Almost ready to get back into HT...need AVR/amp advice.

comfortablycurt

So, I'm probably going to be selling off a lot of my 2 ch. gear soon, and put together a combination HT/2ch system. My first purchase is going to be a new AVR. I'm pretty much down to either an Onkyo 805/6/7/8/9 or a Pioneer Elite SC-07/27.

Obviously the Onkyo 805 has a great reputation for being one of the best AVR's Onkyo's ever built, and is widely considered to be better than the newer iterations of the 80x series. My main question is, what would I really be losing in processing capabilities by going with an 805 over one of the newer 80x series AVR's? I definitely don't have to be on the absolute cutting edge of technology, and I'm guessing that an 805 would be plenty for my needs. Is there anything really significant that I'd be missing with an 805 though?

I'm also considering the Pioneer Elites, but I think the price may be too prohibitive for me. I could get an Onk 805 for somewhere around $350-400 or so...while an SC-07 would probably run closer to $1000. I wish I could swing the extra expense...but I probably won't be able to...so I'm pretty well set on an Onk at this point.

As far as speakers go, I'll probably just piece together a 5.1 setup out of speakers that I already have. I'll use my SDA-2A's as mains, and probably my Monitor 7A's as surrounds...and I'll most likely use one of my Polk Mini Monitors as a center for now. I'll also initially be using my Adcom 545 to power my fronts, until I can afford to upgrade my amp. I'm undecided on what I want to do for amplification yet.

I'm thinking I may initially just sell the 545 and get a 5 channel amp, and then eventually get another 2 channel amp and another pair of speakers to move to 7.1. Or, I may start off with a 2 channel amp and power the rest of the speakers with an AVR, and eventually add either a 3 or 5 channel amp to round it off.

As far as what kind of amps I'm looking at...I'm really starting to look at Emotiva honestly. I know I've talked some smack about them in the past...but they simply have too much praise online and the prices are too great to just overlook them. They can't be that bad. I know I thoroughly enjoyed the Emo CDP when we were sending it around for demo. I'm thinking about going with XPA series amplification. I'd use an XPA-2 to power the fronts, and either an XPA-3 or XPA-5 to power the surrounds, depending on whether I want to go with 5.1 or 7.1.

I'd really like to upgrade my speakers to LSi's sometime next year too...though that might have to wait until 2013. Hopefully I'll be purchasing an AVR sometime shortly after the first of the year though.

Serendipity

IMO, the sound quality of newer 2011 model year Onkyo's for 2 channel listening is poor.

Decent sounding for movies, but horrible for music IMO.

You would be better off picking up an 805. Just find someone with an 805 and listen for yourself.

leroyjr1

I would go with the Pioneer Elite SC model over any Onkyo 80x series receiver.

Gadabout

The Emo amps are fine for HT, I didn't care much for the emo sound for music. That's why my mains are on a B&K

The newer Onkyo will have
- DLNA,
- Audio Return Channel and high speed HDMI (read 3d compatible),
- Qdeo 4k upscaling
- All video sources up converted to 1080p (composite was 720p on the 805)
- ISF video calibration
- 7.2 vs 7.1
- 8 vs 4 HDMI inputs
- More crossover adjustments
(There are probably more than these differences listed above)

Not sure how important those might be to you.

I just upgraded to the 809 and it was just under $650 (no tax free shipping) during a black friday sale. I can't speak to the pioneers as I don't have one. I should also mention that my reason for the Onkyo is different than most, it serves only as a Pre / Pro in the HT. All speakers are driven by amps.

Also, you might find that you might not have want to dump the 2ch stuff. The music was just missing something in my HT. That's why I started acquiring 2ch equipment, and I'm glad I did.

Scott

disneyjoe7

I would consider a Pre amp for 2 channel operation with a HT bypass for HT modes. Doing this the Onk may work ok due to fact the 2 channel isn't working though the AVR. Saying that I too became a fan of Pioneer elites over Onk so I would go Pioneer.

cnh

I agree with Leroy and Steve but again, you're not going to get an Elite SC for what a used Onkyo is going for and if "budget" is a primary concern--which I'm pretty sure it is for Curt, the 805 would do fine. What are you giving up? Mostly video processing, better Auto-calibration systems, HDMI 1.4 and 3 D processing, theater wide and height channels (9.2 surround?) and NEW internet access features (wireless, radio, and so on). As far as processing a Blu-ray soundtrack, the 805 (I have one) pretty much does what's needed.

