R150 and RM8 center

runrabbitrun79

Hi,
I was wondering if anyone had a solution or advice on this:
Here's the setup:
Sony STR-DH510 receiver.
pair of Polk Audio R150 speakers for my L/R channels
Polk Audio RM8 center channel

Center set to small and L/R channels are set to large

I've been using this mode since it sounds the best:
Cinema Studio EX B

Here's the issue: Before I set up the center, the R150s sounded great as a pair. Now that I have the center, most of the sound comes through the center, with some surround in the L/R channels. It sounds good, but I know the R150s sounded more powerful before. Any advice or solutions? Is it the inexpensive receiver or speaker pairing. The matching center for the R150s is very large, which is why I got the rm8 center.

Zeros

The center that you are using is not timbre matched to your R150's so it is going to throw the sound off. If you can, go with the matching center. It will blend correctly and sound the way it should.

Wendelman

The RM8 is a recommended match for the R150's and the M20 (R&M series). I think the CSM and CSR are also rec, but are much larger. Your mains will lose some of their presence whenever you add a center or any other speakers to a stereo setup. The AVR's amp- you may even hear a click- has to switch over the multi-ch mode (and DSP) reducing output to each speaker. The center will receive a good portion of the audio signal, especially the higher freq (voices, etc.). I'm not familiar with the "Cinema Studio EX B", but I would guess the DSP is sending a signal to all 5 ch, and possibly even using the "B" speaker set as the surround rears, matrixed from the 5.1 signal. If this is the case, your amp is splitting power between 7 ch. Are both A + B sets turned on? This will greatly decrease your average output/ch.

If they sounded better in stereo, I would just stick to the R150's and make sure it is set to stereo and the "B" speakers are turned off. If you want to keep the center, make sure the fronts are set to Large (and Bass Mgmt to mains) and the center is small. Use a DSP that does not indicate EX B, and always make sure B is off. Better still, add some inexpensive surrounds for a true surround sound.

Hope this helps!

Zeros

Wendelman wrote: »

The RM8 is a recommended match for the R150's and the M20 (R&M series). I think the CSM and CSR are also rec, but are much larger.

Where do you see that the RM series is a match with the R series? Here's what I saw on the RM page:

"RM8 Center is the flagship center channel meant to be paired with the RM8 satellites"

Wendelman

Sure, it is ideally matched with a set of RM8 satellites as they sell as a set, the RM95 5.0 package, which I have. After I bought the RM95 package, I was shopping for some towers to make a 7.1 system, and the R150's, R300's and M20's are good matches for the RM8's. They use the same .75in tweeter, and are less likely to drown out the center/sats than TSi's or anything higher.

The CSR and CSM are also part of the same series, and would match a little better as they use the same tweeters and woofers, but he indicated they were too big for his setup. Is that what you are recommending him to get?

Also, to follow up from above, I would rec a pair of RM8s for your surrounds would be a good, inexpensive option (pair on Amazon for $99 right now!). Again, set the RM8s to small and the R150s to large to get the fullest range from the fronts, but will still not sound as good as they do in stereo vs. multi-ch.

Zeros

Wendelman wrote: »

The CSR and CSM are also part of the same series, and would match a little better as they use the same tweeters and woofers, but he indicated they were too big for his setup. Is that what you are recommending him to get?

Honestly I don't care what one he gets, but the CSR and CSM are the matching centers per Polk.

What about using the r150's for surrounds and picking up a pair of RM8ss for the fronts to match the center? Not idea, but at lease the fronts would all match.

Wendelman

Yeah, that is what I said in my first post. Assuming that he was referring to those as being too big, I wanted him to know that the RM8 is still a good match so he doesn't feel as if he needs to go out and buy another center. Having used the R300's with the RM8's, I can say that, in my opinion, it would be hard to find a better match out there (with some EQ and speaker level adj). Just trying to give to guy my opinion and advice.

S T R Y K K E R

Guys,as you can see my gear is mixed

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am I missing out on sound quality with my having all R150's for surrounds and monitors for L/C/R......the R150's have 3/4 tweeters while monitors have 1" TWEETERS...would I get better sound if I got Monitor 30's instead or should I save my cash for something else?

Zeros

S T R Y K K E R wrote: »

Guys,as you can see my gear is mixed

---

am I missing out on sound quality with my having all R150's for surrounds and monitors for L/C/R......the R150's have 3/4 tweeters while monitors have 1" TWEETERS...would I get better sound if I got Monitor 30's instead or should I save my cash for something else?

