To sub or not.....that is the question. What say you?
Evrythngmatters
Posts: 187
Short and sweet. We spend lots of time and money on the best gear we can afford,the best cables,tweaks,etc. to get the most out of our systems. We want to hear as much as possible. Then I read about those that do not like subs with their speakers. No matter if it's bookshelves or floorstanders. WHAT???? You will never get the low frequencies that are in lots of music and you will be missing all that musical information. I equate it to a 256-320kbps mp3. So close but so far away my friend. So why is it that so many do not want ALL the musical information available on whatever medium you are playing. Wheather it be dat,r-r,tt,cd etc. What say you?
Everything matters. That is all.
Money cannot buy happiness, but it sure can buy a bad **** boat to pull up along side it though.
Money cannot buy happiness, but it sure can buy a bad **** boat to pull up along side it though.
Post edited by Evrythngmatters on
Comments
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Evrythngmatters wrote: »Short and sweet. We spend lots of time and money on the best gear we can afford,the best cables,tweaks,etc. to get the most out of our systems. We want to hear as much as possible. Then I read about those that do not like subs with their speakers. No matter if it's bookshelves or floorstanders. WHAT???? You will never get the low frequencies that are in lots of music and you will be missing all that musical information. I equate it to a 256-320kbps mp3. So close but so far away my friend. So why is it that so many do not want ALL the musical information available on whatever medium you are playing. Wheather it be dat,r-r,tt,cd etc. What say you?
It seems to me that many audiophiles want a tower speaker to be capable of playing the full range of frequencies that music normally covers.
I don't like playing a powered sub in a 2.1 configuration for music duty because the bass often times sound too exaggerated. This could be a problem with the sub that I have, room response or the calibration setting. Since I purchased the RTi A9's and now have a separate amp on them, I don't feel the need to run a sub to bring up the lower frequencies. The three 7 inch woofers take care of the low end very naturally and nicely. If I had more current and power, think it will be even better for music.
True, MP3 is lacking but one can have a 2 channel system that does not use a power sub with a discrete bass channel (2.1) or matrixed from the two front speakers and still provide the full spectrum of sound. Albeit, this feat is not often achieved cheaply as a 2.1 can be, but it is possible.
Your point about MP3 at 256-320kbps vs Lossless codec is not a valid comparison to people who will not use a powered sub to play the low bass freqs vs a 2.1 system for music. MP3 removes information where an inadequate speaker may attenuate a low frequency with a slope where one might not hear it strongly or clearly.
I like listen to music on my RTi A9's in DIRECT mode on the Pioneer Elite SC-35 with Adcom amp playing full range. I also run RTi8's crossovered at 80Hz with a PSW-111 for music duty and HT on the first floor living room. Between the two, I would say the RTi A9's make music presentation better and more accurate than the former between my two lowly audio setups.
My humble unlearned opinion...Fronts: Polk RTi A9
Center: Polk CSI A6
Rears: Polk RTi A7
Receiver: Pioneer Elite SC-35 (140 watts x 7)
Amplifier: Adcom GFA-555 Mk.II (200 watt @ 8 ohms)
Sub: Polk DSW PRO 500 (10 inch, 200 Watt)
TV: Samsung 59 inch 3D Plasma 600 Hz PN59D7000
Sources: Samsung BD-D6700 3D Blu-ray Player, DirecTV, PS3, iPhone 4 and IPod Classic with Apple Lossless Tracks -
I am wondering that also I figure what ever they are listening to has no low end, talk shows elec guitars .Evrythngmatters wrote: »Short and sweet. We spend lots of time and money on the best gear we can afford,So why is it that so many do not want ALL the musical information available on whatever medium you are playing. Wheather it be dat,r-r,tt,cd etc. What say you?
I know a guy here that works in a prosound store that gets, rents used eqipment he could get anything there but he prefers no subs just good bookshelves , employess there have tried he has no need for subs .
I worked at a body shop for 6 years I often see cars with the factory optional sound system its not serious stuff but if you pay extra and all you listen to is sports and rush limbough it seems a big waste if $$ .. -
Once I got a sub, I started using it for both music and movies, and more often then not I listen to music with all of my speakers. Yes sometimes with music that has a very distinct bass track it can get a bit overwhelming, but it's not with every song, and having it helps with other music.
There are no absolutes in this hobby, do what you want or what you think sounds good to you.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2 -
There's nothing wrong with a properly integrated, high quality sub. The problem is, most of the time, that criteria isn't met."He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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There are no absolutes in this hobby, do what you want or what you think sounds good to you.
I agree totally. Just curious on peoples thoughts concerning this. What I am getting at is we spend all this time and money only to claim we don't care about the low end. IF your hearing does not allow you to hear those frequencies then cool, you saved some money. But, if you can why not go for the "complete" experience instead of missing a percentage? After all, isn't that why we do all these tweaks,switch equipment,cables,ic,etc to get closer to audio nirvana. Seems like a waste of time to me get everything just right but only to "ignore" the low frequencies. I could not imagine organ,classical,r&b without a low end. I would feel like I am listening to a BOS3 system or something.Everything matters. That is all.
Money cannot buy happiness, but it sure can buy a bad **** boat to pull up along side it though. -
There's nothing wrong with a properly integrated, high quality sub. The problem is, most of the time, that criteria isn't met.
I know the sub part is pretty easy imo. Same 10 or so subs almost every year that are suggested no matter what forum you are on. A couple added or taken away each year. Right now the flavor of the month seems to be Epik. Then back to normal programming with the Velodyne,SVS,HSU,JL,etc. suggestions. Integrating the sub correctly can be a pita for sure and most do screw it up and sounds bad. I am not one to tell another their system sounds like crap but it does have an affect on how long the visit will last if the music is playing,lol.Everything matters. That is all.
Money cannot buy happiness, but it sure can buy a bad **** boat to pull up along side it though. -
I think you'll find that most detracters from a sub in 2 channel never had the pleasure of hearing a well integrated system with a quality sub/subs. Done right the difference is staggering...and it's not even about the bottom bass notes that everyone seems stuck on. It's more about the foundation & the way the music builds & is projected from it. But the key is spending the time to properly integrate & you must have a quality sub or else it's all for naught. I'm a firm believer."2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