Of course, getting a HT bypass is a necessity for two channel if you're going to use this for double duty. Much as I like my Onkyo, I would not use it as my main pre-amp for two channel but it can serve you for a while until you're ready to bypass it?

BTW, Curt, how are things going otherwise? Are you back up and running yet or still in the recovery mode?

I'm sure others will chime in. I like the Onkyo for what it provides me. If I had it to do today, and IF I had the money, sure I'd think about an Elite SC but that's not going to happen for a while. I can't "justify" the upgrade expense.

niente

Traveled down the same road in the last few years

AVR was step one and i demo'd everything i could - not sorry at all on selecting the ONK 804- not up to current HDMI version standards but works fine---though at times, just like me, it just sits a bit as though it's trying ot figure out what it was suppose to do!

Did a respectable job of driving the LSI's too--but no (fair or otherwise) comparison to the Parasound to be sure

Ditto on idea if you can find a clean 805--then grab LSI's if that's your goal

comfortablycurt

Serendipity wrote: »

IMO, the sound quality of newer 2011 model year Onkyo's for 2 channel listening is poor.

Decent sounding for movies, but horrible for music IMO.

You would be better off picking up an 805. Just find someone with an 805 and listen for yourself.

I keep leaning towards the 805 for these reasons. I've read similar sentiments all over the web. Either way, the 2 channel ability isn't a real huge concern in all reality, since I'd eventually be adding a 2 channel pre with HT bypass.

leroyjr1 wrote: »

I would go with the Pioneer Elite SC model over any Onkyo 80x series receiver.

I keep turning this over...and much as I'd love to get an Elite, I really don't think I could justify spending the extra money. The cost difference between an Onkyo 805 and a Pio SC07 is pretty significant.

Gadabout wrote: »

The Emo amps are fine for HT, I didn't care much for the emo sound for music. That's why my mains are on a B&K

The newer Onkyo will have
- DLNA,
- Audio Return Channel and high speed HDMI (read 3d compatible),
- Qdeo 4k upscaling
- All video sources up converted to 1080p (composite was 720p on the 805)
- ISF video calibration
- 7.2 vs 7.1
- 8 vs 4 HDMI inputs
- More crossover adjustments
(There are probably more than these differences listed above)

Not sure how important those might be to you.

I just upgraded to the 809 and it was just under $650 (no tax free shipping) during a black friday sale. I can't speak to the pioneers as I don't have one. I should also mention that my reason for the Onkyo is different than most, it serves only as a Pre / Pro in the HT. All speakers are driven by amps.

Also, you might find that you might not have want to dump the 2ch stuff. The music was just missing something in my HT. That's why I started acquiring 2ch equipment, and I'm glad I did.

Scott

Thanks a lot for all that info! I appreciate it. Having read that, I really don't think I'd be missing out on much that I'd actually use or need by going with an 805 versus a newer unit. Figure in the beefier amp section of the 805, and I really think it'd be my best bet.

I don't really want to dump my 2 channel gear, but I'd really like to make a combination 2 channel/HT using a 2 channel pre with HT bypass. Unfortunately, my current preamp doesn't have HT bypass, so I'd have to get a different one. There are some other things about my pre that I don't really like anyway...the lack of a remote control being first and foremost.




I really like the sound of my Adcom 545...but I think I need something with a little more balls. It's a great amp, but I just need more headroom and overall volume. The way I figure it, selling my preamp and my power amp would pretty much cover the cost of an 805.

I don't know what I'd do next though. The next move would either be a power amp or new surrounds and center channel. I'll likely continue using my SDA's as mains for the time being, and add a CSiA6 center channel and either RTiA1's or A3's for surrounds. I'd eventually move up to the LSi's, but I don't think I'll be able to afford to make that move for another few years realistically. I could pick up some RTi series speakers to round off my 5.1 for fairly cheap, and I already know from past experience that they'll blend pretty nicely with my SDA's. I used to have a full RTi setup...CSi5, RTi8 fronts and RTi6 surrounds...and when I used my SDA's as fronts with my HT, they blended in very well with the RTi's.

That would hold me over for a while until I could afford a full LSi setup in a few years. I'm more concerned about getting the front end of the system completed before dropping a bunch of cash on an all new speaker setup...especially when I'm already quite satisfied with my SDA's.

