Help me choose either 7's or 10's to upgrade xo's on

TNHNDYMAN

I currently have 2 pairs of Monitor 7's and 10's and am ready to attempt my 1st xo upgrade. I'm not sure which set I want to tackle first and would like some input and opinions please. These will be used as a front stage along with a newly acquired CS2 and some Insignia NS-B2111 as surrounds for HT use as well as using the mains for 2 ch listening as well. I'd prefer to use the larger 10's but all four options seem to have plus's and negative's to them. Here are the following canidates:

1. Later set of 10b's? with the less loved SL2000 tweet. The cabinets are in nice shape but I'm a little lost on if I upgrade to the RDO194 tweet how that would affect which capacitors and or resistor values to use.

2. Early set of 10's picked up at a garage sale w/ Peerless tweets, but they are in bad shape cosmetically. I eventually want to redo the cabs in a nice wood veneer and stain them. One speaker terminal cup is badly cracked and I need a MW6500 driver. They came w/ 2 bad mids and I have one on hand but need another so I don't have to rob any of the others.

3. Set of 7c's that I put together from cabs, PR's, and xo's purchased from CP member geppy and found a set of 6500's on ebay. These look nice, have the Peerless tweet, and seem to have the best cabinet seal based on the PR push test.

4. Early set of 7a's that I bought from CP member Peelerboy that had 1 bad 6500. I replaced this and they sound great already. These also have the Peerless but I don't like the way the speaker grills attach to the front of the cabs w/ the recessed cut outs and plastic velcro like things. (Sorry not sure how to describe it)

I plan on using Mills resistors, but due to budget limits, I'll most likely use Solens caps for the Low Pass 34 or 27uF values depending. For the High Pass 12uF values, it seems as if most choose either SonicCaps or ClarityCaps. I'm not seeing these in the Parts Express catalog. Would the Kimber Kap's be a suitable choice? If not what source would you recommend-Madisound or someone else?

My soldering skills are limited at best. I have practiced on a set of thrift store Sanyo's soldering speaker wire to the tiny capacitors that were taped to the inside of the cabs (they did work properly afterwards), but I have never done any work on a PCB before but there has to be a first time for everything. Forgive me if I post too many pics, but I want you to see what I have to work with and truly appreciate any advice and help I can get. If anyone has a extra 6500 driver PM me and I'll try to work out the details with you. Thanks, Travis.

F1nut

1. Later set of 10b's? with the less loved SL2000 tweet. The cabinets are in nice shape but I'm a little lost on if I upgrade to the RDO194 tweet how that would affect which capacitors and or resistor values to use.

You would use the same values, but bump the 5 watt resistor(s) up to 12 watt. Although, not because of the tweeter.

Link, http://www.soniccraft.com/

Outfitter03

First off that is a lot of speakers to do, you should be pretty good at this by the time you are done+++!

I definitely would not go less expensive on the tweeter cap than the two choices you list, but I have two options for you. One is to go with Clarity Cap ESA, but go with the newly released lower voltage ratings. 250v vs 600. The Sonicap Gen I that many people use are rated at 200v and work just fine. I only know that these are available with Parts Connexiion.

http://www.partsconnexion.com/capacitor_film_claritycap_esa.html

I like buying from Madisound and wrote to them about stocking these but do to inventory carrying costs they are not going to in the foreseeable future. Parts Connexion has an excellent selection but the downside is higher shipping costs and a two month wait time for the non-stock items!

The other thing I would do is put together my budget and wait a little while to order. If you need resistors, or some chassis/hookup wire, solder etc as well as additional capacitors, Sonicraft in the past has had either 15 or 20% off sale usually around the 4th of July weekend. They are awesome to work with and while their site first appears small, they stock some of the best choices out there for all kinds of parts.

http://www.soniccraft.com/sonicaps.htm

If I had your speakers, I would go with choice #3 to start. I just ordered a set of Monitor 7 that look a lot like those but mine are 7B off Fleabay that should be here this week.

I have already purchased Larry's rings so they are in the que for upgrades and I have a long list of projects like you do.

TNHNDYMAN

Thanks for the links. I've looked over pricing, and not much difference between Clarity Cap vs. Sonic Cap Gen I's so I will probably stick w/ soniccraft because I would have to wait at least 2 weeks on Parts Connexion to get anything in plus shipping from Canada would probably be more expensive. If I use Solens for the low pass, I could save around $50 that could be applied towards dynamat and mortite on the drivers. Anyone think going sonic caps all around is better than this compromise? I will have to look into toolfan's thread again and see if he has anymore ring's available. Everything I've read seems to confirm that is the best option for sealing the drivers to the cabs. Either way the speakers will probably be on the hardwood floors so I'm not sure about spikes, and I've toyed with the idea of making my own stands but I do have a almost 2yr little girl running around so I would be worried they would get knocked down. I've heard of blue tack, but don't know enough about it to guess how effective it would be at keeping the speakers attached even if I make a larger than normal base for added stability. Again would love some more opinions and recommendations.

