Looking for advice...

Afterburner

Thank you in advance for all the responses...

OK... Just a little background. I am in my mid 40's as is my wife. Consider ourselves middle class and own our own business (That takes most of my time and energy as we do a lot in the community as well). Kids all grown and doing their thing. Along the way I became addicted to Audio in the car and Video in the home. Well And PC Gaming (My fatherly way to stay connected with my son). Basically my Gaming computer is cooled by water and runs three High End Video cards that drive three 26" monitors for Surround Video... (Link)

We went pretty deep into the Car Audio scene for about 10 years. All this means is I learned to listen with my ears and not my ego. If I could not hear the Thumb ripping across the cord then the speaker or amp was not in my cars. Distortion was a violation of the rights to even be an option :evil:. Did not matter what magazines or friends said or how much the cost. $40 or $500... Not to be confused with wasting money, just used my ear to decide purchase, not name and price.

In the video world we upgrade about once every four years to the new tech. Late next year or in 2013 we plan to get the next gen 3D (No glasses required) and hopefully 4k...

For now we have a nice 240hz 2d 55" LG.

That said... In our home... The second most used appliance (1st being the fridge) is our HT. Well my wife surprised me this Xmas with a pair of RTi12's from Polk's Ebay store (NITB). This was a total surprise and we never even discussed Audio for the home in the last few years (We are kind of coming out of our protective shell after losing our Son in a car accident in Jan 2010, he was a passenger). And I ran off with this from there... We are replacing a 5.1 setup that was a HK AVR320, BOSE 301's and 201's with the center BOSE VCS 10 and the JBL 12" Sub E250P...

While nice for general use. It lacked the punch we desire. Add this to our buying a new home this year and walla... New system.

So I have a blank slate. New rack for the components on the way... New speakers (All in sig and Polk's excluding Sub), 150' of in wall CL3 14/4 wire and a pile of wall plates...

Anyway...

I am NOT an expert in home audio. I do realize that sound is full of opinions, likes, dislikes and what damage or lack of damage a person ears have endured in life. But I would like to step up to 7.1 even though my floor arrangement will not maximize this feature.

With that I did a lot of reading, research and the normal "Changed my mind 300x's" and finalized my system for now with all Polk's speakers other than the Sub and a new Onkyo TX-NR809 to run them all.

We decided on the Onkyo because the Denon we wanted was not on sale and NewEgg has the Onkyo on sale for $650. We figure the feature alone on the Onkyo was worth the $650 and we could take the saved $600 (Vs. the Denon we eyeballed) and get an amp later if we needed it.

So Attached (I hope) is our layout and first stab at placement for usability of our space and restrictions placed on ourselves with windows and such. We talked, taped off the room (Instead of moving furniture all day we emptied the room and taped areas like they are the furniture).

Looking for input on...

Layout ... Any ideas or changes you would make?

Power... Is the Onkyo going to offer enough umph to power this?


Thank you!

Attachment not found.

Afterburner

Well for some reason the edit function disappeared on me. So sorry for another posting...

I am having a hard time locating any information on the back of the RTi4's in the ways of thickness and what kind of brackets/plates can be mounted to them for wall mounting... I plan to use wall mounts and was hoping for some ideas where/what type to use. Thanks!

cnh

Welcome to Club Polk!

Speaker set is very nice! The Onkyo will serve you well, but the RTi-12s could use a bit more "power". Consider adding an external 3 channel power amp for the L/C/R channels--the Onkyo has pre-outs that allow you to bypass its amps and add more powerful amplification. Think about something "used" if you're on a budget: Rotel, Parasound, NAD, B&K, Carver, Adcom, etc. You want at least 200 watts a channel into 8 ohms with those Rtis! The Onkyo can drive the surround Rti-4s, no problem!

Otherwise, things look pretty good. JBL sub is adequate but you could spend a bit more there, think about a HSU, SVS, or EPIK sub in the over $600 range if you can. See their offerings online!