I would say that you are fine. The most important thing is that your L/C/R match.

tonyb

I think your confused as to what a center channel is suppose to do. A big part of movie soundtracks,the sound is supposed to come out of the center. I think a bigger center may match up better with the fronts, but the majority of the sound will still come out of the center. You could always just run without a center if you like the majority of the sound to come from the front left and right speakers. Just adjust the speaker setup,and spend the coin on upgrading something else. Just an option is all, your original post states you didn't like the sound just comming from the center. A bigger center won't change that.

S T R Y K K E R

Zeros wrote: »

I would say that you are fine. The most important thing is that your L/C/R match.

Butttttt what if i had the 30's in place of R150's what difference would it make????

runrabbitrun79

Ok, so I'm getting two options from you guys:
Match the RM8 center w/ the RM8 surrounds, and use the R150s as rear surround (set to LARGE)
Or match the R150s w/ the CSR center.

I'm confused on two things:
If I leave the setup as is, do I leave the center Rm8 to SMALL? What surround setting do I use for the receiver? I understand it's an entry level receiver.

Here's the setup:
Sony STR-DH510 receiver.
pair of Polk Audio R150 speakers for my L/R channels
Polk Audio RM8 center channel

Wendelman

Rabbit, I meant to use the R150s as the mains-set to large, and the RM8s as the center and surrounds-set to small. I think you will really enjoy the sound dispersion created by the surrounds; they bounce sounds off the walls when set up correctly, and fill the room with effects (w/ digital inputs from multi-ch sources, DVD, BluRay, etc, just use the HDMI pass-through on your receiver). That being said, the RM8s arent going to give you much low or midrange response, so you are much better off with the larger R150s for you fronts.

I am not familiar with the DSPs that your Sony has, but setting your digital input to AUTO should select Dolby Digital, DTS, PCM, etc depending on the source. For analog inputs, just mess around with all of them and find what sounds best to you. I usually find Studio Mix provides a full and balanced effect.

Wendelman

Strykker, Zeros is right about your L/R/C being the most imp. How big is your Man Cave? Thats a nice, big beefy AVR, how does it do heat wise when driving all 9 ch (and vc)? Whats your Xover set at? It sounds like you are hoping to upgrade/add components soon eh? I'd go with the new amp for now, but as long as everything sounds good too you, stick to what you have for now and dont worry about the different drivers. Your L/R/C are matched, and the surrounds all match, so it should all blend nicely.

runrabbitrun79

Wendelman,
Thanks for the advice. I don't hear much difference between the SMALL and LARGE setting for the center. I get mixed advice on that since I don't have a sub. Some say LARGE cause I don't have the sub, some say SMALL because of the speaker. Which one is it?
Here are sound field options for my receiver:
http://www.sonystyle.com/wcsstore/SonyStyleStorefrontAssetStore/pdf/warranty/SEL-asset-185311.pdf

AFD Audio mode does not output to the center. So for now, I changed the mode to PLII MV (Pro Logic II Movie). Is this the best setting? I am at the point where I can't tell (not an expert).

Also, I thought it was important to match the L/C/R.

Wendelman

The RM8 center only has 2.5" midrange drivers, and freq response will not likely be lower than 100hz, if that. So I would set it to small, which means your AVR will not send the lower (and most power thirsty) signals to that channel (do you know what the crossover is set at, and did it come with a calibration mic?). This will put less strain on the amp and free up some capacity to send a stronger signal to your R150s (set to large). It looks like your AVR has a good amount of calibration options, so if you dont use or like the mic's setting, you can adjust the speaker levels(+/- dBs), distance/parameter, EQ, DSP level (max, std, min) and even the crossover for the F/R, C and surrounds separately (40-200Hz, 10Hz intervals, 120Hz factory setting). I would play around with these a bit a well.

Are you interested in a small sub (like the PSW10 for $89 on amazon)? I think adding that sub and the RM8 surrounds (for under $200 w/free shipping!) would be a HUGE upgrade at a very low cost. What sources are you using (cable box, DVD, etc) and how are they connected (HDMI, optical, analog, etc)? Do you use the system for mainly TV and movies, or music?

runrabbitrun79

The AVR did not come with a mic. The connections are as follows: Cable box and PS3 to the TV through HDMI cables, and the receiver to the tv through Digital Optical.

I use it for both movies and music. The music settings are a nobrainer for me. I use 2 channel for the music.