As far as the power amp goes, I think I'll most likely just pick up a 2 channel amp to start with, and then sometime further down the road I'll add a 3 or 5 channel amp to the mix. External amplification isn't going to be a real huge concern for the surrounds though, since I'd only really be using the surround channels for movies. I'd still be doing basically all of my music listening in 2 channel, and IMO, external amplification isn't really that necessary for HT. It certainly makes a difference, but nowhere near as drastic or noticeable of a difference as it does for 2 channel.

I'm really leaning towards an Emotiva XPA-2 for amplification though...and eventually an XPA-5 as well. That's still up in the air for quite a while though. I've also been looking at the Emotiva USP-1 2 channel pre-amp. Aside from the USP-1, the only other pre-amp with all of the features that I'd like to have is the Parasound New Classic 2100. I really like the fact that they both have HT bypass with separate inputs/outputs for subwoofers, with dedicated sub level/xo controls. That's an awesome feature...since I really like using my sub for 2 channel listening and I'd eventually like to go with stereo subs too.

comfortablycurt

cnh wrote: »

BTW, Curt, how are things going otherwise? Are you back up and running yet or still in the recovery mode?

Things are going very well for me. I've recovered as much as I'm ever going to...the doctors are saying that I made as good of a recovery as I possibly could have. There isn't really any lasting damage to my brain(aside from the damage that I've inflicted on it myself...lol), and for that matter I don't even really have any scars from the accident. I did lose some of my memory as a result of the coma, but nowhere near as much as many other people have. Every now and then, I'll still run into things that I don't/can't remember. This is typically in situations where a friend is telling a "remember this" kinda story, talking about something that we did in the past or someone that we knew...things like that. It's pretty few and far between anymore though. I retained over 99% of my memory, according to the doctors. I initially had some problems retaining new memories as well, but that's also passed over time.

I was really depressed for quite a while after the accident...but that's pretty common, and I've gotten past that now. On the whole, it was a huge learning experience for me...and it gave me a completely different outlook on life. It definitely taught me in a very real way that you've gotta live everyday like it could be your last...because it really could be.

muncybob

Brain trauma/recovery has a way of changing your outlook for sure...glad things are looking good for you!!

I will also be in the market for a decent pre with HT bypass in the next few months. Would like to know what you (or others) may have picked up and what price range. I 'd like to make a short list of models to keep my eyes open on for under $1k....if that's even a real possibility?

polkfarmboy

I think that with the 805 you only get room correction for 92khz and it wont do 192khz with room correction and the dacs are alot older. The main thing the 805 has is a large power transformer but thats not a fact if you pair it up with an amp as many of us here prefer. Its really a matter of room correction with all these new avs to determine a preference as most have great dacs. On that note I would say go with an anthem for the arc as its alot more sophisticated and very different in what it brings out in ones speakers. Maybe try an anthem mrx300 and pair it up with an amp, if you dont like it sell it and youl get back what you paid because its not a mass market machine with no online retailers

cnh

I really don't think room correction is worth 100s of extra dollars. And, frankly, I prefer my hand held Ratshack SPL to the Onkyo's auto correction. My manual adjustments have created an almost "perfect" sound-field in my room which I've tweaked some more by ear. The HT has never sounded this good!

Also, unless you're running some LSis or difficult load speakers, which I am not, the 805 will blow the socks off any small to mid-sized room. The only reason I would add any amplification to my system might be for two channel and two channel alone. But I don't use it for that!

But my speaker set is lower than most of you "High-rollers" who waste so much of their money on HT--of all things! lol

cnh

thsmith

Curt, a pre with ht is not required. I use a tube pre behind my avr. Set pre volume to 12 o'clock and use avr to level adjust mains with center.

Just any FYI. I have had 2 pre's with ht bypass and don't miss it.

Sorry to hear about your accident and was not aware.

Merry Christmas.

heiney9

Glad to see your healthy again Curt. Good luck with your HT system. It's not really my forte so I don't have much advice.

H9

dkg999

Great to hear that you are recovered and moving forward! Those SDA's were in HT duty previously and worked nicely in that role.

disneyjoe7

Wow Curt, sorry to hear, but very happy you're recovering as well as you have. Take this HT in steps and don't fret over it.