Dual 721 Turntable - new cartridge

PrazVT
PrazVT Posts: 1,607
edited August 2011 in Electronics
Hey Guys - this is one area I know very little about. My dad has a Dual 721 turntable that he bought back in 1983 - still works and he uses it (lots of classic rock LPs) once in a while. Bought that plus his JBL L166s from the same guy back when he was in grad school at Va Tech.

He's been thinking about getting a new cartridge for it and perhaps a new phono preamp, as he's still soldiering on with an old Realistic one.

Wondering if you turntable aficionados could help me out w/ any suggestions on:

- a new cartridge - not sure what specs I need to worry about (compatibility with the arm, weight, stiff / compliant).
- new phono preamp - it would probably need to integrate with his Onkyo 707. I take it a new pre would make a difference SQ wise?

Have a copy of the user manual if that helps. Thanks guys.

- Praz

p.s. I'm not sure about budget, but a range of suggestions would help.
Dali Optikon 1Mk2
NAD D3020 V2
Schiit Bifrost 2/64

..the rest are headphone setups.
Post edited by PrazVT on
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Comments

  • AudioGenics
    AudioGenics Posts: 2,567
    edited June 2011
    hi.
    check out http://www.gradolabs.com/
    also can send any questions to info@gradolabs.com

    the grado phono cartridges are made in the USA and work great with the Dual tables.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited June 2011
    Thanks AudioGenics - I will check them out.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited June 2011
    Thanks fastz28.

    Perhaps a stupid question - the connectors for cartridges are standard right? I noticed for this TT, the cartridge is in a cartridge holder which seems to have its own interface. Is that something to worry about?

    here's a pic of what it looks like.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • jon s
    jon s Posts: 905
    edited June 2011
    the wires are color coded for each channel and ground... make sure you note which goes where... if you want to check selections out go to the needle doctor site...

    As you will see, cartridges and turntables can get awfully expensive... During the heydey of turntables, spending $1,000 for a turntable will get you a top line model... now that price will only get you a midrange to lowend model...
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited June 2011
    Nice - I saw another recommendation for that one somewhere else too (the Ortofon).

    According to the manual any cartridge with 1/2" spaced mounting holes should work, and the Ortofon looks to have them.

    So next up is the PS Audio pre.

    Awright! gettin somewhere :)
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited June 2011
    Thanks - you're reading my mind dude. I was looking at a cambridge one too :)

    For that matter, I'd like to replace the stock RCA cables as well. I believe that on the TT, they terminate with spades. Trying to think how I can get (or possibly make) a cable like that.

    All this may be his father's day present. Then he can spring for a new amp himself ;)
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • Fongolio
    Fongolio Posts: 3,516
    edited June 2011
    The Dual 721 has a lower mass arm so a higher compliance cartridge will sound best. The Ortofon suggested above is an excellent choice for that arm and will bolt right onto the cartridge carrier. Some Grado's will work well too, just be sure the compliance is high-medium to high.
    SDA-1C (full mods)
    Carver TFM-55
    NAD 1130 Pre-amp
    Rega Planar 3 TT/Shelter 501 MkII
    The Clamp
    Revox A77 Mk IV Dolby reel to reel
    Thorens TD160/Mission 774 arm/Stanton 881S Shibata
    Nakamichi CR7 Cassette Deck
    Rotel RCD-855 with modified tube output stage
    Cambridge Audio DACmagic Plus
    ADC Soundshaper 3 EQ
    Ben's IC's
    Nitty Gritty 1.5FI RCM
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited June 2011
    Thanks for confirming that the Ortofon will do the trick, Fongolio! I think I will go with that one.

    As usual, you guys rock.

    Any thoughts on the RCA cables? Should I leave 'em alone? Apparently replacements would need to be 3mm thick max.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited August 2011
    Update ...gave my Dad the Ortofon 2M Red and Cambridge 640 phono pre this weekend for his bday. I actually installed the cartridge myself and did the balancing and all (very new experience for me lol), and wow what a difference!

    Listened to a random assortment of Dad's LPs - Abbey Road, Best of Jethro Tull, David Crosby, Elton John's Madman Across The Water, Led Zeppelin (Zofo), etc. - sounded CD like!! Simply amazing.