I did not see anything about crossover in the manual. You would figure the default settings would be the best. I honestly thing there are too many sound field options. I just want to make sure the this PLII MV (Pro Logic II Movie) setting is the best one.

Not planning on getting a sub (right now at least). Maybe the surrounds eventually.

Wendelman

Ok nice, well I am curious, have you ever tried running the HDMI inputs through the AVR and then to the TV? I would def rec doing this for the PS3 to get the best quality signal to your speakers. Optical cables can not transfer the newer, higher-bandwidth formats (LPCM)-actually it looks like it does not support the Dolby TrueHD, dts HD, etc, maybe there is a firmware update?. I'd run the cable box through the Sony too; easier source switching, less cabels, etc.

Try that using an HD source, set Digital Sounds mode to Auto and it should switch to a Dolby Digital format or something similar. If not, browse the surround sound formats to see if you can find it (make sure cable box/PS3 audio out setting are in "pass-through" or auto modes). So see how that sounds, if it is not working or you dont like it, the Pro Logic DSP modes are pretty good. But most importantly, just go with what sounds best to you!

runrabbitrun79

I'll give it a try. Do you think I could still use the optical connection from the tv to the receiver?

and HDMIs from the cable box and ps3 to the receiver? Or, do I have to get another HDMI cable for the tv to receiver connection?

You can see the audio modes for the receiver in the manual. None of them sent signals to all three speakers. I'm not sure there's a mode you're talking about.

I'm not sure what you mean by this either: (make sure cable box/PS3 audio out setting are in "pass-through" or auto modes).

Wendelman

Why do you want the optical connection from the TV to the receiver, do you have any other sources inputing directly to TV? And if you are using HDMI 1.4 cables they have an audio return channel (ARC) built in. If you have another cable, just run both the PS3 and cable box HDMIs into the receiver, and then one from the receiver to the TV. Then switching sources on the receiver will also switch the TVs video.

Do you have the speaker selection on the AVR set to 3/0 (L/R/C)? if it is, most of the DSP modes will send signals to all three, and it will show up on the AVR display which speakers are active. Personally, I never thought a 3/0 setup gives a better sound from most sources (maybe for Blu-Rays). I always preferred listening in Stereo or 5 or 7.1. But give it a try, its up to you. Another nice thing about the RM8 surrounds is the included wall mounts, barely taking up any space, and look nice too boot!

For the cable box/PS3 settings, just go into the audio setup setting and make sure they are not set to 2ch or even "tv speakers" if that is an option. you want them to output the audio through the HDMI in a native, digital format. Usually a factory setting, such as AUTO, but just thought it would be worth it to double check. Good Luck!

runrabbitrun79

Thank you for the advice. I think I'll get another HDMI and try that hookup without the optical. I was doing a little research on it. People have different opinions, but most say HDMI is the best connection.

The speaker pattern is set correctly at 3.0. I do notice a difference between the 3.0 and 2.0. But as was stated before, the L/R do lose a little presence when the center is added.

I think I am noticing a difference with the PLII MV (Pro Logic II Movie) mode. I'll let you know how it goes.

runrabbitrun79

Ok, I just wanted to post to give feedback on the different settings I tried. The best connection is through all HDMI cables into the receiver. The manual for my receiver specifically has settings for the PS3 as well. The optimal sound setting, according to the manual as well, is Cinema Studio EX B. Depending on which dvd, cd or game is in the PS3, the receiver decodes the best sound for it. DTS is even used when the media supports it. Dolby Pro Logic II does not output as much as the other setting.

Here's the setup right now:
Sony STR-DH510 receiver.
pair of Polk Audio R150 speakers for my L/R channels (set to large)
Polk Audio RM8 center channel

In the future I may add a subwoofer and/or 2 RM8 surrounds. Does anyone think I should move the R150s to the rear so the L/C/R match or use the RM8s as rear surrounds?

Thank you for all your advice, thus far.

icslowmo

I would keep your R150's for the L/R channels as you have them and later get the RM8's for rear's.

Set channels as:

L/R (R150's) - Large

Center (RM8) - small

Rear channels (RM8's when you get them) - small

Hope this helps, also you can play with adjusting each channel level to what sounds best for you as well..

runrabbitrun79

Hi,

I was thinking of upgrading this. What would sound better: to match the R150 L/R with a CSR for center and have RM8 for surrounds or keep my RM8 center and R150 L/R and add RM8 surrounds?

Here's the setup:
Sony STR-DH510 receiver.
pair of Polk Audio R150 speakers for my L/R channels
Polk Audio RM8 center channel