's look better with a black plastic front instead of the silver.

Mon40CSMM10

I have a PSW110. I've not had reliability issues. But, I've not had the smooth music bass I've been expecting from the sub. I'll explain.

In my opinion, this sub is really strong in the 50 Hz and 60 Hz frequency range. While I do get quite punchy bass drum hits, I don't get resonant bass lines in the music--that goes for metal, rock, and pop music. The lower range of the bass line seems muted, while the upper frequencies of the bass line come in much louder. If I turn the subwoofer dial down to mute the upper bass sounds, I almost completely lose the lower part of the bass line. So in my opinion, for music this is best used as a bass drum enhancer.

For example, as I post this, Katy Perry's song Last Friday Night is playing on the FM radio. The bass line seems to be B-flat B-flat G G D D C C. The B-flat notes and G notes are quite lower vs the D notes and C notes. I've heard more balanced bass output from a car audio deck with 2-way front speakers and rear fills speakers, but no subwoofer.

For movies, I think the PSW110 has the same issue with pop or rock soundtracks in the movie, but performs extremely well for gunfire sound effects and explosion sound effects in action movies.

Finally, I find the PSW110 has limited range. I have a dining area just to the right of the living room area. However, I do not get ANY bass sounds from the subwoofer in the dining alcove. But as long as I remain in the living room area, there is bass presence for movie sound effects and music bass drums in most of the room except for a couple of dead zones where the bass drops out.

As with most subwoofers, the bass output is strongest in the corners of the room and towards the ceiling in the room.

I've tried both the middle of the room and in a corner of the room, and there isn't much difference. I've also tried turning the subwoofer amplifier down and increasing the subwoofer channel in the A/V receiver. Again, the results are very similar.

Mon40CSMM10

Since I can't edit the previous post after I've logged off...

The main issue I've discovered with the PSW110 is that it does not seem to perform well with the usual 80 Hz recommended crossover, and higher crossovers make the bass too easily localized.

As it turns out, the optimum crossover for the PSW110 seems to be 50 Hz, with the other speakers set to small. Then I do get low bass in the bass lines in music, but the bass drums also hit even harder and lower.

If using an A/V receiver without separate selectable crossovers for front, center, and surround channels--it may be necessary to put passive high-pass crossovers on any speakers that don't go as low as 50 Hz. In my case, the Monitor 40s can handle below 40 Hz, the CSM can handle just below 55 Hz, and the TW-09B surrounds can handle down to 80 Hz. Therefore, I used Scosche XOHP passive high pass crossovers on the surround speakers, and since I don't listen anywhere close to reference volume the front mains and the center are not at risk for severe distortion or being blown.

BlackHawk

Mon40CSMM10 wrote: »

Since I can't edit the previous post after I've logged off...

The main issue I've discovered with the PSW110 is that it does not seem to perform well with the usual 80 Hz recommended crossover, and higher crossovers make the bass too easily localized.

As it turns out, the optimum crossover for the PSW110 seems to be 50 Hz, with the other speakers set to small. Then I do get low bass in the bass lines in music, but the bass drums also hit even harder and lower.

If using an A/V receiver without separate selectable crossovers for front, center, and surround channels--it may be necessary to put passive high-pass crossovers on any speakers that don't go as low as 50 Hz. In my case, the Monitor 40s can handle below 40 Hz, the CSM can handle just below 55 Hz, and the TW-09B surrounds can handle down to 80 Hz. Therefore, I used Scosche XOHP passive high pass crossovers on the surround speakers, and since I don't listen anywhere close to reference volume the front mains and the center are not at risk for severe distortion or being blown.

I recently purchased this PSW110 sub (my first ever Polk purchase) for a small room and that's what's it's good for... a small room in my opinion. Don't expect loud levels of thundering bass from it. But, for what it is I think it pretty good. The sound quality isn't too shabby, especially for a ported sub, but it runs out of steam. I wish it had a bigger amp in the same size cabinet.