And have fun!

cnh

jbooker82

Get a good 5 or 7 channel amp and be prepaired to hear a whole new system.

Afterburner

Ok... So it seems my first stab at a decent receiver fell short in the power department. And doing all of this all at once does make me wince a bit... But I am thinking of getting an Emotiva XPA-3 to run the RTi12's and the Center CSi5.

It seems the price and performance is hard to beat. Is this true? I am a noob and this is only day one of me looking around. I originally purchased the Onkyo TX-NR809 to replace my HK AV320 (55w) thinking it would get the job done for me...


Opinions? And thank you!

Afterburner

Ugh... And I am now looking at used and nearly all Parasound's and BK's are two channels... That seems like I am short changing my CSi5...

chumlie

Get a monoblock for your center chanel. Also Parasound makes a three chanel amp. Marantz makes a nice mono mc500 or mc700 are pretty nice.

jbooker82

Afterburner wrote: »

Ok... So it seems my first stab at a decent receiver fell short in the power department. And doing all of this all at once does make me wince a bit... But I am thinking of getting an Emotiva XPA-3 to run the RTi12's and the Center CSi5.

It seems the price and performance is hard to beat. Is this true? I am a noob and this is only day one of me looking around. I originally purchased the Onkyo TX-NR809 to replace my HK AV320 (55w) thinking it would get the job done for me...


Opinions? And thank you!

Most AVR's dont produce enough power to run Large Towers. Your Onkyo TX-NR809 will be fine, but an external amplifier will totaly transform the sound. Look for a Sunfire Grand Theater amplifer. The regular ones are rated at 200 WPC, and the Signatures are rated at 400 WPC.

Your Onkyo has pre outs so you can add an amp.

Afterburner

Wow I love all this help for a noob thank you... I am leaning hard right now towards the Emotive XPA-3... I like the idea of new with a warranty and yet appropriately priced for getting our feet wet. Knowing that I normally end up going all in on any project like this. I feel getting something like the EMO allows me the headroom/protection the RTi12's need yet gives me all kinds of time to research, find and change to AMP(s) XYZ when that time comes...

Does that all make since?

cfrizz

It makes perfect sense AB! Go for it, and Welcome to Club Polk.

chumlie

Great idea. Keep us posted and wellcome.

mdaudioguy

Afterburner wrote: »

Well for some reason the edit function disappeared on me. So sorry for another posting...

I am having a hard time locating any information on the back of the RTi4's in the ways of thickness and what kind of brackets/plates can be mounted to them for wall mounting... I plan to use wall mounts and was hoping for some ideas where/what type to use. Thanks!

I have two pairs wall-mounted and use these: http://www.amazon.com/Pinpoint-AM-40B-Clamping-Bookshelf-Speaker/dp/B002UV03MW
Not the cheapest solution, but well-made, easily adjustable, and secure.

Afterburner

mdaudioguy wrote: »

I have two pairs wall-mounted and use these: http://www.amazon.com/Pinpoint-AM-40B-Clamping-Bookshelf-Speaker/dp/B002UV03MW
Not the cheapest solution, but well-made, easily adjustable, and secure.

Thank you! I am looking at those and the Vantage Point BSM-B's... I plan to put them on the ceiling and aim them down a tad due to our room and that windows are right where they actually should be for "Ultimate" placement and that it is long right and left vs. front and back...

Afterburner

OK... I called Emotive and spoke to a very nice guy by the name of Nick... And took the plunge. Went with the XPA-3... I feel very comfortable in thinking the Onkyo TN-NR809 will power the four RTi4's in surround 7.1 and this three channel AMP will help.

The way I explained it to my wife... Think of when we buy a car and the deck is running all the speakers, then we add an AMP and the car sounds comes alive... That is all she needed to hear :razz:






Another question... I downloaded the Onkyo Manual and I see the receiver we purchased (TX-NR809) we have four more speaker connections. I am considering buying another set of RTi4's for the "Full Front" left and right speakers... Is this a gimmick or a true benefit?