F1nut

Anyone think going sonic caps all around is better than this compromise?

Yeah, my ears tell that Sonicap's are better sounding shunt caps than Solen. Forget the Mortite and you'll have $5.00 to put towards the better caps. If you can't get Larry's rings, use Hurricane nuts instead.

Schurkey

If I were unsure of my soldering skills, I'd be using the Dayton or Erse caps on my first crossovers. They're WAY better than the OEM caps; and cheap enough that if I screwed up, I don't have to skip lunch for two weeks to buy replacements.





Oh, wait. I can solder just fine, and I still used Dayton and Erse caps. I must be cheap.

Outfitter03

Schurkey wrote: »

If I were unsure of my soldering skills, I'd be using the Dayton or Erse caps on my first crossovers. They're WAY better than the OEM caps; and cheap enough that if I screwed up, I don't have to skip lunch for two weeks to buy replacements.

It's not nice trying to scare the OP new to soldering and willing to give this a try. Pretty hard to harm these big caps. Just don't cut the leads off too short so you have plenty of times to try. Use a heatsink between the wire end and the cap.

This thread has some nice pics near the bottom of the page of the solder connections and one good solution for mounting the two 17uf caps courtesy of Rev. Hayes.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59619&highlight=crossover+upgrade&page=2

TNHNDYMAN

No worries about scaring me off. I realize being inexperienced I may screw up, but from what I can tell it's not brain surgery so I'll give it a go. I will do one first and make sure it works before starting the other as a safety net of sorts.

Schurkey- using some inexpensive caps isn't really a bad idea to try 1st time and I will look into that. If all else fails I do have a few pairs to play with so at least I can pull a crossover and try again.

@F1nut- I was not questioning your ears at all... I believe you and many others like HB27, Rev. Hayes, who relate that sonic caps are definately better than Solens. My ? is really what level of improvement are they say 25% -60% better as well as how much of that difference can be made up by improving other areas such as placement on stands, drivers being sealed properly to cabinet, binding posts upgrade ect..

I'm sure that all links in the chain have a role and impact overall but without hearing it myself it is hard to understand which upgrades provide individual nuances that are difficult to express or at least put into words. I've learned alot in the past year from just reading posts on this forum daily and appreciate all those willing to help out. It would be easier and safer to send these out and let someone else upgrade but I am looking forward to some hands on work and the satisfaction that will hopefully bring. After mulling it over the last few days, I think I will try a pair of 7's first but I still am unsure which pair the 7a's or 7c's. Thanks again for everyone's insights. That 25% off sale in July would be great but I'm not sure I can wait that long as well as funds may get used for other home improvement projects if I don't jump on it now.

F1nut

TNHNDYMAN wrote: »

@F1nut- I was not questioning your ears at all... I believe you and many others like HB27, Rev. Hayes, who relate that sonic caps are definately better than Solens. My ? is really what level of improvement are they say 25% -60% better as well as how much of that difference can be made up by improving other areas such as placement on stands, drivers being sealed properly to cabinet, binding posts upgrade ect..

I didn't think you were.

I can't put a percentage on it, but it's there.

As you noted, it all adds up. Although, I have to say that binding posts upgrades never improved the sound to my ears, but I upgrade them anyway because I can.

Edit: I would encourage you do the soldering yourself. It's not rocket science and therefore hard to screw up. One tip, don't overheat the resistors and do not put hot glue on them.

Thought of another...dry fit everything first.

Joe08867

Having heard both I preferred Sonicaps. Solen's seemed to get a little brittle(Grainy) when they were driven hard. Especially if you are keeping the original tweeters as they are not as forgiving as the RDO replacement. Clarity Caps and Sonicaps are all I use at this point. Bang for the buck you can't beat either.

I would not go Dayton unless just for the lows. And really were only talking a couple bucks difference for the crossovers your talking about.

TNHNDYMAN

For the "shunt caps", I am assuming this is for the low pass 27uF value- please tell me if I'm wrong on the terminology. If I have to go with a less expensive alternative anyone have a favorite between the Solen Caps vs. the Jantzen CrossCap Metallized Polypropylene Caps sold @ parts express?

Joe08867

I would go Jantzen before Solen.

TNHNDYMAN

Thanks for the input Joe. I'm putting an order together for Parts Express and need a few extra things to qualify for free shipping so I think I'll try the Jantzen for the 27uF value. I can always go back and change later. I went and looked at TOOLFAN's thread on the rings and it appears he has sold all avail for now so I asked to be put on a waiting list. I'm excited to get the order placed.