Mon40CSMM10,

I am just getting back in to home audio after many years off so I have to ask... if you set the sub at 50 Hz and the mains as "small" aren't you losing a lot from 50 up? Mains set to "small" start playing at what... 100 Hz? 120 Hz? That's a big important gap there. Unless I am missing something, it doesn't make sense. I would think with the mains set to small you would want this sub set much higher than 50 Hz. Why not hook the sub up LFE, turn the low pass cross over on the sub up the whole way, and let the receiver process this? If your mains go down to 40 Hz shouldn't you have them set to "large?" Like I said I've been out of the loop so maybe I am missing something here, but as I see it, you are losing a lot with the sub set at 50 Hz and mains as "small."

tonyb

Keep in mind gents, that you should only use one crossover, not both, not the one in the receiver and the one on the back of the sub. Set the crossover in the receiver where you want it, say 50 hz, the rest is sent to the sub but the crossover on the sub has to be turned up to the highest value so as not to double filter the signal.

decal

^^^^ scumbag spammer reported ^^^^

BlackHawk

tonyb wrote: »

Keep in mind gents, that you should only use one crossover, not both, not the one in the receiver and the one on the back of the sub. Set the crossover in the receiver where you want it, say 50 hz, the rest is sent to the sub but the crossover on the sub has to be turned up to the highest value so as not to double filter the signal.

Why a 50 Hz setting on this? What if your mains can't handle material below 80 Hz? 100 Hz??? You would set them to "small" and lose a range of 50 to 80, 100, or whatever. Or, set them to "large" and feed them material they can't reproduce without straining? Sorry, but I don't get that thinking.

Mon40CSMM10

I should probably clarify what I meant by using a 50 Hz crossover. My receiver only has one crossover setting for all channels, so:

Front: Small
Center: Small
Surround: Small
Subwoofer: Yes

Crossover: 50 Hz.

The subwoofer amp dial is adjusted to the LFE setting when using a single subwoofer cable from an LFE/Sub output on the amp. For those speakers that cannot handle 50 Hz or below I've used passive high pass crossovers on them (aka bass blockers).

PSW110 will give more great to excellent presence for sound effects in movies and video games. It will even give better than average bass drum enhancement. The way I evaluate it; however, your car's stock stereo likely gives more even sounding bass instrument output presence than the PSW110--with the PSW 110 I tend to find the lower and upper parts of the bass line softer.

BlackHawk

Mon40CSMM10 wrote: »

I should probably clarify what I meant by using a 50 Hz crossover. My receiver only has one crossover setting for all channels, so:

Front: Small
Center: Small
Surround: Small
Subwoofer: Yes

Crossover: 50 Hz.

The subwoofer amp dial is adjusted to the LFE setting when using a single subwoofer cable from an LFE/Sub output on the amp. For those speakers that cannot handle 50 Hz or below I've used passive high pass crossovers on them (aka bass blockers).

PSW110 will give more great to excellent presence for sound effects in movies and video games. It will even give better than average bass drum enhancement. The way I evaluate it; however, your car's stock stereo likely gives more even sounding bass instrument output presence than the PSW110--with the PSW 110 I tend to find the lower and upper parts of the bass line softer.

I can't see your mains (Monitor 40's) playing down to 50 Hz very well despite what their frequency response may say. That said I can't see why you would set your sub at 50 Hz. I'd bet testing would prove that you have a gap. Adding a high pass in to the mix would take even more bass away and would make even more of a gap. Seems with what you have 80 Hz would be a much better choice for the sub. I could be missing something, but the way you have things doesn't make sense to me. It would make more sense if you had large floor standing speakers that could effortlessly play down to 50 Hz which you don't have.

Tour2ma

tony was only siting 50 Hz as a "for example" figure. His main point was to not double filter.

For Mon 40's, 70 or 80 Hz would be a place to start. For Mon 60's, 60 Hz...

You'd move higher to help out an underpowered AVR.

You'd move down to get more deep gut rumbling bass out of a marginal sub.

Mon40CSMM10

BlackHawk wrote: »

I can't see your mains (Monitor 40's) playing down to 50 Hz very well despite what their frequency response may say. That said I can't see why you would set your sub at 50 Hz. I'd bet testing would prove that you have a gap. Adding a high pass in to the mix would take even more bass away and would make even more of a gap. Seems with what you have 80 Hz would be a much better choice for the sub. I could be missing something, but the way you have things doesn't make sense to me. It would make more sense if you had large floor standing speakers that could effortlessly play down to 50 Hz which you don't have.

Well, what I've done is move the Monitor 40's to the back wall as surrounds, and added Pioneer CS-G203 speakers as the front mains, the Polk CSM is still the center. No need for the passive high pass crossovers except for the center channel if I use a 50 Hz crossover, but I went back to an 80 Hz crossover with the new front mains.

The same problem still exists--if I turn up the PSW110 to get the bass sound that I want, then the bass drum is too overpowering. If I change the front speakers to a large setting and shut off the PSW110, I don't have the same problem. Setting the phase switch to 180 instead of zero cancels out more bass, so a phase switch of 0 is the correct setting.

