just courious about svs

dave shepard

I'm pretty close to getting the wife to agree on an svs but not until I get her a new couch set for the living room (they always want something). I have heard alot about the pb2+ and other models except the b4+. At $3500 w/amp it seems better to get 2-pb2+'s and save in the process. Has anybody heard or seen one of these monsters. Just curios.

Thanks Dave

Tour2ma

Seen pics only. Maybe Doc has heard one...

Better question is, What are your needs? What is the volume of your listening area? Size and number of opening off of it?

The options you are taking about will fill sizeable rooms, i.e., in the 3000 to 4000 cu ft range. Do you need that much sub?

SVS will help you figure out what you need. Of course if you still want more, they might oblige you...

Dr. Spec

I agree with Tour - the B4-Plus is designed for REALLY large rooms - like 7,000-10,000 ft3.

That's not saying it won't work in a smaller room - it will. It will just be majorly underutilized.

Much of the cost of the B4-Plus comes from the furniture grade finish. Two PB2+'s for $2,500 is of course a better performance value if you are looking to put up really big numbers for the least amount of $$ and hassle.

Will dual PB2+ exceed a single B4+? Tom V has been kicking that thought around and the current wisdom is that the B4+ might still nose out the duals due to the push pull design, which adds output compared to 4 outward firing drivers. It would be a close contest though, and it would take a pretty brave soul to reach the limits of either dual PB2+ or a B4+.

To help you pick the right SVS for your particular needs and application, please provide:

- room dimensions

- ceiling height

- describe any permanent openings and their location with respect to the proposed subwoofer location

- the distance from the proposed subwoofer location to the key listening positions

- your preferred playback volume for HT (moderate, loud, or REALLY room-shakingly loud)

- your listening tastes for music (mainly looking for source material with really deep subsonic content like pipe organ)

Doc

faster100

Some people, me included just don't realize the power of a really great sub, as for polk, you have to buy their top model to get close to good output and sound, Far as SVS its all a matter of room size and taste.. and cost doesnt really play a factor in which model is better to an extent, They all work great!! of course 600.00 - 4000.00 range with the later being the "best" may be to much for ones room, Give Doc the specs and he will "spec" it out for ya!!

howie777

My understanding for dual subs vs a bigger one is as follows. Depending on your room you may end up with "dead spots" where all the bass is absorbed by funiture or other objects in the room. So a second sub could be used to eliminate those dead spots by positioning it in the room so its dead spots are not the same as the first subs so your room is covered.

So the output might be better with the PB4 but you might never actually go that high and with two PB2+s you could elimintate any dead spots.

This is what I have heard from someone (maybe a sales guy looking to sell two subs, I dont remember) but it could be a reason to go 2 vs 1 bigger sub.

Howie

Tour2ma

howie,

This is nost often spouted by sellers of sub-sat sub's, i.e., sub's that reach up in frequency to blend with satellite speakers, not true subs that finish their business below 100 Hz.

True bass is not absorbed to a significant degree by furnishings, etc. However, it is reflected by surfaces and can create "dead spots" or cancellation zones. Equally, hot spots or reinforcing zones will likely be created as well. Adding a second sub complicates bass management significantly and can actually add to the number of both these "zones".

Better than adding a second sub, moving the one to minimize such zones is normally the better solution.

tryrrthg

My understanding is that 1 sub can excite modes in the room that cause dips or peaks, adding a second sub can excite more modes and help even out bass peaks and dips. The second sub helps excite room modes more evenly, or so is my understanding... maybe doc can chime in here...

I would go out of my way to try and find better placement with one sub before trying to place two subs. placing one can be hard enough...

Harman White paper on sub(s) placement

kberg

All I can say is that if I were to even suggest to my wife the possibility of adding a second 20-39 PC+, I'd be a dead man.

Tour2ma

Originally posted by tryrrthg
... adding a second sub can excite more modes and help even out bass peaks and dips.

"Can" is the little big word here. As you said later in your post, it ain't easy. It's one of the reasons that stacking twin subs has been suggested often around here. Co-location makes the two act like one, or very close to one, when it comes to room interactions...

dave shepard

my room size is 19x25x9. on the 25ft wall I have a 7ft. archway leading to a 19x19 dining room 5ft next to the archway is a french door, on the other 25ft wall are 2 french doors each are 5ft in from there respective corners, on one 19ft wall is the landing for the stairs to the second story, the other 19ft wall is where I have the big screen facing accross the room which is were I have my lazy-boy. I'm sure the pb2+ will make me slack jawed and that is the one I'm leaning towards I just was courious about the b4 I keep seeing it on there web and both make me drool. I will be getting my wife her couch set next week for our anniversary as a suprise I only hope she'll suprise me (but somehow I think it will be a suprise to and form me). My walls are plaster too if that helps.

Thanks dave

Tour2ma

4275 cu ft in main room plus another 3250 through the opening is some pretty serious size.

I'll have to defer to Doc and.or SVS, but you may well be in "4" territory.

Hope those are some sturdy french doors...

Dr. Spec

You didn't answer the rest of the questions, primarily about playback volume and HT/music preferences. Hard to say what sub you need. A PC+ or a PB1+ or a PB2-ISD might be fine, depending.

dave shepard

I listen to it at what my wife feels is a little loud but not as loud as a bar room dj would play. Mostly (90%) it is used for HT or just watching TV. I'm looking for a good base sound when I do play music (no favorite style) and most importantly felt rumble when playing movies. Will a pb2+ overwelm my speakers I have now? (rm7200 set W/202). I will be upgrading them later now I want SVS.

Dr. Spec

It's not really a matter of overwhelming the other speakers. Proper calibration will take care of that; you could use a B4+ and it wouldn't matter from that aspect.

It's really a matter of will the 7200 speakers and your AVR keep up with the SVS as the volume increases and continue to deliver clean sound without strain or clipping. That I can't answer, but I suspect they will do fine for now.

If your wife keeps things at the comfortably loud or lower level, I'm thinking PB2-ISD, 20-39 PC-Plus, or PB1-Plus for that size room. If you really envision belting it out in the future, go for the PB2-Plus.

Confirm with Ron S or Tom V on the recommendation.

Regards,

Doc

dave shepard

Thanks Doc I e-mailed svs and gave them the size and discription of my room and explained the way I listen to HT and Eric suggested the pb2+ would do for the felt base I'm looking for. So now it's been put on the top of the list. Thanks for all your time and help.

Thanks again

Dave