Like already mentioned... This is our first time in "Not purchased from a box store" Hi-Fi setup (For a lack of a better way for me to say it) and I would hate to miss out on it for so little of a cost. Not to mention now that I have significantly reduced the load to the receiver, I hate to see any of that power to go to waste :redface::twisted:

We love all types of music (Drives our friends NUTS!) and Movies, TV shows are huge for us. The TV runs probably 16 hours a day and the AVR half that time (Wife is a stay at home lady)...

mdaudioguy

Afterburner wrote: »

Another question... I downloaded the Onkyo Manual and I see the receiver we purchased (TX-NR809) we have four more speaker connections. I am considering buying another set of RTi4's for the "Full Front" left and right speakers... Is this a gimmick or a true benefit?

I'd try it all without it for a while. You'll probably do a lot of tweaking at first. Make it sound as good as you can, and then decide if you need more. Sometimes these things can seem gimmicky, but other times they serve a legitimate purpose. I use an additional pair with my Yamaha AVR, but the intended purpose is to "lift" the center channel audio to align with the screen - before that, all of my speakers were below my screen.

mdaudioguy

By the way, I just re-read your initial post, and it was sad to read about the loss of your son. I can't imagine..., but it sounds like you and your wife have a very close bond. It seems like you are both helping each other. It's cool that you both share the same interests with regard to audio. Best of luck to you both.

Afterburner

We have another quick question...

We recently installed wood flooring during a semi-remodel (We did only the 1st floor including the kitchen, and yepper, we did all the work but the counter-tops) and wonder if the feet supplied on the RTi12's are only ready for Carpet or if they are universal for all flooring... Or do we need to come up with something... We do not want to have these bad boys drive themselves into the crawlspace

NewHTguy

Afterburner wrote: »

Ok... So it seems my first stab at a decent receiver fell short in the power department. And doing all of this all at once does make me wince a bit... But I am thinking of getting an Emotiva XPA-3 to run the RTi12's and the Center CSi5.

FWIW, I think your receiver purchase was an excellent one. It is hard to find a receiver for less than $1000-1500 that is much more powerful than the 809.

The three channel Emotiva is also a fine choice. Frankly, and I know I am in the minority here, I'd say that the Onk has plenty of power for the center and rears. Especially since you will likely have the center crossed over @ 80hz. However, the nice thing about the three channel approach is you can always add a two channel amp later and just use the 809 for processing. While this may seem like a waste, it also serves as a back-up if one of your amps starts acting up.

Afterburner

Thank you NewHTguy... Any input by chance on my question about the speaker floor pegs in the post above yours?

jbooker82

For $169 more dollars get the XPA 5.

Afterburner

jbooker82 wrote: »

For $169 more dollars get the XPA 5.

We debated on that over and over... The three way made more since at this point in time to us as we are just taking our shoes off to get our toes wet in the world of Home Audio. And figure there is a chance we will find other AMP(s) we will want to run.

Add this to us running four RTi4's for Surround in a wide and shallow room (See drawing link in first post), we saw no reason to by the Five channel as I would still fall two channels short for the rest of the 7.1 forcing the need for another two channel...

If we fall in love with EMO's then we plan to get a XPA-5 to run the rears with one extra channel left over for good measure.

Still looking for input on the speaker pegs on the RTi12's =]

deronb1

If they are the plastic/rubberish feet, they will be fine on hardwood. If they are pointy spikes, then you will need carpet squares or disks to set them in.

Afterburner

deronb1 wrote: »

If they are the plastic/rubberish feet, they will be fine on hardwood. If they are pointy spikes, then you will need carpet squares or disks to set them in.

Good to know... Thank you :cool:

We will get a set of disks just to be safe... Just was not sure if they came with a set of rubber feet and spiked ones like a few of the other speakers show or not...

jbooker82

Afterburner wrote: »

We debated on that over and over... The three way made more since at this point in time to us as we are just taking our shoes off to get our toes wet in the world of Home Audio. And figure there is a chance we will find other AMP(s) we will want to run.