I mean, the PSW110 doesn't flat out suck--it's got plenty of bass drum punch and even more effective boom--but I expected much more bass instrument output in the frequency range when the sub Low Pass dial is set to LFE and the receiver is using an 80 Hz crossover. Yes, I could fall back to stereo mode and use tone controls, but I want the multichannel sound. If I use the surround sound modes or direct mode then the tone controls are disabled.

Unless I am doing something wrong--the settings I am using with the Pioneer VSX-517K + Pioneer CS-G203 + Polk Audio CSM + Polk Audio Monitor 40 are are listed below. (The usage of 10 dB attenuation in the LFE channel is to reduce the boominess in movies with boom type sound effects.)

Quick Setup selections:
? Is Subwoofer used? Yes.
? Number of Speakers: 5.1 Channel.
? Room Size: Small.
? Listening Position: Back.

(Room size measurements are approximately 16 feet wide by 9.5 feet deep by 7.5 feet high.)

Speaker Settings (after using Quick Setup), verify:
? Front: Small.
? Center: Small.
? Surround: Large.
? Subwoofer: Yes.

Speaker Distance settings, change from default values set by Quick Setup:
? Front Left: 9.5 feet (Quick Setup default value) => No Change.
? Center: 7.5 feet (Quick Setup default value) => increase to 8.5 feet.
? Front Right: 9.0 feet (Quick Setup default value) => 9.5 feet.
? Right Surround: 6.0 feet (Quick Setup default value) => decrease to 2.5 feet.
? Left Surround: 6.0 feet (Quick Setup default value) => decrease to 2.5 feet.
? Subwoofer: 9.0 feet (Quick Setup default value) => decrease to 6.5 feet.

Channel levels:
? Front Left: 0.0 dB (Quick Setup default value) => -8.0 dB (approx. 75 dBC).
? Center: -1.5 dB (Quick Setup default value) => -4.0 dB (approx. 75 dBC).
o Also adjusted to -4.5 dB to balance Dialogue Enhancement.
? Front Right: 0.0 dB (Quick Setup default value) => -6.0 dB (approx. 75 dBC).
? Right Surround: -3.5 dB (Quick Setup default value) => 9.0 dB (approx. 70 dBC).
? Left Surround: -3.5 dB (Quick Setup default value) => -9.0 dB (approx. 70 dBC).
? Subwoofer: 0.0 dB (Quick Setup default value) => +9.0 dB
o Connected as receiver LFE/Sub Out to subwoofer R/LFE input.
o Phase switch at 0.
o Calibrated by ear to blend in low bass with front channel and center channel bass.
o Amplifer dial just below the 9 o'clock position.
o Low pass dial at LFE.

Crossover Setting:
? X.Over: 80 Hz.

Dolby Pro Logic II Music mode Settings:
? Center Width: 6.
? Dimension: +3.
? Panorama: Off.

Other Settings:
? Phase Control: Off. (Phase switch On has no audible difference except for slightly less bass.)
? Dynamic Range Control: DRC Mid.
? Low Frequency Effects Channel Attenuation (LFE ATT): 10 = 10 dB attenuation from LFE channel.
? Virtual Surround Back: On.

Tone Controls:
? Bass: 0
? Treble: 0

polkfan38

Um. OK. Anyway, I have yet to get a sub. Still debating the PSW110. Just dropped price at Newegg. And again, I do not want earthquake bass. Just mostly to hear "all" of the music (down to the low 30 Hz range) and good sound from movies. The room this is in is not perfect so, I do not want to go crazy on gear at the moment. Should I be OK?

Tour2ma

^^ Reported spam post...

Mon40,
Don't know your AVR so I can't comment on the myriad of settings.

How much have you played with the placement of your 110 in the room? Where is it now?

pf38,
Are you saying you want your thread back? :cheesygrin:

Mon40CSMM10

I've tried the middle of the listening room and now it's 21 and 1/2 inches away from the corner of a wall. In both cases, I've tried phase 0 and phase 180.

Maybe I should try calibrating the sub at phase 180 and then adjusting the amp dial up or down when retuning the sub by ear.

Mon40CSMM10

If you have say, Monitor 50s or Monitor 60s for mains, is this sub going to help that much?

It may help a little by taking the lowest bass loads off of the 50's or 60's and routing them to the sub. In my experience, Polk Audio specifications are UNDER rated in many cases. This comes from running a CD with test tones ("The Ultimate Test CD") and getting lower bass output (when putting the ear up to the speaker) than the Polk Audio specs say it should go down to. This is a positive, not a negative.