    Anyway he and my mom were extremely thrilled yesterday - I suspect he'll start adding onto his LP collection again.

    Thanks again for all the advice - really paid off!!

    - Praz
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • DON73
    DON73 Posts: 516
    edited August 2011
    PrazVT wrote: »
    Update ...gave my Dad the Ortofon 2M Red and Cambridge 640 phono pre this weekend for his bday. I actually installed the cartridge myself and did the balancing and all (very new experience for me lol), and wow what a difference!

    Listened to a random assortment of Dad's LPs - Abbey Road, Best of Jethro Tull, David Crosby, Elton John's Madman Across The Water, Led Zeppelin (Zofo), etc. - sounded CD like!! Simply amazing.

    Anyway he and my mom were extremely thrilled yesterday - I suspect he'll start adding onto his LP collection again.

    Thanks again for all the advice - really paid off!!

    - Praz



    Good for you!! Your parents are blessed to have raised you.
    TO ERR IS HUMAN. TO FORGIVE IS CANINE.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited August 2011
    DON73 wrote: »
    Good for you!! Your parents are blessed to have raised you.

    Thanks Don - well I gave them hell for a time, so this is one goes in the '+' category lol.

    Amusing remark by mom yesterday - "how does this boy know these things??"

    CP!!!
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited August 2011
    PrazVT wrote: »
    Update ...gave my Dad the Ortofon 2M Red and Cambridge 640 phono pre this weekend for his bday. I actually installed the cartridge myself and did the balancing and all (very new experience for me lol), and wow what a difference!

    Listened to a random assortment of Dad's LPs - Abbey Road, Best of Jethro Tull, David Crosby, Elton John's Madman Across The Water, Led Zeppelin (Zofo), etc. - sounded CD like!! Simply amazing.

    Anyway he and my mom were extremely thrilled yesterday - I suspect he'll start adding onto his LP collection again.

    Thanks again for all the advice - really paid off!!

    - Praz

    Your Dad has excellent taste and he also seems to have done a nice job with you! What a nice gift!

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • Fongolio
    Fongolio Posts: 3,516
    edited August 2011
    Good to hear you and your folks are happy. Excellent cartridge for that arm/table.
    SDA-1C (full mods)
    Carver TFM-55
    NAD 1130 Pre-amp
    Rega Planar 3 TT/Shelter 501 MkII
    The Clamp
    Revox A77 Mk IV Dolby reel to reel
    Thorens TD160/Mission 774 arm/Stanton 881S Shibata
    Nakamichi CR7 Cassette Deck
    Rotel RCD-855 with modified tube output stage
    Cambridge Audio DACmagic Plus
    ADC Soundshaper 3 EQ
    Ben's IC's
    Nitty Gritty 1.5FI RCM
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited August 2011
    Good to hear you and your folks are happy. Excellent cartridge for that arm/table.

    Yeah the combination results in a very quiet & clear soundstage. Even the L166s were sounding better (more bass) with the dual subs off. Well he only had a day to play w/ it, as he's on his way to India to visit his own 99 year old dad for a few weeks. But I'll have his system tweaked by the time he gets back, as I'm house sitting for him and my mom anyway.

    Your Dad has excellent taste and he also seems to have done a nice job with you! What a nice gift!

    It's funny, all this stuff he bought when he was about the same age I am now lol. But yah. I grew up listening to all his records so that's where my classic rock tastes originate from.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • erniejade
    erniejade Posts: 6,321
    edited August 2011
    nevermind i didnt see this was an older thread
    Klipsch The Nines, Audioquest Thunderbird Interconnect, Innuos Zen MK3 W4S recovery, Revolution Audio Labs USB & Ethernet, Border Patrol SE-I, Audioquest Niagara 5000 & Thunder, Cullen Crossover II PC's.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited August 2011
    @fastz28
    Thanks dude! Worked great :)

    @erniejade - all good, still a valid point.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited August 2011
    And just for the hell of it ..here are some pics (sorry, iPhone cam)...
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • miner
    miner Posts: 1,305
    edited August 2011
    Nice choice for a gift. I am sure something he would not do for himself. Something about listening to LPs thatbrings a bit of youth back into us.
    [
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