Add this to us running four RTi4's for Surround in a wide and shallow room (See drawing link in first post), we saw no reason to by the Five channel as I would still fall two channels short for the rest of the 7.1 forcing the need for another two channel...

If we fall in love with EMO's then we plan to get a XPA-5 to run the rears with one extra channel left over for good measure.

Still looking for input on the speaker pegs on the RTi12's =]

Yea but if you went with and decide to keep the XPA 5 then you could get a XPA 2 and throw even more juce to the RTI 12's

Afterburner

jbooker82 wrote: »

Yea but if you went with and decide to keep the XPA 5 then you could get a XPA 2 and throw even more juce to the RTI 12's

Totally agree... But as a new comer, and seeing the complaints of no rainchecks and they are out of stock, I chose to play it safe and get the XPA-3 instead of waiting around... I figure at worst it could become my new "Garage amp" as I am about to be 5.1 in there...

Basically when we update our sound systems the current old one goes to the computer/office room (In our home), and what was there goes to the Garage...

So as this happens the next few weeks the HK/Bose 5.1 system will go to my office and the Yamaha/Pioneer 5.1 system will go to the garage replacing and old hand me down Realistic setup in 2.1...

So we upgrade the whole house as a result!!! hahahahaha :redface::cool:

jbooker82

Yea I didnt see that you already purchased it. I was just bouncing ideas off of ya. Having the front 3 powered by an amp is a huge step up. I run a 3 channel. I have though about getting another one. That way I could use it to have an amplified 5.1 system and leave one channel un used or run a 6.1 system.

With the most common 7.1 decoders the rear surrounds are actually tied to gether. That is why THX tells you to place your rear surrounds closer together twards dead center. You can also just use a single center channel speaker and run one rear surround.

I bleive the new DTS Neo X has the capability to run the rear two surrounds independent from each other.

Afterburner

jbooker82 wrote: »

With the most common 7.1 decoders the rear surrounds are actually tied to gether. That is why THX tells you to place your rear surrounds closer together twards dead center. You can also just use a single center channel speaker and run one rear surround.

I bleive the new DTS Neo X has the capability to run the rear two surrounds independent from each other.

That is good to know. I was reading the Onkyo manual and the THX website and decided to do exactly what you suggest (Two rear speakers close together). Onkyo is calling it (For this model anyway) 7.1-SB. It seems the majority of they types of audio we listen to fits this placement need.

We have actually been discussing getting two more RTi4's or even two more CSi5's for up front. But think for now it is overkill as we believe the next purchase that would have a larger impact will be a pair of subs, rather than some "Fill-in" speakers up front...

mdaudioguy

Get a booming sub - you won't regret it!

http://www.svsound.com/
http://www.hsuresearch.com/
http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/
http://www.edesignaudio.com/

Afterburner

mdaudioguy wrote: »

Get a booming sub - you won't regret it!

http://www.svsound.com/
http://www.hsuresearch.com/
http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/
http://www.edesignaudio.com/

Very nice list! My Cousin is the Home audio expert and when he and his wife are back from their skying trip I plan to ask him where he got his Subs built by. I know he spent around $2500-$3000 for each. But man oh man the make you feel like you're in the action...

I run these JL Audio woofer in my cars...

http://www.jlaudio.com/car-audio-subwoofer-drivers-w7ae

And was thinking of getting a pair of 10"s to use in the home... I have built more than my fare share of boxes for different vehicles and feel comfortable (After doing more research) with designing and building a set of boxes for the home. These are "Tight" acting subs that can make the week crap their pants... :twisted: Might even build them into the wall (Staircase behing TV/Audio rack)...

jbooker82

Or look at the FXI speakers for your side surrounds then you can put the other RTI 4's as high wides. A bi pole / di pole speakers are really neat for the side surrounds.

cfrizz

You are going to have a great system, and I think it's cool that your wife is just as interested in it as you are!