That means even if the PSW110 specs are in the low 30's, that means at higher volumes those low 30's will be clear and undistorted unless the source material is distorted.

There's probably better subs, but the one thing I notice about the PSW110 for movies and video games is that it has a good amount of output at amp dial positions even below the 9 o'clock position. That means the amp is doing very little work to output that amount of bass. (If the sub isn't activating at lower volume levels, that's an AVR problem that Polk probably could have fixed by making the amp power on a bit more sensitive, but it's mainly an AR problem.)

deronb1

does your Pioneer have a "plus" setting for the sub? If so, try setting it to that. Set your speakers to "Large" and put the xover at 50hz. That combo has worked for me with various types of music. For HT, seems 80hz, set it and forget it, is a happy medium. Ultimately, it comes down to what sounds best for you.

BlackHawk

Mon40CSMM10 wrote: »

I've tried the middle of the listening room and now it's 21 and 1/2 inches away from the corner of a wall. In both cases, I've tried phase 0 and phase 180.

Maybe I should try calibrating the sub at phase 180 and then adjusting the amp dial up or down when retuning the sub by ear.

I don't care how you slice or dice it... your sub set at 50 Hz and the mains as small... you have a GAP there buddy. You are losing a very important part of the range whether you realize it or not.

polkfan38

The Monitor 40s play pretty flat down to 50 Hz but then really drop off. You can get 40 Hz out of them but, it is down 10-12 dB at that point. I am just going to go ahead with the PSW110 and see for myself. I will post my findings after I get a chance to play with it.

MADGSF

Check out the Polk ebay site, they have a DSW Pro 550wi on there for 350.00. There is also a DSW Pro 44wi for 269.00, both great prices IMO and my choice would be the 550.

CHISTEVE

I just purchased my PSW110 and already love it. It may depend on the rest of your system and it definately depends on what you think sounds good. I have my Yamaha AVR Crossover set at recommended 80HZ, using LFE Subwoofer setting and Subwoofer Volume set at about 60%, 0 phase switch. I use the 5 channel enhance setting on the Yamaha for music. The front, center and surrounds are all set to small. The Sub is placed on the front wall next to the TV and in between the fronts. My preferred listening position is 10 feet away from this wall. I have the surrounds mounted in the high corners at the very rear of the room. Compensate for placement via individual speaker distance settings on the Yamaha.

I listen all kinds of music: Jean luc Ponty, Chicago, Marcis Miller, Zappa (F and D), Ice Cube, Eminem, Rush, The Who, Mozart etc... You get the idea. The only tweaking I do is adjust the the Treble and Bass on the reveiver +/- 4db around 0 in order to achieve the sound I want.

Sounds just as good with movies although I find that it takes a bit of searching for the right sound field/decoding to achieve what I think is the best sound for that movie or sport event.

Anyway, I do not detect any frequency range loss nor drop-out. What the Sub does not produce is handled by the Tsi 400's and M10's. I am so happy with the PSW110! Can't wait to get a CS10 Center. BTW, this system is set up in a 12'x19' LR.

Is the PSW110 the best Sub you can buy? No. But for the $200 I just spent, I could not be happier. Note that you can obtain for less online. Happy listening.

sunderpalanivel

Hello Guys,

I am new to this thread. I have recently bought a pair of Tsi400 and Denon 1912. Just a 2 ch set up and even without sub-woofer it sounds fantastic, however I think adding a sub-woofer will free up the towers to concentrate on mid and highs, so thinking about adding a sub. Can I please get some advise on using Velondyne sub with tsi ? If any of you have this combination please share your experience. I am jsut confused if I should go for Velodyne or stick with pol and buy a polk 10 inch sub.

Thanks,
Sunder.

flyfisher

sunderpalanivel wrote: »

Hello Guys,

I am new to this thread. I have recently bought a pair of Tsi400 and Denon 1912. Just a 2 ch set up and even without sub-woofer it sounds fantastic, however I think adding a sub-woofer will free up the towers to concentrate on mid and highs, so thinking about adding a sub. Can I please get some advise on using Velondyne sub with tsi ? If any of you have this combination please share your experience. I am jsut confused if I should go for Velodyne or stick with pol and buy a polk 10 inch sub.

Thanks,
Sunder.

One of the best things to do is,find a best buy,fry's or a local audio/video shop to demo some subs.You will get a lot of combination/experience advise,but when listening,choose what YOU think sounds best to you.